Proposal: impact of phase 1 of draft on NYR and trade partners

[bernmeister]

Wings took a hit, back to 4OA.
One of NYR-CAR loses so unless I missed something NY has at least 12.5% chance for 1OA.

Deal 1 (package of a + b)
a) Trouba, NYR + CAR 2020 1sts + NYR 2021 1st + Smith, 4.35 next season
for
Seider, expiring ufas Howard + Erricsson [8m+ together] + Nielsen 5.25 2 seasons + DET 2021 2nd

also
b) Georgiev + Hajek + Rykov for DET 2nd

-----------
too much [1st rd picks, LDs + G] on the table for DET to say no and NY will add Seider to Fox, Nils L, w/Deangelo stop gapped at LD briefly before being unloaded for futures

============================================
Deal 2
Kravtsov + Buchnevich + Lias
for
Broberg + Neal + Pulj

I like krav a lot, and have viewed him as potential 1C material which helps Chytil deepen us at 3C. However, adding Broberg to Lindgren and ultimately K'Andre Miller, tho Reunanen and Robertson may have some say in that, is a faster timetable for NY.

Oil can experiment w/Krav in pivot also, but could be immediate Kreider-esque fit at W for McD. Plus they dump Neal for a top 6W. Neither Pulj nor Lias any big whoop, swap headaches.


3. NYR-SEA
sign Lindbom.
deal Lindbom + Huska provides possible start in net + Nielsen for SEA 6th, but also condition SEA must use exp dr pick on Neal.


gamble is Chytil = 1C
Kakko-Chytil-Panarin
Kreider-Zib-Pulj
Lemieux-Howden-Gauthier
Gettinger-Nieves-Fast/Lettieri/Baron

Shesty
Hank
Wall

let's see if we can have a polite discourse and keep this open at least until July 1, when likely Trouba will remain a Ranger.
Remember fun is not always in the destination, but the journey

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[Baksfamous112]

Carolina 1st round pick is protected. Seider isn’t worth that much either

 

[ToDavid]

I believe NYR gets the worst of the Canes pick and the Leafs pick that went to the Canes in the Marleau trade, so that pick won’t be 1OA. They’ll only have their 12.5% shot if they lose their series.

 

[mrmovies779]

None of these trades benefit the Rangers at all

 

[Flyer lurker]

1) Edit 3 1's and Trouba for Seider in DRW I would have to take and I don't want to move Seider.
.
2) I don't like at all from Rangers side. Kratsov I see as better prospect than Broberg all be it at a spot you are stronger. 1 for 1 swap isn't crazy. Buch all day over pool party and Anderson all day over Neal. Not because Anderson is a positive but that Neal is that much of a negative.

3)Seattle is in the cat bird's seat for team wanting them to take legit players on TBL list, JVR, etc as about 10 teams will be looking for salary cap help. Former 2nd round picks nice prospects won't get Seattle to take Neal. Going to take a lot more!

 

[Mickey Marner]

Detroit should take that deal and run. Excluding the nothing of value portions, it boils down to Trouba and three mid-1sts for Seider and an early 2nd.

 

[bernmeister]

Carolina 1st round pick is protected. Seider isn’t worth that much either

He isn't but I felt overpay nec and it serves NY purposes,, incl as to exp dr

 

[usekakkorightquinn]

Love

Wings took a hit, back to 4OA.
One of NYR-CAR loses so unless I missed something NY has at least 12.5% chance for 1OA.

Deal 1 (package of a + b)
a) Trouba, NYR + CAR 2020 1sts + NYR 2021 1st + Smith, 4.35 next season
for
Seider, expiring ufas Howard + Erricsson [8m+ together] + Nielsen 5.25 2 seasons + DET 2021 2nd

also
b) Georgiev + Hajek + Rykov for DET 2nd

-----------
too much [1st rd picks, LDs + G] on the table for DET to say no and NY will add Seider to Fox, Nils L, w/Deangelo stop gapped at LD briefly before being unloaded for futures

============================================
Deal 2
Kravtsov + Buchnevich + Lias
for
Broberg + Neal + Pulj

I like krav a lot, and have viewed him as potential 1C material which helps Chytil deepen us at 3C. However, adding Broberg to Lindgren and ultimately K'Andre Miller, tho Reunanen and Robertson may have some say in that, is a faster timetable for NY.

