News Article: Jimmy Howard extension coming (Maybe/Maybe not)

[Ezekial]

As most everyone is saying 2 year max. 3.5-3.75 max, not signed to an extension before March.

 

[Ghost of Ethan Hunt]

No way he gets a better contract than Rinne got. If he does, then I will seriously question Holland's sanity, not that I haven't questioned it yet.

"Start to question KH's sanity" that ship has sailed my friend & done several tours of duty around the globe 5+ years running.

I'm positive it'll be at least 2 yrs., probably 3 yrs., very slim chance of 4 yrs. Rinne singing a reasonable contract for a Top tier goalie w/Vezina really helps in the negotiation. Also I said "~5"...so 4.5-4.9ish. Should be closer to 3-3.5, but it's "sane" KH afterall.

 

[Red Stanley]

I'm really curious to see how Jimmy does on a legit team, so I say trading him to one would be my ideal solution. One less spacegoat.

 

[Reddwit]

Statistically, Howard has been probably the 22nd best starter in the league for last 3 seasons.

22nd highest caphit for goalies is currently 4.25M .

I could handle that short-term, but I would still go hard after Bobrovsky.

How do you define "starter?" And based on what stats?

Asking because "starter" and "statistically" are very vague terms but "22nd best" is extremely specific. You could use all kinds of methodologies to determine that.

Hell, the top 30-31 goalies in the past 5 seasons have played a bare minimum of 40 games (37 starts) . Howard hasn't even played enough in the 2/3 of the past 3 seasons to statistically qualify as a starter.

 

[Steve Yzerlland]

Red Wings keep sending mixed signals about rebuild

 

[Invictus12]

Red Wings keep sending mixed signals about rebuild

There is so much fail in that article... And it starts with the headline.

 

[Steve Yzerlland]

There is so much fail in that article... And it starts with the headline.

No, it starts with the management.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

What good are we for Varly or Bob? And what good are they for us? By the time we are good enough to push they will not be.

Bobrovsky is different than Varlamov as far as I am concerned. Bob is a top 5 goalie on most nights, a real difference maker. I get not wanting to pay a goalie a lot though. Bob can will a team to playoff contention like most top 5 goalies. That is the difference to me.

 

[Syckle78]

Bob is a regular season superstar. No fn thanks on paying a goalie what he is going to get that can't win when it matters. There's a reason cbus isn't paying their award winning goalie.

 

[Reddwit]

I dont get the Bernier signing st all now... if Howard gets 4 or 5 mil.. that's once again a large chunk for 2 goalies on a rebuilding team... you need to eventually bring in some youth in that area and allow them to develop. A guy like Robin Lehner would have been fine as he has potential still.. someone in the mid 20s. I dont get this move at all with Bernier already signed.. not saying Howie isnt a decent goalie. Just dont see how it fits our plans in any form.

Ever since Lehner came out about his undiagnosed bipolar disorder/addiction to sleeping pills and booze, I've been really interested in seeing if he'll bounce back. So far, it looks rehab did great things for him. Was really hoping he was on the Wings radar this season. His upside and age are really intriguing.

 

[chances14]

how exactly is re signing howard to an extension delaying a rebuild? the wings don't have a single goalie prospect that is even close to sniffing the nhl for at least the next 2 seasons.

 

[golffuul]

2-3 years at 3.4M is fine. At the most, a 10 team list he won’t be traded to.

 

[saska sault]

Still dont understand how people are fine with any extension... yes he is better than Bernier. But we are rebuilding.. give Bernier a chance. Trade Howard while he has any value and sign 2 potential low risk back ups in the offseason.. or get a waiver pick up.. anything.. we are not competing anytime soon and Bernier can split time with someone.

Or is Holland thinking.. hey we have the worst cap situation and Stevie Y is breathing down my back.. maybe I can make it even worse and he will never take over?

 

[kliq]

Still dont understand how people are fine with any extension... yes he is better than Bernier. But we are rebuilding.. give Bernier a chance. Trade Howard while he has any value and sign 2 potential low risk back ups in the offseason.. or get a waiver pick up.. anything.. we are not competing anytime soon and Bernier can split time with someone.

