Bleach Clean
Registered User
- Aug 9, 2006
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Not sure what you have been watching over the first 30 games but overall Virtanen has been fine in very limited ice time. His game is still a work in progress but he has been noticeable more nights than not. You can see his game improving as the season goes along.
No way he deserves to be in Utica. He is working hard. A fair number of forwards on this team that should be out of the line up before Jake. I also think he will provide more offence if he is given more opportunity.
I agree with this. Jake IS quite inconsistent as his game ebbs and flows quite noticeably. At the same time that can be said of many players both on this team and around the league. The notion of sending him to the AHL until he eradicates all traces of inconsistency from his game is both unrealistic and unfair. Only the most elite players in the NHL manage consistently high play for the majority of the season and Jake will never be one of those. Hell even Boeser waxes from dominant games to invisible games and no one suggests demoting him until he is dominant every single game. Inconsistency shouldn’t be the goal, rather the quality of play (esp offensively) in his good games.
Don't believe there's anything to be gained for Jake in Utica at this point. He looks like an NHLer now on most nights. I'm fine with spoon feeding JV minutes and gradually increasing his ice time as his reactions become more instinctual.
Virtanen is someone who physically matured much quicker than he did mentally. Seems he gets what it takes to be a pro now and is on an old-school development path--start on the 4th line and earn more ice time and opportunity.
The 'gain' would be offensive confidence. He would be producing more in the AHL and maybe he would get some of his pre-draft swagger back in that department. He certainly wasn't showing it in the early going here. Actually, I don't think Virtanen has ever appeared to be as dangerous as he had been pre-draft. That Virtanen is M.I.A.
Anyways, it's not a major gripe. In the end all that matters is he becomes useful. If they think it's this way, then fine.
Which gives you the 2017 "Willie Desjardins" Award for the best poster on HFVan,because that is precisely the way he would have done it....."Deserves" is different from development. He deserves to be in the NHL line-up over Burmistrov, agreed. Is it best for his development to be here instead of in Utica, I'm not sure. He's playing better with Gaunce and Granlund/Chaput, but we'll see how long that lasts.
His game is a "work in progress", yes. We are watching the same games. I'm not seeing the same improvement trajectory. I see good games, invisible games, and poor games. Not enough good games for my liking, so that's why Utica seems like a better alternative.
So you are attributing the position of sending him down to be akin to "eradicating all traces of inconsistency". Interesting. It's the wrong counter-argument, but interesting nonetheless.
We agree that Jake is "quite inconsistent". We just have different thresholds as to how much of that inconsistency will be withstood before change is in order. I think the fact that Jake has never been good for the majority of games at any point in his pro career lends credence to my position to send him down. But as I have noted, he will not be sent down by this regime. I just think it could help him gain offensive confidence... even now. Am I wrong to think that he could be a top6 mainstay with the Comets?
Which gives you the 2017 "Willie Desjardins" Award for the best poster on HFVan,because that is precisely the way he would have done it.....
Nice try,but wrong again....the miscommunication between JV and WD is well documented...What is the [MOD] about Jake Virtanen..?..Please explain.Ummm didn't WD graduate Virtanen onto the roster too early, only to have his performance crater, forcing him to be sent down? That is the opposite of what I am saying to do... but good know. Do you get the Benning award for being completely wrong at every point in that assessment??
Nice try,but wrong again....the miscommunication between JV and WD is well documented...What is the [MOD] about Jake Virtanen..?..Please explain.
I like Virtanen with Travis Green rather than sending him doen to Utica to go through yet another coah in Cull.
I think he is playing well and using his speed and body well.
Very happy to see his development.
I think his "offensive confidence" is fine, really. He's not going to suddenly turn into Kyle Wellwood because he spent an extra 40 games on the farm. This is the player he is. He likes to bull around the ice and take low percentage shots on the fly.
He's a more physical Mason Raymond-type right now. I still want to see him drop that shoulder and cut to the net far more. He has the speed and strength to do that on a consistent basis. If he can do that he can likely develop into a reasonable second line player. The clock is ticking on that though. He simply loves those low percentage shots.
It's often preached that any shot is a good shot but sometimes it is very much worth passing up the shot to try to get into position for a better one. Even if you fail.
If you think Virtanen should be in the AHL then you also believe that Guance should be?
That's going to be the x-factor that determines whether or not Jake becomes an effective NHL forward or simply a fast 4th liner who can kill 10 minutes. If he learns to cruise missile himself at the net, he will create untold havoc given his speed and size. If he continues trying to be a rifleman from the top of the circle, he's going to create an unprecedented amount of odd man chances going the other direction when the shot inevitably ricochets off the glass.
I'd like him to use that damn size of his for something other than "2 hits a period". Just Bertuzzi that puck into the crease and try and capitalize off the ensuing mayhem. He can "rip the puck" but if he has a productive NHL career he's going to be a greasy scorer.
If you think Virtanen should be in the AHL then you also believe that Guance should be?
I don't know. If a player is going to make an impact offensively in the NHL they ought to be able to make a good impact in the AHL regardless of linemates. Not having decent center depth in Utica didn't stop Goldobin from producing for instance. Not to say Goldobin will be able to make the jump but Virtanen should at this point be able to put up numbers in the AHL if he is ever going to put up numbers in the NHL.
That said, I wouldn't send him down. Many others should be on the chopping block first. But if he was I would expect him to put up very good numbers or be relegated to grinder status forever.
I don't know. If a player is going to make an impact offensively in the NHL they ought to be able to make a good impact in the AHL regardless of linemates. Not having decent center depth in Utica didn't stop Goldobin from producing for instance. Not to say Goldobin will be able to make the jump but Virtanen should at this point be able to put up numbers in the AHL if he is ever going to put up numbers in the NHL.
That said, I wouldn't send him down. Many others should be on the chopping block first. But if he was I would expect him to put up very good numbers or be relegated to grinder status forever.