Oil can experiment w/Krav in pivot also, but could be immediate Kreider-esque fit at W for McD. Plus they dump Neal for a top 6W. Neither Pulj nor Lias any big whoop, swap headaches.


3. NYR-SEA
sign Lindbom.
deal Lindbom + Huska provides possible start in net + Nielsen for SEA 6th, but also condition SEA must use exp dr pick on Neal.


gamble is Chytil = 1C
Kakko-Chytil-Panarin
Kreider-Zib-Pulj
Lemieux-Howden-Gauthier
Gettinger-Nieves-Fast/Lettieri/Baron

Shesty
Hank
Wall

let's see if we can have a polite discourse and keep this open at least until July 1, when likely Trouba will remain a Ranger.
Remember fun is not always in the destination, but the journey

Love how you love to give our players away for nothing and ruin our team. Your Georgiev deal was hilarious. All that for a pick that turns out to be a good pro about 11% of the time. Oh lord.

 

[usekakkorightquinn]

How about this, the Rangers really don't need to make any deals. Essentially, draft two more young talents in the first round and just continue to develop the young talent they already have. Only deals I can see them make is for a legit 2nd line center or to move up in the draft. Other than that, they are in good shape. They don't need insane moves like you proposed.

 

[Ciao]

He isn't but I felt overpay nec and it serves NY purposes,, incl as to exp dr

You would be that desperate to move Trouba's contract?

Even Jets fans never approached anything like that.

If you were the Rangers GM and made that deal you would be legendary: and not in a good way!

 

[bernmeister]

...

1) Edit 3 1's and Trouba for Seider in DRW I would have to take and I don't want to move Seider.
Thanks yeah, like I said it is too much for them to pass up.
?s for NY are:
- would they be better not doing that deal?
Not if they want a value add and still diplomatically extricate from Trouba's $, not looking like jerks to the players b'c we took less to consider JT's position, and;
- how much less could they offer DET and still get that deal?
unclear.

2) I don't like at all from Rangers side. Kratsov I see as better prospect than Broberg all be it at a spot you are stronger. 1 for 1 swap isn't crazy. Buch all day over pool party and Anderson all day over Neal. Not because Anderson is a positive but that Neal is that much of a negative.
Yeah, I had this as Buch for Neal, a huge sweetener for Oil, with Lias and Jesse P coke for pepsi.
Very much on the fence about this one, as much as I want Broberg.
My recall on the selling of Krav is he is slighlty slower version of Kreider with better stickhandling, passing, vision and shot. He has played pivot in international competition and didn't look bad during that. But potential application aside he is ready as a W now.
In the end I concluded although another overpayment, getting a top LW exempt from exp dr [as is Krav] was worth it. Deangelo to LD briefly, w/$ and term in place, then move him for futures to support F development, as our D and G are finalized.


3)Seattle is in the cat bird's seat for team wanting them to take legit players on TBL list, JVR, etc as about 10 teams will be looking for salary cap help. Former 2nd round picks nice prospects won't get Seattle to take Neal. Going to take a lot more!
bit of a disagree here
those 2nd rounders are Gs who were tutored under Benoit Allaire, and in Lindbom's case, we think Rangers spent a mid 30s pick for him at Allaire's behest.
So by this time, Huska is ready to grab starter, and be pushed by Lindy. Not saying they have zero other options, but cheap young tandem in one fell swoop avoids them having to consider some of the expensive G retreads we all see.
Also Neal was beyond atrocious w/Flames, half decent w/Oil. Another yr burned off his deal, half retained by SEA, might get something for him. Maybe SEA 3rd + Neal at half for somebody's 2nd.

Peace out.

 

[drw02]

The wings aren’t trading seider. People don’t seem to understand how impressive he was as an 18 yo in the A this season. He’s one of the best D prospects in the nhl.

