Rumor: In-season Proposals, Rumors, Free Agents & Roster Moves (related topics) XXXVIII ‎

[RockLobster]

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[CobraAcesS]

That's alot of ifs, ands or buts ... Zanon wouldn't need to be bought out though, contract up.

It might be do-able, but the Avs aren't winning the cup next year, thus I don't see Kroenke approving a 67 million dollar budget, plus Jones buy-out, the following year.

They would have all those pieces this coming season, if they made the playoffs. I absolutely could see the team looking similar to that the following year, with most of the improvement coming out of growth from S. Jones, Landeskog, Barrie/Elliott, and Varlamov. Along with experience and chemistry gained.

To be honest, if you compare that roster to some of the teams that went fairly deep in the playoffs it's competitive on paper at the very least. It comes down to coaching and chemistry after that IMO.

Like you said though, I'm just proving that it's doable.

I mean this is how we would stack up against Chicago if we drafted Jones, and traded for Vanek.

Toews / Duchene - Offensively Duchene can keep up here, maybe even a little ahead when it comes to pure offense, and hes improving on the defensive side of the puck.

Sharp / Landeskog - Both play a simple power game, but Landeskog is far superior defensively, while Sharp is superior offensively. How long will that last though?

Hossa / O'Reilly - Both are very good back checkers, Hossa has O'Reilly offensively though.

Kane / Parenteau - Kane has the edge here, but if PA can continue to be a 70 point player, I think I'd actually rather have him over Kane. Simply due to the added grit PA has, and PA's consistent effort level over all.

Saad / Vanek - This is where we'd makeup some ground offensively

Shaw? / Stastny - We have them hardcore when it comes to center depth. If we can keep that, it weighs heavily in our favor. It's also another place we makeup some ground offensively.

Stalberg / McGinn - I'd honestly give the edge to McGinn here but that may be my own bias. It's close either way.

Bickel / Downie - Downie is smaller, but meaner and better/smarter offensively, IMO. Remember Downie's run with Tampa? Something like 14 points in 17 playoff games.

Defense gets a little more murky but if we draft S. Jones we have the potential at least to be even better, all be it not immediately for obvious reasons.

Seabrook / EJ - When EJ is on his game, this is a good comparison IMO, but a stretch on some/most nights.

Keith / S. Jones - Jones should be as good or better than Kieth, especially on the defensive side of the puck. I could honestly see Barrie being a good comparison for Kieth if he continues to show growth and the ability to handle very tough minutes while providing offense as well. We'll see, right now I love the poise Barrie shows with the puck, and his defensive game is improving.

Leddy / Barrie/Elliott

Hjalmar / Hejda / Scuderi? / Siemens?

Oduya / Hejda / Scuderi? / Siemens?


Crawford / Varly - IMO Varly has a way higher ceiling than Crawfish, but Crawford has improved dramatically from even this year to last. Varly can do the same IMO.

So like I said, on paper, that roster stacks up fairly well, especially after a year of learning a new system and gaining chemistry, along with hopefully some playoff experience.

 

[KHstrike]

Pens fan here. I only read the last page of the previous thread and I see Letang hated on a bit. I'm not the biggest fan of his and I'll give my assessment.

One of if not the best skating defensemen in the league. Joins and sometimes leads the rush, while not getting caught up ice hardly ever. Stronger physically than most offensive dmen. Poor slapshot that is rarely used. Great sniping wristshot, but misses more than you'd like. Defensively he is much better than he is given credit for. Yes he does turn over the puck, but I believe its because he forces the stretch pass too much. A system thing. Most of the time he has a fast, accurate breakout pass. Hasn't shown much ability to run the powerplay. Can carry the puck up ice very well. Still improving as a player.

I would love to see him traded from Pittsburgh. Since they kept Bylsma I want to see his stretch pass system toys taken away from him so he's forced to change what's failed the past several years.

Letang would be a high energy player that would add a lot of points and excitement to your team.

 

[CobraAcesS]

Pens fan here. I only read the last page of the previous thread and I see Letang hated on a bit. I'm not the biggest fan of his and I'll give my assessment.

One of if not the best skating defensemen in the league. Joins and sometimes leads the rush, while not getting caught up ice hardly ever. Stronger physically than most offensive dmen. Poor slapshot that is rarely used. Great sniping wristshot, but misses more than you'd like. Defensively he is much better than he is given credit for. Yes he does turn over the puck, but I believe its because he forces the stretch pass too much. A system thing. Most of the time he has a fast, accurate breakout pass. Hasn't shown much ability to run the powerplay. Can carry the puck up ice very well. Still improving as a player.

I would love to see him traded from Pittsburgh. Since they kept Bylsma I want to see his stretch pass system toys taken away from him so he's forced to change what's failed the past several years.

