Proposal: James VanRiemsdyk for Mikhail Sergachev

M.C.G. 31

Damn, he brave!
Oct 6, 2008
96,268
18,936
Ottawa
I was down to trade the 9th overall to Toronto for JVR at the draft but I didn't expect to get Sergachev either, who fills a huge need for us moving forward on LD with Markov close to retirement and then having Beaulieu, Emelin and Barberio next on the depth chart.

Now if the Habs could swing a deal to get another young or prime-aged LHD, maybe...
 

DrTucker

Registered User
Jan 29, 2015
337
4
Halifax
Agreed! The Habs are in win now mode but the future still looks promising. The Habs do a very good job at managing assets like Sergachev. They don't trade them away for guys like Kessel to stay in the middle of the pack and pretend to be a playoff of team.

:shakehead

Ah Pittsburg did just fine when they traded good assets for Kessel
 

DrTucker

Registered User
Jan 29, 2015
337
4
Halifax
If we trade Sergachev, it will be for a guy of Duchene's caliber.
JVR is a level below that and could get a player like Hudon, Scherbak

Hudon is worthless to most teams, Scherbak will likely be a third line winger with maybe spot duty on a 2nd line. Neither one of those guys get you anywhere a JVR (unless its for his negotiating rights when his contract is up)
 

DrTucker

Registered User
Jan 29, 2015
337
4
Halifax
He's no Sergy, though.

No he's not you're right, but he's still a very good prospect. Kessel was also almost double to cost of JVR (salary wise) In a vacuum Serg for JVR is fair value, but considering the lack of excellent prospects Montreal has I can understand their hesitation to give up their best prospect. That being said Tor has no reason to gift wrap JVR to the Habs for anything less than a stellar return.
 

sansabri

hello my enemies
Aug 12, 2005
31,529
7,807
No he's not you're right, but he's still a very good prospect. Kessel was also almost double to cost of JVR (salary wise) In a vacuum Serg for JVR is fair value, but considering the lack of excellent prospects Montreal has I can understand their hesitation to give up their best prospect. That being said Tor has no reason to gift wrap JVR to the Habs for anything less than a stellar return.

Guess you haven't been following the thread, but we don't need JVR. We're looking for a top 4 LHD and a top 6 C. JVR doesn't fit any of those criteria.
 

Michel Beauchamp

Canadiens' fan since 1958
Mar 17, 2008
23,026
3,224
Laval, Qc
source? Is this an established fact with a quote from your GM, or something you guys made up afterward?

"Bergevin did his homework on Radulov, meeting him and speaking with Weber and Sergei Fedorov, the Hall of Fame center who is the GM of CSKA Moscow.

"Shea talked to me about when he was with him in Nashville, it was not a character issue but a maturity issue," Bergevin said. "Sergei said 'He's one of my leaders, he's my captain, he's got a wife and a kid and he wants to come back in the NHL.' My scouts, we watched him a lot this year, he's one of the hardest working kids."


Source: https://www.nhl.com/news/alexander-radulov-signing-hard-for-montreal-to-accept/c-281103812
 

DrTucker

Registered User
Jan 29, 2015
337
4
Halifax
Guess you haven't been following the thread, but we don't need JVR. We're looking for a top 4 LHD and a top 6 C. JVR doesn't fit any of those criteria.

Oh I've been following this trainwreck don't you worry. Sure that's what you need, not saying you don't. JVR will certainly help you a heck of a lot more, but I'm not forcing you to trade for him. There have been plenty Leaf fans offering and plenty Habs fans requesting him.
 

sansabri

hello my enemies
Aug 12, 2005
31,529
7,807
Oh I've been following this trainwreck don't you worry. Sure that's what you need, not saying you don't. JVR will certainly help you a heck of a lot more, but I'm not forcing you to trade for him. There have been plenty Leaf fans offering and plenty Habs fans requesting him.

How does JVR help us? Look at our Goals For. Because a few fans request him doesn't mean that they're right in doing so.

Again, priority is top 4 LHD and Top 6 C.
 

Michel Beauchamp

Canadiens' fan since 1958
Mar 17, 2008
23,026
3,224
Laval, Qc
We have all seen GMs mortgage the future making trades, so I don't think you're right that only fans want a cup now.

The objective is the cup. Though you could very well get that without moving Sergachev. But if you could increase your chances, you should consider it is all I'm getting at.

Yep.

Let's trade Filip Forsberg for Michael Latta and Martin Erath. :D
 

Kudo Shinichi

Registered User
Apr 20, 2012
20,549
26,639
Hudon is worthless to most teams, Scherbak will likely be a third line winger with maybe spot duty on a 2nd line. Neither one of those guys get you anywhere a JVR (unless its for his negotiating rights when his contract is up)

I guess you really don't know anything about those two players.
Hudon has dominated the ahl since he entered that league. We don't know yet if he can be a legit top 6 forward in the nhl, but his 4 pts in 6 nhl games looks good.

Scherbak had a bad season last year because of so many injuries. This year, he's healthy and he's dominating the ahl. He's 9th in scoring and 3rd in goals. He's got 1st line potential.

Scherbak + 4th round pick is the max I would give for the rental of JVR.
 

FerrisRox

"Wanna go, Prettyboy?"
Sep 17, 2003
20,338
13,056
Toronto, Ontario
I guess you really don't know anything about those two players.
Hudon has dominated the ahl since he entered that league. We don't know yet if he can be a legit top 6 forward in the nhl, but his 4 pts in 6 nhl games looks good.

Charles Hudon has, at no time "dominated" the AHL. That is a hysterically hyperbolic statement. He's proven to be a solid offensive contributor at the minor league level, but he has fallen considerably short of a point-per-game in the American League. To say he's been dominant just makes you look silly.

