Is clutch a thing in hockey?

[SnowblindNYR]

This is probably most relevant and easiest to gauge with goalies because their mistakes are most glaring. Players in the NHL outside of goalies play a team game and each player's mistake isn't that noticeable. In basketball if a guy takes the final shot and misses every time he's not clutch. In football if the QB turns the ball over on every final possession he's not clutch. So isolating goalies I wonder what the consensus is.

For the Rangers I get a lot of heat for complaining about Shesterkin giving up goals late in games quite often. He's unbeatable in the first 55 minutes of games but three of the last 4 games has given up big goals in the last 5 minutes. That said so have his backups. But his backups just suck. To be fair he's still a young goalie who hasn't played a full season yet and I think early on in his career Hank also had problems with third period leads and also had problems finishing shutouts.

So I honestly wonder is clutch a thing in the NHL particularly with goalies? Or is it just random that these goals happen in the last five minutes and they would have happened in the first period as well?

I know some Rangers fans will be annoyed by this poll but I'm legit curious about having a discussion on this. This is not a vent about Shesterkin thread, he's a great young goalie overall.

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[bobholly39]

Yeah, of course.

It's often overstated though - but it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Some players are clutch, some are not - but most are somewhere in between or it randomly varies from game to game.

 

[GermanSpitfire]

oh yeah bud, have you met Martin Gélinas?

 

[SnowblindNYR]

I guess maybe it should have been is choking a thing. Because I'm thinking more in terms of making a mistake rather than scoring big goals. If someone scores a lot of big goals they're probably clutch. Or if someone shows up in the playoffs. That said someone like Kreider for the Rangers probably has scored more big goals for the team since coming into the league than anyone else. By that I mean last minute goals. But that's probably a product of his style because he's a guy that gets a lot of rebounds and tip ins. The most clutch goal he scored in his career wasn't like that and IMO was kind of lucky. Game 5 against the Caps in 2015, I think there were less than 2 minutes to play and the Rangers were down 3-1 in the series and 1-0 in the game. Then Kreider scored kind of a soft goal off a nice release on Holby to tie it up and the Rangers ended up winning that game and the series.

 

[Mickey Marner]

Yes, but exceedingly rarely. Patrick Kane, for instance, has made a career-long habit of coming up big for his team, that's clutch.

I would actually say that the goalie who allows the first goal the least often is clutch. Shestyorkin giving up a goal in the last five minutes may or may not matter, but giving up the first goal in a game always matters every time.

 

[Kcb12345]

It is a fact that some people perform better under pressure than others

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Yes, but exceedingly rarely. Patrick Kane, for instance, has made a career-long habit of coming up big for his team, that's clutch.

I would actually say that the goalie who allows the first goal the least often is clutch. Shestyorkin giving up a goal in the last five minutes may or may not matter, but giving up the first goal in a game always matters every time.

Well he tends to give up those late goals in tied or 1 goal games. The entire team has to be honest all season. But the Rangers are also the youngest team in the league. Hank late in his career would give up early goals quite often actually.

 

[Regal]

While I think some people definitely do better in pressure situations than others I think variance plays a bigger role and creates narratives that we love. I also think struggling under pressure is more the issue than someone suddenly playing better. However I also think sometimes play styles can play into these things. Some players might do well with open ice but struggle to create space against more defensive teams and in tighter checking games, which tend to exist more in the playoffs. They're not necessarily playing worse from the pressure of the moment but from the context of the games.

 

[bambamcam4ever]

While I think some people definitely do better in pressure situations than others I think variance plays a bigger role and creates narratives that we love. I also think struggling under pressure is more the issue than someone suddenly playing better. However I also think sometimes play styles can play into these things. Some players might do well with open ice but struggle to create space against more defensive teams and in tighter checking games, which tend to exist more in the playoffs. They're not necessarily playing worse from the pressure of the moment but from the context of the games.

It certainly does exist and likely related to confidence, but as you said it is obscured by variance. So in most cases, I'm much more confident in saying that "clutchness" exists vs. player X is clutch/not clutch.

Also, look at Fleury's playoff overtime stats from 2011-2017 or watch him play if you have doubts.

 

[EdJovanovski]

Yes 100%
I have that clutch gene, in a provincial game I went end to end and scored the game tying goal with 10 seconds left, it was disallowed, I won the draw and went around a couple players and scored again with 2 left

but I don’t think Shesterkin is as bad in high pressure situations as you’re saying, he’s known to be strong mentally and have ice in his veins

 

[JoVel]

Sure it is. Some people don't perform as well when the pressure is high. It's basic psychology.

 

[snipes]

Fernando Pisani and Paul Henderson say hello.

 

[Peat]

Real but overstated because we're searching for patterns and narratives.

 

[JasonRoseEh]

Clutch is definitely a thing, but I think it`s less of a factor than inexperience overall. Inexperience causes many players to perform worse, clutch seemingly helps certain players rise to beyond expectations in pressure situations.

 

[Voight]

Fernando Pisani and Paul Henderson say hello.

& Danny Briere

 

[jetsforever]

& Danny Briere

& TJ Oshie

 

[molon labe]

Is this a Bryan Rust thread?

 

[Karl Eriksson]

Post season leaves have proven the inverse of clutch

 

[Bouboumaster]

 

[DowJones]

At some level yes, but our tendency to find patterns in randomness from a small sample size exceeds this by far.

 

[Uncle Scrooge]

Yes but it has nothing to do with hockey. People are just wired differently.

 

[amnesiac]

Yes 100%
I have that clutch gene, in a provincial game I went end to end and scored the game tying goal with 10 seconds left, it was disallowed, I won the draw and went around a couple players and scored again with 2 left

wasnt fair that you were playing against 8 year olds, though

 

[amnesiac]

Im sure we can find a dozen or so players that are statistically better in the playoffs than the regular season over the course of their career. But its not an exact science by any means. You wont find THAT big a difference over a significant sample size.

Most of the "great playoff performers" were already great in their own regard (eg. Gretz, Mario, Orr, Roy, Sakic, Yzerman, Pronger, Forsberg, Kucherov). Then you have those who seem to always have somewhat better numbers than in the reg season (eg. C.Lemieux, Briere, Williams, Couture, Krejci, Glenn Anderson, Gelinas). That said, if you had put them on a worse team, they probably wouldnt stand out.

Problem is, you wont find many players who put up big playoff performances on several different teams. The only two that come to mind are Claude Lemieux and Pronger.

 

[Machinehead]

I think it is, to an extent, but I still take McDavid over Justin Williams for a game 7.

 

[sethro109]

Some players live for the big moments. Joe Sakic was extremely clutch.