Or is Holland thinking.. hey we have the worst cap situation and Stevie Y is breathing down my back.. maybe I can make it even worse and he will never take over?

I completely understand the notion that people want to acquire as many assets as possible for the re-build, so for that I won't argue.

As far as the bold goes, your first bold is precisely why the second bold does not matter. Unless you think we are ready to compete, cap means nothing unless you are losing valuable pieces because of it, which we are not.

I dont really understand the reason why we are signing Jimmy now, the only thing I can think of is if Howard is willing to sign at a discount if we sign him now opposed to July 1st.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Bob is a regular season superstar. No fn thanks on paying a goalie what he is going to get that can't win when it matters. There's a reason cbus isn't paying their award winning goalie.

Cbus will pay him, he won't sign there. Playing the last three Stanley Cup Champs in the first round isn't the easiest draw either in terms of the guy cannot win...

 

[Reddwit]

how exactly is re signing howard to an extension delaying a rebuild? the wings don't have a single goalie prospect that is even close to sniffing the nhl for at least the next 2 seasons.

I can't find anything in this thread or the article that says this signing would "delay" a rebuild. Did I miss something?

And its not a choice between Howard and our prospects. That's a false dichotomy. Its almost NHL law that goalies frequently come out of nowhere and show major potential, rise through the ranks unexpectedly, or become starters. Locking yourself up with 2 30+ goalies who are known, mediocre quantities during a rebuild is bananas. Now is the time to experiment in net, especially when we already have a veteran goalie for the next 2 years.

Also, if he's good enough to get a contract for his 35+ years now, then he's good enough to warrant dangling periodically throughout the season. Hold off.

Lastly, the Wings have been good to him for his entire career, yet he's rarely been better than average in return. They've given him 14 years worth of salaries and $40.6M. If he loves the organization so much, he can hold off until March to re-sign and sign off on a trade for the betterment of his beloved organization if it comes to that.

I'm really getting sick of this organization bending over backwards for mediocre veterans who don't even, at the very f***ing least, provide any entertainment value.

 

[izlez]

Surprise! Everyone has a plan to make the team worse at hockey, without a plan to ever make it better, while claiming they know more than the GM.

"Guys come out of no where. Throw some **** at a wall and see what sticks" is not a viable plan.

 

[Heaton]

Surprise! Everyone has a plan to make the team worse at hockey, without a plan to ever make it better, while claiming they know more than the GM.

"Guys come out of no where. Throw some **** at a wall and see what sticks" is not a viable plan.

I don't think that's true at all. In this case, getting worse is getting better.

As for Howard, we're obviously not going to get better with a Howard/Bernier tandem long term, but short-term it doesn't matter since they're not good enough to win enough games to delay the rebuild.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

I can't find anything in this thread or the article that says this signing would "delay" a rebuild. Did I miss something?

And its not a choice between Howard and our prospects. That's a false dichotomy. Its almost NHL law that goalies frequently come out of nowhere and show major potential, rise through the ranks unexpectedly, or become starters. Locking yourself up with 2 30+ goalies who are known, mediocre quantities during a rebuild is bananas. Now is the time to experiment in net, especially when we already have a veteran goalie for the next 2 years.

Also, if he's good enough to get a contract for his 35+ years now, then he's good enough to warrant dangling periodically throughout the season. Hold off.

Lastly, the Wings have been good to him for his entire career, yet he's rarely been better than average in return. They've given him 14 years worth of salaries and $40.6M. If he loves the organization so much, he can hold off until March to re-sign and sign off on a trade for the betterment of his beloved organization if it comes to that.

I'm really getting sick of this organization bending over backwards for mediocre veterans who don't even, at the very ****ing least, provide any entertainment value.

Hey, how did that last goalie who "came out of nowhere" do? Since we're throwing out anecdotal evidence and all.

Also, now is the time you want STABILITY in net, not an experiment. The rest of the team is going to suck. The way you can tell if the forwards and D can cut it is if you have a control in net. If you had Vesa Toskala who couldn't save a beach ball, could you say for certain that your defense was awful and needed to be updated?