Letang would be a high energy player that would add a lot of points and excitement to your team.

'But'

Colorado does not have the assets to acquire him. Unless Pitt wants one of Barrie/Elliott as the main piece, and that makes little sense looking at their defensive prospects. We also don't have established top 6 wingers to spare as we need at least one more of them ourselves.

Obviously the #1 over all pick isn't in play for someone with a expiring contract, and honestly even with an extension I wouldn't trade it for Letang. Jones has the potential to be better defensively and comparable offensively if not better in both regards.

Not a good fit IMO

 

[Nihiliste]

Snip

I think a lot of that is a huge stretch. Chicago's core is proven to be elite skill where ours is almost pure potential at this point. It seems ridiculous to try to compare the two.

You put Duchene as almost level with Toews, a Conn Smythe winning captain and one of the keys to an Olympic gold win. For the rest of forwards, Hossa/Kane/Sharp >>>> Stastny/O'reilly/Landeskog/PA at this point, unless Stastny bounces back and ROR/Landeskog deliver big time on their potential.

No dmen on our team are even in the same stratosphere as Keith or Seabrook - EJ has been more comparable to Hammer later, and Hjalmarsson is probably the safer bet to consistently eat big minutes at this point without boneheaded mistakes. After EJ, sure Barrie is similar to Leddy but what else do we have? If we draft Seth it seems to be quite a stretch to assume that he'll certainly reach the level of a Keith.

We'd basically need a best case scenario from all of our core guys to be on their level.

 

[CobraAcesS]

I think a lot of that is a huge stretch. Chicago's core is proven to be elite skill where ours is almost pure potential at this point. It seems ridiculous to try to compare the two.

You put Duchene as almost level with Toews, a Conn Smythe winning captain and one of the keys to an Olympic gold win. For the rest of forwards, Hossa/Kane/Sharp >>>> Stastny/O'reilly/Landeskog/PA at this point, unless Stastny bounces back and ROR/Landeskog deliver big time on their potential.

No dmen on our team are even in the same stratosphere as Keith or Seabrook - EJ has been more comparable to Hammer later, and Hjalmarsson is probably the safer bet to consistently eat big minutes at this point without boneheaded mistakes. After EJ, sure Barrie is similar to Leddy but what else do we have? If we draft Seth it seems to be quite a stretch to assume that he'll certainly reach the level of a Keith.

We'd basically need a best case scenario from all of our core guys to be on their level.

Uh... I cited potential

You say Hossa/Kane/Sharp is far superior to Stastny/O'Reilly/Landeskog/Parenteau?

You're giving the nod to three top 6 guys vs four, and I also did the matchup with adding another high end winger in Vanek.

I'd take Landeskog/O'Reilly/Vanek/Parenteau/Stastny over Kane/Hossa/Sharp/Shaw any day of the week. Seriously?

And my comparison of Duchene and Toews offensively stands, 5 point difference over 47GP, considering the teams around the two players and their age?

O'Reilly smoked Toews defensively and in the face-off dot in our games in 11-12 as well. He absolutely shut him down more than once...


Duchene/Stastny/O'Reilly vs Toews and...?Bolland? and Shaw? Should we put Kane here or Sharp?

Pareanteau/Landeskog/Vanek vs Kane/Sharp/Hossa? This isn't that far in their favor to be honest, especially considering the fact that one of them probably needs to be in the group above.

McGinn/Downie vs Stalberg/Bickell (Which they might lose one or both of...)

Yeah our defense is a lot farther off, but I mentioned that... If we added someone like Vanek without losing our center depth. We would absolutely be able to match up against Chicago when it comes to forward quality and depth.

Basically what it comes down to is, player for player we may not match up perfectly, but as you go down the depth chart it starts to work in our favor heavily. Especially if you add a guy like Vanek.

It's an example of what we need to be competitive. I think everyone pretty much knows that we need a top Defender and a first line winger. As well as some continued growth from other young players.

Of course each player is not exactly the same and offense lacking from one place can come from another match-up.

If Vanek was added to the roster, and played next to Stastny. I'd say there is a good chance he returns to closer to 70 points as well. Sheesh, try to be a little flexible in how you look at it. It's not an exact comparison player for player. (Which would be nearly impossible when comparing any two teams IMO.)

 

[Bordeleau Of Blood]

Continued from the other thread, here's the video I was talking about with the whole Kessel for #3 overall. He starts talking about the Avs at 2:00 and makes the remark about Boston/Colorado at 2:15.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ST9bLG_Aqa4

 

[Avs_19]

Continued from the other thread, here's the video I was talking about with the whole Kessel for #3 overall. He starts talking about the Avs at 2:00 and makes the remark about Boston/Colorado at 2:15.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ST9bLG_Aqa4

Burke talking about the Thrashers at 4th overall, "that should be a team coming after Tomas Kaberle hard with that pick."