 

[bernmeister]

Love



Love how you love to give our players away for nothing and ruin our team. Your Georgiev deal was hilarious. All that for a pick that turns out to be a good pro about 11% of the time. Oh lord.

How about this, the Rangers really don't need to make any deals. Essentially, draft two more young talents in the first round and just continue to develop the young talent they already have. Only deals I can see them make is for a legit 2nd line center or to move up in the draft. Other than that, they are in good shape. They don't need insane moves like you proposed.

cap is a reality and that it is/will be at current level for next 3 yrs ish min is possible backbreaker.
I would love to have my concerns be unwarranted, for us t luck out, but today there is still risk.

As to moving up in the draft, there is moving up and there is moving up.
LAK need Byfield at 2OA to get heir for Kopitar.
They will not surrender such a highly rated foundation piece for ordinary level of ample depth and profit return.
We might get lucky and draft a Chytil w/our 1st, and we get 2 shots at that if we keep those picks.
But DET needs lot of help across the roster.
If there is enuf on the table, even w/major wince, they have to consider moving Seider, who is less total help but is a better bet.

btw, as to values, are you the one who says we should not moving Geo for less than A MID 1st AND a top prospect?
Late 1st or 2nd and a good prospect is acceptable.

 

[bernmeister]

You would be that desperate to move Trouba's contract?

Even Jets fans never approached anything like that.

If you were the Rangers GM and made that deal you would be legendary: and not in a good way!

Let's be fair and honest if ya wanna personalize this, which is ok.

If I were NY GM, I would not have made that deal that way.
I would not have accommodated Jets by trading for JT in advance of his deal.
Would have insisted you grant permission for me to negotiate e/him directly before.
While I would have preferred 7m per, I'd have given him his 8.
But consistent w/my remarks on the subject, no NMC for anyone, period, no exceptions.
Generous NTCs limiting to only a handful, then a few more teams, okay.
But can't allow total player control, ever, see Staal+Girardi.

Had we gone down that road, all this could be avoided b'c we would not be backed into a corner, which we are not today this min but could be in another 2 yrs even after big contracts come off the books

so....
tell it like it is [but the complete picture pls]
let your conscience be your guide

 

[bernmeister]

The wings aren’t trading seider. People don’t seem to understand how impressive he was as an 18 yo in the A this season. He’s one of the best D prospects in the nhl.

Entirely possible this is correct.
SY has to weigh if overpayment is too good to pass up, accelerate timetable to return to legit competition from hell, if he has to go there.
And as others have noted, there is such a level of overpay here.

 

[TGWL]

I don't think they're interested in moving a top prospect for mainly futures, and we are not interested in making a terrible trade.

 

[drw02]

Entirely possible this is correct.
SY has to weigh if overpayment is too good to pass up, accelerate timetable to return to legit competition from hell, if he has to go there.
And as others have noted, there is such a level of overpay here.

it’s not the type of overpay Detroit would be looking for to move seider, it’s a huge contract and 3 mystery boxes. Detroit needs quality young high end pieces not more decent-good quantity. It’s likely none of those 1sts would produce a prospect as good as Seider is. It’d take an overpay of a proven elite young NHL talent for Detroit to have any motivation to move him

 

[bernmeister]

it’s not the type of overpay Detroit would be looking for to move seider, it’s a huge contract and 3 mystery boxes. Detroit needs quality young high end pieces not more decent-good quantity. It’s likely none of those 1sts would produce a prospect as good as Seider is. It’d take an overpay of a proven elite young NHL talent for Detroit to have any motivation to move him

Fair enough, we agree to disagree.
As others noted, it is too much for Stevie Y to leave on the table.

Other point is while there has been some adjustment and Lindy Ruff in opinion of many has not helped, Trouba IS an established quality RD. He is not just a big salary.

In theoretical abstract all players have reward risk and projections of Seider as Hedman-lite are significant, but it doesn't mean that all those pieces from NY do not provide fast help in multiple areas, which DET needs to accelerate rebuild.