Is McDavid, Matthews, MacKinnon the new Big Three?

[zeke]

Shows that you get the ice time that you deserve. NHL coaches are pretty fair. They are always a few bad weeks of poor results from getting fired.

ah so Matthews only "deserved" the 74th most forward ice time last year, about the same as zibanejad and hertl deserved.

 

[WetcoastOrca]

Leaf fans keep moving the goal posts. The NHL is going to have to bring in a Most Points For 60 Minutes Trophy to keep them happy!

 

[LamorielloAndSon]

Mcdavid
Mackinnon
And Mat Barzal

 

[Bank Shot]

Except the point is about PP ice-time specifically. Again, show me how PP ice-time doesn't dramatically alter point production if dramatically reduced. If you don't think PP ice-time has a significant effect on point totals, I don't know what to tell you. All ice-time isn't equal. Playing in situations where scoring chances are significantly higher, will dramatically alter point totals.

Mcdavid was 61st in PP time last year. The truly dominate players just produce.

 

[93LEAFS]

I know. It just shows how great McDavid is to play so many more minutes and still play at such a high level. It’s anazing what he’s done with so much less support than most of the other top players. That’s what separates him from the rest in addition to the Art Rosses.

I think other players could play those minutes, just no coach is crazy enough to do it long-term outside of McLellan due to desperation. The only other forward I've seen get minutes like this is Kovalchuk with the Devils.

I also think he gets pretty good line-mates. Most of his career he's had RNH, Eberle or Drai on his 5v5 line. A lot of teams don't stack their top unit like Boston or Dallas. I mean, for years Crosby played with Kunitz and Dupuis.

 

[AvalancheFan19]

Scheifele had 20 points in the playoffs last year. I tried to look up Matthews and MacKinnon but I gave up scrolling down that far in the list of leading scorers.

Probably should have kept scrolling, you’d find Mackinnon with 6 points in the 6 games he played.

 

[93LEAFS]

Mcdavid was 61st in PP time last year. The truly dominate players just produce.

Again, find me someone who saw a massive reduction in PP ice-time (82 minutes or more), and how it didn't affect their point totals. Line-mates for line-drivers aren't important or massively impactful. But, then it also makes the argument its harder for McDavid to score because he has no good teammates a fruitless argument, as that is the flip-side of the coin.

You haven't proven PP ice-time doesn't matter and have an impact on point totals. I really don't think you can, or find any positive examples.

 

[Bank Shot]

I think other players could play those minutes, just no coach is crazy enough to do it long-term outside of McLellan due to desperation. The only other forward I've seen get minutes like this is Kovalchuk with the Devils.

I also think he gets pretty good line-mates. Most of his career he's had RNH, Eberle or Drai on his 5v5 line. A lot of teams don't stack their top unit like Boston or Dallas. I mean, for years Crosby played with Kunitz and Dupuis.

He's 5th in icetime per game since 2010.

Kovalchuk, Getalaf, Kopitar, and St. Louis all averaged more icetime per game than Mcdavid over this period.

Maybe Matthews should stop playing video games and hit the gym so he can handle some more minutes.

 

[The Best Leafs Ever]

Matthews of course, meh let the other 2 eat some smoke while they chase Matthews.

 

[93LEAFS]

He's 5th in icetime per game since 2010.

Kovalchuk, Getalaf, Kopitar, and St. Louis all averaged more icetime per game than Mcdavid over this period.

Maybe Matthews should stop playing video games and hit the gym so he can handle some more minutes.

I pointed to the start of this year, where the only one comparable would be Kovalchuk on the Devils.

Maybe the Oilers should actually develop a player so they don't have to play McDavid 23 minutes a game. Appears they can't hit on anything but a sure thing. Depth is actually good for teams, and tends to reduce players ice-time.

 

[The Best Leafs Ever]

Again, find me someone who saw a massive reduction in PP ice-time (82 minutes or more), and how it didn't affect their point totals. Line-mates for line-drivers aren't important or massively impactful. But, then it also makes the argument its harder for McDavid to score because he has no good teammates a fruitless argument, as that is the flip-side of the coin.

You haven't proven PP ice-time doesn't matter and have an impact on point totals. I really don't think you can, or find any positive examples.

McDavid plays in pupu western conference who haven’t won **** for 4 straight years and they get beat up by most of the teams from east. If he can’t even score in such a favourable situation than what good is he with or without good line mates? Matthews had been playing 2+ mins less than McDavid, carryied the biggest anchor in Hyman, played the 2nd PP unit. Even McDavid will piss in his pants if he were given the same treatment.

 

[Tage2Tuch]

im actually surprised that there is crying about Scheifele and not Laine.