 

[Foppa2118]

Burke talking about the Thrashers at 4th overall, "that should be a team coming after Tomas Kaberle hard with that pick."

Burke is such an overrated jack***. Giving away what Mike Gillis offered Tampa for #2 overall when knows the camera is on him. Then from the next Avs comment, it was probably him that leaked Boston offered Kessel to Colorado for #3.

Then he goes on to suggest Atlanta and LA would be stupid not to trade him #4 or #5 for Kaberle. What a tool. He loves the spotlight on him so he can try and sound like he's the smartest guy in the room, when usually he's one of the dumbest.

 

[Avs_19]

Burke is such an overrated jack***. Giving away what Mike Gillis offered Tampa for #2 overall when knows the camera is on him. Then from the next Avs comment, it was probably him that leaked Boston offered Kessel to Colorado for #3.

Then he goes on to suggest Atlanta and LA would be stupid not to trade him #4 or #5 for Kaberle. What a tool. He loves the spotlight on him so he can try and sound like he's the smartest guy in the room, when usually he's one of the dumbest.

I thought the part about the Pronger draft and the Whalers/Sharks trade was interesting. He said one of conditions of the trade was that Viktor Kozlov had to be available for the Sharks at #6 and if he wasn't, the Whalers would owe the Sharks a 1st round pick next year. That condition somehow got leaked so Bobby Clarke, who had the 5th pick, told Burke he's going to take Kozlov one spot ahead of the Sharks unless Burke gives him a 2nd round pick. So Clarke blackmailed Burke out of a 2nd round pick.

 

[chet1926]

Burke is such an overrated jack***. Giving away what Mike Gillis offered Tampa for #2 overall when knows the camera is on him. Then from the next Avs comment, it was probably him that leaked Boston offered Kessel to Colorado for #3.

Then he goes on to suggest Atlanta and LA would be stupid not to trade him #4 or #5 for Kaberle. What a tool. He loves the spotlight on him so he can try and sound like he's the smartest guy in the room, when usually he's one of the dumbest.

Burke is a total tool. He got owned in that draft. He wanted Schenn or Tavares and ended up with Kadri and try play it off like that was the player they really wanted all along.

It was kind of interesting to see inside a draft like that though. If he was accurate on what Vancouver offered TB for #2, I'm surprised that TB didn't take it. Its also nice to see that if the Avs were offered Kessel for #3 that they didn't take it. Kessel is a nice player but Duchene is basically our franchise now.

I along with you all did find it amusing how much Burke over-rated all of his players. Like Kaberle and Luke Schenn..."I see him as our next captain"

That video shows exactly why you don't deal with Burke, because he clearly can't judge a players value, and if a team is dumb enough to be trading with him they are going to get screwed.

 

[Avs_19]

Burke is a total tool. He got owned in that draft. He wanted Schenn or Tavares and ended up with Kadri and try play it off like that was the player they really wanted all along.

It was kind of interesting to see inside a draft like that though. If he was accurate on what Vancouver offered TB for #2, I'm surprised that TB didn't take it. Its also nice to see that if the Avs were offered Kessel for #3 that they didn't take it. Kessel is a nice player but Duchene is basically our franchise now.

I along with you all did find it amusing how much Burke over-rated all of his players. Like Kaberle and Luke Schenn..."I see him as our next captain"

That video shows exactly why you don't deal with Burke, because he clearly can't judge a players value, and if a team is dumb enough to be trading with him they are going to get screwed.

Burrows, Bieksa, and the 22nd pick for the 2nd overall pick? I think Tampa was very smart to reject the offer.

 

[chet1926]

Burrows, Bieksa, and the 22nd pick for the 2nd overall pick? I think Tampa was very smart to reject the offer.

Hedman for Bieksa, Borrows and Schroeder (not saying this is who TB would have picked)

I'd do that deal Hedman isn't that good, I've never been that impressed with him, Burrows is a consistent 50pts player, Bieksa is a solid 2nd pairing guy borderline 1st pairing, and 22nd pick would have netted a prospect who knows who they would have picked but there were decent players still available at that point.

 

[Avalanche2133]

Besides a number 1 D man, our biggest need is someone to play LW on top line. Some possible options:
Bobby Ryan
Thomas Vanek
Michael Boedker
Scott Hartnell
Patrick Elias

 

[Gigantor The Goalie]

Besides a number 1 D man, our biggest need is someone to play LW on top line. Some possible options:
Bobby Ryan
Thomas Vanek
Michael Boedker
Scott Hartnell
Patrick Elias

I don't think we can acquire Vanek or Ryan unless the 1st overall was in play. I don't believe Stastny is close enough in value to be a centerpiece for either deal. Boedker I wouldn't mind taking a flyer on if the price is right. Hartnell and Elias, no thanks.