I do agree that there shouldn't be any rush to get him to sign today... but if you want him to potentially take 2x3 or 2x3.5, you probably offer it to him and his team now as a courtesy as opposed to looking to deal him and then saying, we can loop back before FA. You try to deal him and fail and he walks out the door or demands a raise to stay, I'd bet.

To end, what the ****? They've been average to him. 5.3M is average starter money. And really, they've been pretty average to him.

I'm really getting sick of this "We have to suck at all costs and literally trade everyone who isn't nailed down" narrative. Maybe it's just because I'm a goalie, but Howard actually provides some entertainment value for me. He's actually pretty nimble in net and has some solid positioning. I mean, ****ing damn it, if you have an exciting goalie... like a truthfully exciting goalie? You have a ****ty goalie OR you have a generational best of all time goalie who redefines his position like Hasek. 99% of the time, the exciting goalie is the goalie who's really bad at hockey.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

I don't think that's true at all. In this case, getting worse is getting better.

As for Howard, we're obviously not going to get better with a Howard/Bernier tandem long term, but short-term it doesn't matter since they're not good enough to win enough games to delay the rebuild.

And we're not talking about signing Howard for another 4-5 years. The whole discussion is to keep him for a couple more. If the contract is 4x5, then yeah, anyone in here defending it will lose their fudge. But there is nothing supporting the Wings or even Howard going for that outside of the negative drivers of this board hating everything that Holland touches.

 

[ShelbyZ]

I'm really getting sick of this organization bending over backwards for mediocre veterans who don't even, at the very ****ing least, provide any entertainment value.

I guess that depends on what someone finds "entertaining" or who the team is trying to entertain? I'd argue that Howards play thus far has provided entertainment since he's kept them in and stolen games they had no business even coming close to winning.

The average fan isn't going to be "entertained" for long if the team rolls the dice on an unproven Bernier and another experiment in net and gets regularly blown out and even more unwatchable.

Now is the time to experiment in net, especially when we already have a veteran goalie for the next 2 years.

They are. Unfortunately it's with the still unproven veteran signed for 2 more years that you're referring to.

 

[Heaton]

And we're not talking about signing Howard for another 4-5 years. The whole discussion is to keep him for a couple more. If the contract is 4x5, then yeah, anyone in here defending it will lose their fudge. But there is nothing supporting the Wings or even Howard going for that outside of the negative drivers of this board hating everything that Holland touches.

I think a big problem is going to be the $$ Howard will get, which will definitely impact the Wings ability to sign players. Odds are he gets around the same $$ or more for the few years he gets re-signed, when in reality he shouldn't be getting that much.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

I think a big problem is going to be the $$ Howard will get, which will definitely impact the Wings ability to sign players. Odds are he gets around the same $$ or more for the few years he gets re-signed, when in reality he shouldn't be getting that much.

Is there a precedent for this?

 

[Frk It]

Is there a precedent for this?

Is there a precedent for someone re-signing at a discount?

Quincey didn’t. Green didn’t. Helm didn’t. Vanek is making more than the first time he was here.

I can’t think of one, really.

 

[ShelbyZ]

I think a big problem is going to be the $$ Howard will get, which will definitely impact the Wings ability to sign players. Odds are he gets around the same $$ or more for the few years he gets re-signed, when in reality he shouldn't be getting that much.

If it's too much sure, but IMO the previously mentioned Rinne signing likely means Howards cap hit ends up a good bit lower than what it is currently.

I disagree that it will *definitely* have impact on signing players unless it ends up real long term. Over a hypothetical two year extension, the team potentially has Kronwall, Nyquist, Vanek, Daley and Ericsson coming off the books and the only extensions they'll have to dole out that will be of size will be to AA, Mantha and Bertuzzi. On top of that guys like Cholowski, Rasmussen and Hronek won't need extensions till after that hypothetical 2 year extension to Howard is done, as well as Berniers contract. Franzens deal also comes off the books, giving them more flexibility with signings while they can go over the cap in the summer. And obviously the cap is going to increase as well.

They'll have plenty to extend guys that need to be re-signed and have more left over to be tempted by the Vaneks and Daleys of the world.

IMO, the Bernier signing will have more of an impact, especially if they already had it made up that the chances of them not extending Howard were slim when they made that signing.