John Tavares or Ryan O'Reilly

[LeafsNation75]

That's basically it in a nutshell. If you are picking one over the other right now. You look at the offensive stats, and you look at the defensive stats. And surmising both are still close, you look at hardware and contracts.

But let's just look at the stats from this season. We don't even need to go into the hardware of both players.

The defensive and offensive metrics would be very telling. Not only did O'Reilly outproduce Tavares offensively 5v5 this season, he was almost a goal and half better defensively. All one has to do is look at the stats. O'Reilly last season was better offensively 5v5 than Tavares, and he was much better defensively. It is much harder to put up points playing good defence but ROR did anyway.

Tavares 5v5 GA60 3.34
O'Reilly 5v5 GA60 1.95

Advantage O'Reilly.

O'Reilly GF60 5v5 3.07
Tavares GF60 5v5v 2.79

Advantage O'Reilly

Actual points.

O'Rielly 61 points
Tavares 60 points

Advantage O'Reilly abeit in 8 more games.

In a hypothetical scenario if Tavares does not miss any games this season due to injury does he end up with more points then O'Reilly? Their stats the previous seasons shows that was most likely to happen and he outscored him by 14 goals despite playing less games.

 

[Michel Beauchamp]

remembver the leafs gave up 0 assets to acquire tavares.

Really ?

Cap isn't an asset ?

What a beautiful world you live in !

 

[Dache]

It was some people's way of bashing Tavares for leaving the Islanders and to make Barzal the better player, even though they never admitted how he outscored him by 1 point and the fact Tavares scored 15 more goals that season.

So kind of like your way of bashing O’Reilly by only mentioning total points and nothing to do with his selke or defence in general?

 

[Dache]

In a hypothetical scenario if Tavares does not miss any games this season due to injury does he end up with more points then O'Reilly? Their stats the previous seasons shows that was most likely to happen and he outscored him by 14 goals despite playing less games.

Here we go again. Sometimes only actual points count, sometimes we can assume what would happen if they played all the games.

 

[LeafsNation75]

So kind of like your way of bashing O’Reilly by only mentioning total points and nothing to do with his selke or defence in general?

I have said history shows Tavares was the better point producer compared to O'Reilly and this past season just because O'Reilly outscored him by 1 point doesn't add to the fact that some consider him a better player, since Tavares didn't play in every game possible.

 

[Michel Beauchamp]

Columbus can also be thankful for their 15 overtime/shootout loses which was the most in the NHL to get them where they currently to have a chance.

And what about the Leafs 9 OT/SO losses ?

 

[Michel Beauchamp]

Would you still choose Tavares if he didn’t score more than 20 goals but still played for the leafs?
You can’t change certain things about the player in an attempt to get the answer you want

Not nice, but I like it...

 

[McVespa99]

Why do you always come across like you've been personally slighted by poll results? No need to throw tantrums if the poll/thread doesn't go the way you feel.

Over the last three seasons - ROR PPG is 0.85 versus 1.02 for JT, JT is ahead by 19.5%. ROR is much better defensively. Whether that makes him equal to JT is another question, I think JT is a slightly better player right now.

Unfortunately, the league just ratified a flat cap for the next three years. JT is tied for the 5th highest cap hit in the league. The difference in contracts is $3.5 million, or 46.67%. If your premise is that JT is better offensively (which he is), but that overall this makes JT a slightly better player (which I think it does) - how do you reconcile that the difference is a 46.67% higher contract? If he is 19.5%-25% better offensively, and that's offset because of him being worse defensively - he can't be 30-40% better of a player.

ROR contract ends with the flat cap. JT is signed two more years, so although term favours JT, his contract isn't good in the short term, and the short term may result in teams have to blow things up or restructure. I would absolutely rather have ROR going forward. If the poll was, go back in time and pick the guy you wanted to draft, then it would be JT and I have no problem admitting that. Nothing to do with anti-leaf, but the league environment and time frames don't sit in JT's favour, and although I think he is the very slightly better player, he's not so much better that I would want to Oilers to inherit 11 million in cap, rather than 7.5 million in cap.

I agree with pretty much everything in this post except the bolded. To me the fact that JT is signed longer is a negative and not a positive so to me term also favors ROR. JT is certainly the more talented offensive player but when taking contracts and overall play into account I take ROR pretty easily. I have always said and will continue to say I think the JT signing was a big mistake. The Leafs would have been much better off spending that money on D.