 

[CoachBadkitten]

Elias will absolutely not leave NJ. I'd love Ryan or Vanek obviously. Boedker would be nice too.

 

[CobraAcesS]

I don't think we can acquire Vanek or Ryan unless the 1st overall was in play. I don't believe Stastny is close enough in value to be a centerpiece for either deal. Boedker I wouldn't mind taking a flyer on if the price is right. Hartnell and Elias, no thanks.

Vanek wouldn't require the #1 over all pick to be in play, he only has a year left on his contract. They most any team would give up is prospects and picks, that's been proven in the past.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Yea we could get Vanek for our 2014 1st + Sgarbossa IMO.

And I would pull the trigger on that. Unprotected pick and all.

 

[Foppa2118]

A very good well written blog by Dater on meeting up with Scott Parker. In case some didn't catch it, Dater wrote a story about parker helping animals during the recent fires, and Parker tweeted him saying "hmmm..last time u wrote about me u called me a "goon."

Makes me wonder what Parker's side of the story on the Moore-Bertuzzi thing was though that Dater didn't get into, but I still don't particularly like what Parker said to MHH either.

http://blogs.denverpost.com/avs/201...iff-parker-and-living-to-tell-about-it/13834/

 

[Nihiliste]

If Vanek was added to the roster, and played next to Stastny. I'd say there is a good chance he returns to closer to 70 points as well. Sheesh, try to be a little flexible in how you look at it. It's not an exact comparison player for player. (Which would be nearly impossible when comparing any two teams IMO.)

I think taking one of the two or three most successful cores of the past 5 years and comparing ours to them is talking about huge leaps of faith in potential and is almost pointless to do. Everything you were saying drawing comparisons between this or that players potential and that could be done by half the teams in the league I know it's an oversimplification of what you're talking about but a lot of that sounds like a pretty long winded way of suggesting that we're only a couple pieces of away from having a Chicago type core. I'm sure SJ for example felt similarly all these years (with a lot better reason) and that obviously hasn't materialized into much. I understand what you're saying with rough comparisons, I just feel like it's setting the bar pretty high and I'd rather temper my expectations for this particular group of players.

I also don't really understand what's so funny about thinking their core forwards are far superior to ours - Duchene is the only forward we have with the ability of Kane/Hossa/Toews. I guess what it comes down to, is even if we put in a top pairing dman and first line winger, I don't thats turning this core from one with two 29th place finishes in the last 3 years into one that can take us within 3 games of their second cup in 4 years.

 

[Avs_19]

A very good well written blog by Dater on meeting up with Scott Parker. In case some didn't catch it, Dater wrote a story about parker helping animals during the recent fires, and Parker tweeted him saying "hmmm..last time u wrote about me u called me a "goon."

Makes me wonder what Parker's side of the story on the Moore-Bertuzzi thing was though that Dater didn't get into, but I still don't particularly like what Parker said to MHH either.

http://blogs.denverpost.com/avs/201...iff-parker-and-living-to-tell-about-it/13834/

I'd pay a lot of money to see what would happen if Dater actually sucker punched The Sheriff and tried to run.

 

[Foppa2118]

I'd pay a lot of money to see what would happen if Dater actually sucker punched The Sheriff and tried to run.

Something tells me he wouldn't be able to run very far if he did.

 

[22FUTON9]

Chicago's currently in the SC finals, and we're here debating on who to pick with our first overall pick. I'm sorry but the chicago comparison is just too much. Too much homerism. Comparing PAP to Pat Kane is just not right.

 

[Avalanche2133]

Would you do 1st overall this year for Ryan and Beauchemin/Fowler?

Ducks appear they need to lose a big contract after giving both Getzlaf and Perry 8 million each. They also really need a number 2 C. Can maybe do a deal with Stastny involved but I think he has a bounce back season and would like to see.

 

[CobraAcesS]

Comparing PAP to Pat Kane is just not right.

Are you serious? Obviously if your talking pure talent, but hey from game to game you have no idea if Kane is going to show up or not.

For most of the playoffs hes been soft, and pretty much disinterested.

I didn't say that Prenteau is more talented or even better than Kane, but I'll take Preanteau's consistent effort game in and game out.

75% of Chicago fans legitimately wanted Kane traded after the 11-12 season as well. When hes not scoring he does not do **** and is a waste of space.

Honestly, acting like Parenteau is some average 50 point forward is just not right. PA put up a 75 point pace this season, and 67 points in 80 games last season.

The only reason I even lined them up is because they are both pass first play-makers. I swear some people get a little ridiculous when it comes to flashy forwards. I'll take a guy that actually back-checks on a consistent basis and give up a couple points for better all around play any day of the week.

Talk about underrated...