That’s because Scheifele is better then Laine.
(Read below)


And if more then ten percent of this forum watched Eichel he would be included on her in the same list as Mackinnon and matthews by all (he is by most) Eichel doesent have any linemates as good as either guy (rantanen m/landeskog or one of either Marleau or Nylander) and has managed 126 pts in his last 133 games on a team that barely scores against the best conpetition of the opposition on one good leg. He outscored Mack in 16-17 despite playing two whole months less (22 games less then Mackinnon) in just his second year and before this season had a higher points per game then Matthews since auston entered the league. (0.94>>> 0.88)) Despite that Matthews has been much more efficient for sure and is ahead of Eichel right now but they’re all in the same tier. I’m not a fan of Mackinnon in his early years but he’s definitely there now.

laine is lucky to be apart of the conversation doesent have to play against the top guys all the time, put up only 26 assists in 82 games last year and goals? Half of them came on the powerplay which is fine but it’s still a man advtange with elite playmakers on the highest scoring team. Eichel for reference in 20 less games scored just two less even strength goals then laine last year as eichel isn’t even a goal scorer. He had way more assists too in those twenty less games. Laine is not really a great skater or a 200 foot player or playmaker despite being good st both. He’s in a tier below with Draisaitl IMO as he still is impressive as his goals are impressive. He still was put into the best position of all the young stars.

Mcdavid is in a group all on his own though at the top in one higher tier then the centres I named above.

 

[Howie Hodge]

"Are" they?

 

[The Best Leafs Ever]

That’s because Scheifele is better then Laine.
(Read below)


And if more then ten percent of this forum watched Eichel he would be included on her in the same list as Mackinnon and matthews by all (he is by most) Eichel doesent have any linemates as good as either guy (rantanen m/landeskog or one of either Marleau or Nylander) and has managed 126 pts in his last 133 games on a team that barely scores against the best conpetition of the opposition on one good leg. He outscored Mack in 16-17 despite playing two whole months less (22 games less then Mackinnon) in just his second year and before this season had a higher points per game then Matthews since auston entered the league. (0.94>>> 0.88)) Despite that Matthews has been much more efficient for sure and is ahead of Eichel right now but they’re all in the same tier. I’m not a fan of Mackinnon in his early years but he’s definitely there now.

laine is lucky to be apart of the conversation doesent have to play against the top guys all the time, put up only 26 assists in 82 games last year and goals? Half of them came on the powerplay which is fine but it’s still a man advtange with elite playmakers on the highest scoring team. Eichel for reference in 20 less games scored just two less even strength goals then laine last year as eichel isn’t even a goal scorer. He had way more assists too in those twenty less games. Laine is not really a great skater or a 200 foot player or playmaker despite being good st both. He’s in a tier below with Draisaitl IMO as he still is impressive as his goals are impressive. He still was put into the best position of all the young stars.

Mcdavid is in a group all on his own though at the top in one higher tier then the centres I named above.

What is this oddball Eichel? Matthews plays with Marleau and Kapanen before playing with Marleau and Tyler (****ing) Ennis. Also Marleau’s points barely came on Matthews line. Eichel is a tier below not worth mentioning.

 

[zar]

People need to start watching more hockey and less box scores.

McDavid is on his own tier... not sure why that is being argued by some.

If everyone looks at this objectively... its hard to argue against the fact that Matthews is showing to be a significant young talent. I personally think that with a bit more sample he viewed by most as the tier just below McDavid. Personally, I feel he is there right now when I watch him play and also if you look at his production over last 82GP. He is pacing unrealistically high this season but I would not be surprised with him finishing with between 90-100 points this year.

 

[CallArnoldSlick]

Mc and Mac for sure. Matthews needs to dominate more than a handful of games.

 

[Razz]

To answer the OP, yes. Everyone else, get over it.

 

[Future GOAT]

amazing how the mods just allow non stop trashing of leafs and leaf fans on the main board.

non stop.

I don't think they consider "victim mentality" the same thing as "Leafs trashing".

 

[TheGoldenJet]

Why are Matthews and MacKinnon there but Scheifele isn't? Scheifele is better than both and barely older than MacKinnon. Some people are forgetting the playoffs and putting way too much stock in the first few games of the season

MacKinnon is better and younger than Scheifele. Even without the Hart trophy that should have been his last year.

 

[migi]

Just enjoy this era. It's so f***ing early and there are some new superstars coming already.

 

[Khomutov]

There is no new Big Three. The old guard is still playing good hockey. Malkin, Ovechkin and Crosby were all better last year than Matthews. Malkin had a season equal or arguably better than MacKinnon.

Kucherov is one of the best players in the NHL, still better than Matthews or MacKinnon for me.

Six or seven games of the new season does not change that.

 

[Jaleel619]

I don't know, I don't really like todays super stars as it all seems like theyre trying to be mini gretzkys. I think Tom Wilson is the type of character i'd appreciate in a Super Star. We've seen somebody who can put up a million points. Can we see a player assist, score, and fight? Like a forward though, not Lindros or Burns.

 

[ricky0034]

I don't know, I don't really like todays super stars as it all seems like theyre trying to be mini gretzkys. I think Tom Wilson is the type of character i'd appreciate in a Super Star. We've seen somebody who can put up a million points. Can we see a player assist, score, and fight? Like a forward though, not Lindros or Burns.

huh?

 

[Jaleel619]

huh?

Is was Lindros a forward? I don't know, I started in 2001 and only followed sharks hockey, only until later I learned about him, and all the trade outcomes he was apart of.

 

[SoupNazi]

The Three Tenors.

McDavid, Matthews, and the other guy.