The jury is not out on whether he's a Top 6 forward in the NHL. The jury is out on whether he is an NHL player period.
 

Never

Can you hear me now?
Sep 16, 2009
12,771
83
Calgary
No thanks. Trading Sergachev for JVR fills a short-term hole while creating a long-term one.
 

Kudo Shinichi

Registered User
Apr 20, 2012
20,549
26,639
Charles Hudon has, at no time "dominated" the AHL. That is a hysterically hyperbolic statement. He's proven to be a solid offensive contributor at the minor league level, but he has fallen considerably short of a point-per-game in the American League. To say he's been dominant just makes you look silly.

The jury is not out on whether he's a Top 6 forward in the NHL. The jury is out on whether he is an NHL player period.

So according to you, dominating the ahl means to go point-per-game?
So I guess only 3-4 players are capable of dominating the ahl in a year since that's the amount of players who go ppg while playing a considerable amount of games.

In Hudon's first year in the ahl (2014-2015), he finished 22nd in the league in points. (2nd in pts among rookies). Only 2 players who played 50+ games finished ppg. Both of them were overagers (27+ years old).

In his 2nd year, he finished 4th in goals in the league. Only 5 players who played 50+ games went ppg. Two of them were over 27 years old, and all of them except 1 were older than Hudon.

This year, he was in the top 5 in scoring before getting recalled.

To say he's not been dominant makes you look silly.

But I guess I'm not surprised. Looking back at your previous posts on Hudon, well they are all negative post about him.
 

Price4Prez

Registered User
Nov 20, 2007
1,482
709
Not sure why we are talking Hudon here, but just to add to that convo- Hudon is the type of player that needs to produce offensively at the NHL level to be successful. He wont be a go to defence first guy so if he isnt on the scoresheet, its bad news for him. Its basically a wait and see on how his game translates to the NHL over longer periods of time at this point.

As for the og deal. Wouldnt touch that as a habs fan. Yes, i value experience and proven players but this is one instance where the potential is so promising that it would be too hard to pass up for a player of JVR caliber.
 

Halla

Registered User
Jan 28, 2016
14,727
3,779
So according to you, dominating the ahl means to go point-per-game?
So I guess only 3-4 players are capable of dominating the ahl in a year since that's the amount of players who go ppg while playing a considerable amount of games.

In Hudon's first year in the ahl (2014-2015), he finished 22nd in the league in points. (2nd in pts among rookies). Only 2 players who played 50+ games finished ppg. Both of them were overagers (27+ years old).

In his 2nd year, he finished 4th in goals in the league. Only 5 players who played 50+ games went ppg. Two of them were over 27 years old, and all of them except 1 were older than Hudon.

This year, he was in the top 5 in scoring before getting recalled.

To say he's not been dominant makes you look silly.

But I guess I'm not surprised. Looking back at your previous posts on Hudon, well they are all negative post about him.

Nylander had 56pts in 52 combined reg. season/playoff games, and he was 2 years younger. doesnt count though because leafs right?

Hudon has been very good in the AHL. but putting up 53-57 points isnt dominating. Leipsic with 23 in 18 (97 pt/76 game pace) thats dominating. last year he had 1 extra pt in 2 less games than hudon, and no leaf fan would dare say he was dominating.
 

Halla

Registered User
Jan 28, 2016
14,727
3,779
lost in the commotion is the fact JVR has 10G (would lead the habs) and 19pts (would be 2nd on the habs).

to see names like byron and hudon thrown out as trade bait is just hilarious. habs fans would be ok with a Leipsic + pick return for pacioretty right?

shut er' down
 

sansabri

hello my enemies
Aug 12, 2005
31,529
7,807
lost in the commotion is the fact JVR has 10G (would lead the habs) and 19pts (would be 2nd on the habs).

to see names like byron and hudon thrown out as trade bait is just hilarious. habs fans would be ok with a Leipsic + pick return for pacioretty right?

shut er' down

A Leafs fan started the thread...
 

Kudo Shinichi

Registered User
Apr 20, 2012
20,549
26,639
Nylander had 56pts in 52 combined reg. season/playoff games, and he was 2 years younger. doesnt count though because leafs right?

Hudon has been very good in the AHL. but putting up 53-57 points isnt dominating. Leipsic with 23 in 18 (97 pt/76 game pace) thats dominating. last year he had 1 extra pt in 2 less games than hudon, and no leaf fan would dare say he was dominating.

The stats were for the regular season, no need to get offended lol
And the reg. season and the playoffs are two totally different beasts, there's really no point in adding them up...

Leipsic got only 20 goals last year compared to Hudon's 28. That's a pretty huge goalscoring difference.
He also played on a stacked team, whereas Hudon played on a weak team which obviously did not make the playoffs.

Considering everything, Hudon's last season is a lot more impressive than Leipsics.
 

Halla

Registered User
Jan 28, 2016
14,727
3,779
The stats were for the regular season, no need to get offended lol
And the reg. season and the playoffs are two totally different beasts, there's really no point in adding them up...

Leipsic got only 20 goals last year compared to Hudon's 28. That's a pretty huge goalscoring difference.
He also played on a stacked team, whereas Hudon played on a weak team which obviously did not make the playoffs.

Considering everything, Hudon's last season is a lot more impressive than Leipsics
.

ok fine don't count the playoffs. Nylander 45pts in 38 games. thats dominating. Hudon 53 in 67. thats not dominating
Leipsic didnt even get 1st line pp time. he ends up with more pts in less games but it gets discounted because of the team he played on?

I guess Hudons 9g/14pts is more impressive than Leipsics 6g/23 points because he has more goals right? must be the team though, there are exactly 3 other marlies with more than 8pts in 18 games :laugh:
 

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