 

[Green Snow Storm]

I respect O'Reilly a ton, amazing player. Just looking at who I'd rather have, Tavares is a superior player, clearly. When factoring in contracts it becomes closer, but I'd say still Tavares by a much slimmer margin than if contracts were ignored.

 

[LeafsNation75]

I agree with pretty much everything in this post except the bolded. To me the fact that JT is signed longer is a negative and not a positive so to me term also favors ROR. JT is certainly the more talented offensive player but when taking contracts and overall play into account I take ROR pretty easily. I have always said and will continue to say I think the JT signing was a big mistake. The Leafs would have been much better off spending that money on D.

You are forgetting that both Tavares and O'Reilly each signed 7 year contracts.

The difference is O'Reilly signed his in 2015 and Tavares signed his in 2018.

So obviously by default O'Reilly's contract looks shorter compared to Tavares.

 

[Bizzare]

You are forgetting that both Tavares and O'Reilly each signed 7 year contracts.

The difference is O'Reilly signed his in 2015 and Tavares signed his in 2018.

So obviously by default O'Reilly's contract looks shorter compared to Tavares.

This is completely irrelevant to the poll question.

 

[LeafsNation75]

This is completely irrelevant to the poll question.

It's still relevant because both of them signed 7 year contracts. The difference that was three years apart when that happened.

 

[Bizzare]

It's still irrelevant because both of them signed 7 year contracts. The difference that was three years apart when that happened.

I agree, it’s still irrelevant.

 

[Ace Card Bedard]

Put them head to head.

ROR shuts Tavares down.

 

[Sky04]

Put them head to head.

ROR shuts Tavares down.

Does JT turn the puck over to ROR for the OT winner like he did today?

 

[Lambo]

-----------

 

[DueDiligence]

I have said history shows Tavares was the better point producer compared to O'Reilly and this past season just because O'Reilly outscored him by 1 point doesn't add to the fact that some consider him a better player, since Tavares didn't play in every game possible.

One is a winner one is not. I'll take the winner, ROR.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Does JT turn the puck over to ROR for the OT winner like he did today?

It was a very poor decision to take a hope shot at that point in OT, and to get caught on an odd man rush. It was a losing play that cost his team the game.

 

[Sky04]

In the Poll best 30 Players Tavares leads with 36:16

Here leads O'Rielly 233:146 currently

You do know those polls are asking different questions right........?

 

[Oilers Propagandist]

In the Poll best 30 Players Tavares leads with 36:16

Here leads O'Rielly 233:146 currently

Ok now read the OP.

 

[Holymakinaw]

Tavares proving again in the last few playoff games that he is still an elite, top-10 Centre in the NHL.........as opposed to O'Reilly.

FOR THE WIN.

 

[Isaac Nootin]

Does JT turn the puck over to ROR for the OT winner like he did today?

Nope, too busy setting up Matthews for the OT winner.

 

[Iapyi]

You also have the largest fan base, by far, on the forum or otherwise. so if you can't rally to win the poll, maybe it's because even some leafs fans think RoR is better, because he is. When taking all facets of the game into consideration.

Leafs fans thought Bozak and a 2nd was enough for RoR back when he was an Av so I'll always remember how little leafs fans, either have actually watched RoR play, or don't understand the fundamentals of hockey and all of its facets.

Big reason no one who has an inkling about the sport along with common sense is ever going to take polls like this on this forum with a grain of seriousness.

Let's all "rally" together and go vote for the Maple Leaf [or whatever team] to win the poll!!!!! What an entirely contradictory and yes childish mindset.

The fans of a team are NOT a team within itself. If so what exactly would be the point?

btw & fyi no matter the size of any fanbase the combining of thirty-one (31) other fan bases in this silly rallying game you apparently play is going to win the #s game.

What an absolute insult to the integrity of this forum.

 

[McVespa99]

You are forgetting that both Tavares and O'Reilly each signed 7 year contracts.

The difference is O'Reilly signed his in 2015 and Tavares signed his in 2018.

So obviously by default O'Reilly's contract looks shorter compared to Tavares.[/QUOTE

In comparison the length of the contracts does not matter. Its which contract ends first and what age the player is in the final years. McDavid's 8 year contract is a beauty. If he signed an 8 year contract at 36 not so much....

 

[LeafsNation75]

Nope, too busy setting up Matthews for the OT winner.

Tavares also scored the Leafs 2nd goal cutting the Blue Jackets lead to 3-2.