Jeff Skinner - $9M healthy scratch

[explore]

That’s not “skewed”, it’s a 40 goal season. Goals scored at the beginning and end of the season count the same. And so do wins.

Notably, the Sabres were 22-13-6 through their first 41 games of 2018-19. Since then, they’re 46-62-18. I’m no math whiz, but I’d be more interested in replicating those 41 games than anything that came after it.



Which is why it’s absolutely bizarre to bury the guy and ensure that the cold streak continues.

What is the goal here? To win hockey games, or to punish Jeff Skinner for accepting a contract?

Well, the 40-goal season is skewed since that's what it means when half of his goals were scored during the first 27 games of the season and he barely scored the last half of the season. That's just what the term means statistically. I'm not denying that he scored 40 goals, or saying that they don't count, I'm just pointing out that Skinner was playing unsustainably for the early part of the season and it was clearly an outlier.

Secondly, I think as a Canes fan, you should know better than me, but wasn't Skinner sent off to the third/fourth line by Canes coaches as well?

At least for the Sabres, I think the issue is Skinner doesn't like to adapt to play within a system, he just does his own thing like Evander Kane; and a player like Skinner is going to frustrate coaches trying to implement a system by not listening and doing whatever he wants.

As a coach, it's a lose-lose situation. If you give in to Skinner and let him do what he wants, the other players will take note of that, and he may in fact cause chaos by doing random stuff and staying out longer than he should. If you send Skinner off to an island, then you lose any hypothetical goals or offense he creates because you haven't surrounded him with other players who'd generate offense that Skinner could potentially score on.

Either way, Skinner needs to be bought out and Krueger needs to be replaced, but even if Krueger is replaced I don't see how a competent coach like Trotz or Gallant or Boudreau doesn't bench Skinner when he doesn't listen.

 

[smokes lets go]

What happens to 99% of players who get contracts based on a career year when they're in line for a new contract. They revert to normal.

He wasn't even good the whole season. If I recall correctly he was on an absolute tear for the first half but the offense evaporated in the 2nd half of the season. Buffalo still decided to go ahead and offer that contract despite this warning sign. Everyone and their mother knew this contract was doomed from the get-go.

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

It's going to take some time and probably a new coach for him to find his niche on a winning team. His optimal usage is as a sheltered 3rd line driver that elevates a couple Middle 6 types; $9 mil is too much to spend on a non-elite wing with his warts for a $10 mil center. Buffalo may have been convinced to give that contract because of 40 goals, but it was built on the 37 he scored with Stempniak/Rask/Ryan 2 years prior.

Kessel was used in a similar way in the first of Pittsburgh's back to back cups. That's going to require a 1st or 2nd line to assume the tough matchups. I look at Buffalo's roster and don't see the right mix of players to make that set-up work at this time. Adams has some surgery to do to make Buffalo harder to player against.

 

[Crazy Cizikas]

From my understanding, he's looked bad with bad players and most buffalo fans are aggravated Ralph won't play him with Jack or Staal.

Could be wrong don't quote me.

This is brutal though that he's scratched.

At $9m, he’s supposed to rise above the excuse of playing with bad linemates. He should make his linemates be better.

 

[tsujimoto74]

Haven’t been paying attention to the Sabres. Has he looked as bad as the stats indicate? 1 assist in 14 games and a -1.

No, Kreuger's just had him in his doghouse all season. He set Skinner up to fail (played him on the 4th line) and then scratched him when he did.

 

[Guttersniped]

That’s not “skewed”, it’s a 40 goal season. Goals scored at the beginning and end of the season count the same. And so do wins.

Notably, the Sabres were 22-13-6 through their first 41 games of 2018-19. Since then, they’re 46-62-18. I’m no math whiz, but I’d be more interested in replicating those 41 games than anything that came after it.



Which is why it’s absolutely bizarre to bury the guy and ensure that the cold streak continues.

What is the goal here? To win hockey games, or to punish Jeff Skinner for accepting a contract?

You’re saying everything I was going more succinctly, I get that they have too many LW after Hall fell in their lap but WTF? All these public head-games about “playing the right way”, while really just complaining his production while undermining his actual opportunities to score. I get it, his contract is gross but the coach is being a creep. What do other players think of this drama? This is Taylor Hall’s favorite coach?

 

[rielledup]

You don't pay a guy with a career high 63 points 9 mil regardless if he's coming off of a 40 goal season.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

At $9m, he’s supposed to rise above the excuse of playing with bad linemates. He should make his linemates be better.

That's never been a part of his skillset though. He was/is a great player because he can create chances out of nothing all by himself, regardless of his linemates. But he's always had problems utilizing his linemates, even back when he played in Carolina.

There's a reason the Canes were willing to trade him and why they accepted such a low return. They knew what he brought to the ice, what his contract demands would likely be, and decided to let someone else overpay for him.

 

[Crazy Cizikas]

That's never been a part of his skillset though. He was/is a great player because he can create chances out of nothing all by himself, regardless of his linemates. But he's always had problems utilizing his linemates, even back when he played in Carolina.

There's a reason the Canes were willing to trade him and why they accepted such a low return. They knew what he brought to the ice, what his contract demands would likely be, and decided to let someone else overpay for him.

We can all agree that $9m is way too much for a player who plays an occasional role. This k will set Buffalo back for six more years. It’s very bad.

 

[Royale With Cheese]

Buffalo should raise it to $10 million a year. That’s sure to motivate him.

 

[Digital Kid]

As long as guys who overachieve, including those on ELCs, get paid extra on top of their contract amounts, sure.

