Is Connor McDavid the best player ever?

[zodiacbiller]

So, I’ve always felt that the GOAT convo is Gretzky, Lemieux, Orr, Howe, and Hasek. If you said one of them was the GOAT, I wasn’t gonna argue with you. Gun to my head, I’d have Mario Lemieux as the best, but there’s fair case for all of them. I’m also clearly, fwiw, a bit of a contrarian, and so I think the best player outside of those five is Eric Lindros. Maybe Patrick Roy.

But I got to thinking. My belief is normally that you have to consider it era relative, but I think the conditions of the 1980s are impossible to replicate. I don’t think it’s possible to dominate statistically the way Gretzky did in today’s game.

Connor McDavid is at very least the fastest player ever, and his hands and his head keep up with his feet. My question here, just wanting to see different takes, is it possible he’s as good as a hockey player can be? To me, if he isn’t, it’s almost impossible to be better than Gretzky and Lemieux. And like, I’m a Leafs guy, I’m still half Mad Online we didn’t win that lottery, and I wish I could be making this thread about Auston. But I’m genuinely curious about how people feel here.

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[PostBradMalone]

Well actually now that you…

 

[cowboy82nd]

So, I’ve always felt that the GOAT convo is Gretzky, Lemieux, Orr, Howe, and Hasek. If you said one of them was the GOAT, I wasn’t gonna argue with you. Gun to my head, I’d have Mario Lemieux as the best, but there’s fair case for all of them. I’m also clearly, fwiw, a bit of a contrarian, and so I think the best player outside of those five is Eric Lindros. Maybe Patrick Roy.

But I got to thinking. My belief is normally that you have to consider it era relative, but I think the conditions of the 1980s are impossible to replicate. I don’t think it’s possible to dominate statistically the way Gretzky did in today’s game.

Connor McDavid is at very least the fastest player ever, and husband hands and his head keep up with his feet. My question here, just wanting to see different takes, is it possible he’s as good as a hockey player can be? To me, if he isn’t, it’s almost impossible to be better than Gretzky and Lemieux. And like, I’m a Leafs guy, I’m still half Mad Online we didn’t win that lottery, and I wish I could be making this thread about Auston. But I’m genuinely curious about how people feel here.

What is husband hands??? And no I don't think he's the GOAT.

 

[GermanSpitfire]

Young man, I think you need to bring up HockeyDB and look at a few players statlines.

Wayne Gretzky to start, Mario Lemieux after that. Bobby Orr is a good one to look up too.

 

[waitin425]

The best player ever, not adjusting for their eras? He's still not better than prime Crosby.

The best player ever to play the game of any era......Gretzky

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

sigh... freaking zoomers

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

Young man, I think you need to bring up HockeyDB and look at a few players statlines.

Wayne Gretzky to start, Mario Lemieux after that. Bobby Orr is a good one to look up too.

Young man, I think you need to look-up the leaguewide scoring of that era compared to today and while you're at it, look-up the wiki page for NHL expansions.

 

[16thOverallSaveUs]

nah matthews is

 

[GermanSpitfire]

Young man, I think you need to look-up the leaguewide scoring of that era compared to today and while you're at it, look-up the wiki page for NHL expansions.

You’re seriously saying McDavid is better that these guys? hahaha i’ve seen it all.

Great joke Kiddo!

 

[LTIR Trickery]

Can't be the best player ever without a title

 

[Rengorlex]

He is the best player now. Because the sport is evolving, a lot of times the best player now is the best player ever, making the distinction useless. He's not the best player of all time compared to era.

 

[Phil68]

McDavid is better then Crosby Prime.

 

[Bear of Bad News]

I’m also clearly, fwiw, a bit of a contrarian

You don't say?

 

[Holymakinaw]

It never ends.

No, he's not the best player ever.

LOL. Jesus.

 

[Gee Wally]

Lol…..no.

 

[Bear of Bad News]

It never ends.

No, he's not the best player ever.

LOL. Jesus.

Jesus is a great candidate, but I think his ability to walk on water gives an unfair advantage, since ice is just slippery water. Although I guess you can't fault the greats of yesterday for the rules in place at the time.

 

[NigerianNightmare]

So, I’ve always felt that the GOAT convo is Gretzky, Lemieux, Orr, Howe, and Hasek. If you said one of them was the GOAT, I wasn’t gonna argue with you. Gun to my head, I’d have Mario Lemieux as the best, but there’s fair case for all of them. I’m also clearly, fwiw, a bit of a contrarian, and so I think the best player outside of those five is Eric Lindros. Maybe Patrick Roy.

But I got to thinking. My belief is normally that you have to consider it era relative, but I think the conditions of the 1980s are impossible to replicate. I don’t think it’s possible to dominate statistically the way Gretzky did in today’s game.

Connor McDavid is at very least the fastest player ever, and his hands and his head keep up with his feet. My question here, just wanting to see different takes, is it possible he’s as good as a hockey player can be? To me, if he isn’t, it’s almost impossible to be better than Gretzky and Lemieux. And like, I’m a Leafs guy, I’m still half Mad Online we didn’t win that lottery, and I wish I could be making this thread about Auston. But I’m genuinely curious about how people feel here.

Of course, he's not.

It's not about individual stats. It's about being a winner and make everyone on your team better.

Give him 5 more years. Then we'll see if he belongs to be considered the greatest

 

[Rodgerwilco]

He's not even better overall than Crosby's peak, let alone Gretzky, Orr, or Mario.

 

[bobbyking]

lmao if he wins art rosses on assists alone then well talk. and yes its absolutely possible in today's era

 

[Ban Hammered]

Not a chance

 

[WarriorofTime]

He probably skates faster, stick handles better, shoots harder, etc. from a pure technical and absolute sense than the greats from the prior era (Gretzky himself has said this, certainly Gretzky isn't overly boastful in describing his playing days, but I think he may be right) but that's not really the way people look through things. Training/development is able to build on advantages from the prior era and refine and improve them to build more efficient and skilled players. The whole "how many points would McDavid score in the 80s" question is like... I dunno probably a lot, you can just use era-adjusted tools available and be done with it and not think too hard because there isn't much ceterus paribus involved. Like when did McDavid first get a skating coach? Probably super young. Just wasn't a thing at all when say, Lemieux was coming up.

 

[OKR]

Yes, because of evolution.

 

[Tutu to]

Most advanced player? Yes

Greatest? No

 

[Sasha Orlov]

No and it’s not remotely close

 

[Machinehead]

I know it's boring because it's not close and there isn't anything to discuss, but it's Gretzky.