I do like and agree with the sentiment generally, but I believe that is tougher to do with a salary cap than buying guys out who don't live up to expectations.

And when I say live up to expectations, I am talking about former 40 goal and 80 point guys who now provide 10 goals and 30 points.

 

[NK94]

No, Kreuger's just had him in his doghouse all season. He set Skinner up to fail (played him on the 4th line) and then scratched him when he did.

So was Skinner set up to fail when his production evaporated during the second half of the 2018-19 season too or? When Kreuger wasn't the head coach? Oh wait, he was still riding Eichel's coattails.

Nearly two full calendar years of third line production at a first line cost... blame Kreuger for wanting to hold him accountable though.

 

[Digital Kid]

Buffalo people help me understand the team hierarchy. Is Mrs Pegula the mastermind behind hockey operations? Came across that way in The Hockey News (back when they used to publish magazines).

Is it possible the Sabres will never succeed until the Pegulas sell the team to someone else who gets a hockey person in charge?

 

[MadLuke]

You don't pay a guy with a career high 63 points 9 mil regardless if he's coming off of a 40 goal season.

Not sure why the 2 millions more than Max Pacioretty type of money, not from is 0 playoff game pedigree, well I guess that if Pacioretty contract expired after one of is high scoring season instead he would have got the same.

 

[Zach716]

Yeah he’s been setup to fail and 1 point in 14 games is abysmal, but I have to be honest I have never seen someone so snakebitten in my life. Dude creates chances all by himself just hasn’t had any luck whatsoever. It’s absolutely bizarre at this point

He’s maybe 1 of 3 forwards on the entire team passing the eye test if you don’t check the stat sheet

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

His contract is so bad. Easily top five worst in the league. Potentially top 2-3.

 

[Barnum]

I do like and agree with the sentiment generally, but I believe that is tougher to do with a salary cap than buying guys out who don't live up to expectations.

And when I say live up to expectations, I am talking about former 40 goal and 80 point guys who now provide 10 goals and 30 points.

Wait, so you think owners should be able to take money away from players if they believe they haven’t lived up to their contract but feel as though it is too difficult to do it the other way around if a player overachieves his low ball contract?

Who decides if a player has underachieved or overachieved? The owner? Maybe some sort of board of trustees that make the decision? No, that wouldn’t lead to lawsuits and litigation...no way. It wouldn’t be that tough at all to take away salary from a player. Easy peasy.

Maybe we should do away with contracts altogether and just pay players by the game with incentives to score a goal for 5000 bucks, an assist for $2500, a hip check for $500, etc..

 

[MadLuke]

Wait, so you think owners should be able to take money away from players if they believe they haven’t lived up to their contract but feel as though it is too difficult to do it the other way around if a player overachieves his low ball contract?

The contract would be different, a la NFL, guarantee money versus option money.

Who decides if a player has underachieved or overachieved? The owner? Maybe some sort of board of trustees that make the decision? No, that wouldn’t lead to lawsuits and litigation...no way. It wouldn’t be that tough at all to take away salary from a player. Easy peasy.

A bit like a movie star signing option for multiple movies, if the team keep the player that mean they are not underachiever if they release them (and if they release them they still pay the guarantee money and the player can sign with a different team like a FA) that mean they do not get the extra in the contract.

It would certainly not team walking away from contract that didn't made that an option model, it would be how the league and contract wording work.

 

[JT Kreider]

One day the NHL will figure out that in the next agreement with the NHLPA, contracts should only be guaranteed for the current and following year only. Either that or lower the buyout percentages.

I read that Bobby Orr refused to cash a couple seasons' worth of cheques from the Blackhawks because he felt he couldn't deliver and was injured. Awesome.

This contract and Eriksson's contract (take your pick which one I mean) - signed in good faith that players will be paid, but also signed in good faith that players will earn the money they are being paid.

Yeah and then in return the players are going to want to be able to hit UFA faster

 

[Sabre the Win]

Smart GMs will let players walk if they don't think the contract matches the output they are going to get from a player. If a GM is overpaying players to get them to stay because they had a single big season after a trade, that is a GM who isn't going to have a job very long.

He didn't

 

[TheGreatOne11]

You don't pay a guy with a career high 63 points 9 mil regardless if he's coming off of a 40 goal season.

He's to Buffalo what Jason Blake was to my leafs, man did I HATE that signing.

 

[JimmyJiveJones]

I really wonder how much Skinners agent was asking for when he was negotiating. Was he asking for more than Eichel like Mcdavid money then settled at 9? Arent GMs supposed to be experts at negotiating? Im not a Sabres fan at all but i was actually hoping you guys would turn the page and have a breakout year especially when you signed Hall. On paper you guys look way better than your record. But its pretty clear your first move is to fire Krueger, he doesnt even have the pedigree to have a long leash in the NHL.

 

[Johnny Hoxville]

This is likely honestly a top 5, worst contract ever signed in the NHL, it’s that bad and you could make the case it’s the worst of all time.

If you cut his deal in half at 4.5 per, a healthy scratch is among the worst deals in the league. It’s right there with Lucic and Neal. But then you factor in that it’s for 8 years and his best seasons are likely behind him, this is one ugly contract. I really feel for Buffalo.

 

[DingDongCharlie]

You don't pay a guy with a career high 63 points 9 mil regardless if he's coming off of a 40 goal season.

I don’t know what’s worse. Paying him for scoring 40 with Eichel or paying him and then not playing him with Eichel.

 

[DingDongCharlie]

His contract is so bad. Easily top five worst in the league. Potentially top 2-3.

Honest question. Who’s worse? I can’t think of a contract I’d want less at this point due to the term remaining on it.