GDT: Hurricanes @ Capitals | 2/14/23 | 7:00p ET

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Misery74

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wasted breath……some people don’t understand the nuances….or they just don’t care to.
I would say maybe pay closer attention. Last night was a great example.

Snively scratched continuously, then banished.

Clearly 19, 92, and 77 should play every night. It’s the rest of the plugs he continues to put out there boggles the mind.

I would suggest you don’t understand the nuances, or maybe you don’t care.
 

CapitalsCupReality

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I could buy that. I do think it’s unfortunate that he’s been saddled with aging bags of ass. They generally look like a competent outfit when half the salary cap isn’t a boat anchor on the team.

BMac has to sell to Ted that either this team’s slow death over the last few seasons accelerates into an expensive and public death if they don’t trade some of the big names or they make bold moves with the goal of improving the team and helping Ovi get to Gretzky, even if casual fans will have heartburn seeing the guys whose jerseys they own leave town. Continuing the status quo is admitting they’re ok with getting worse and becoming irrelevant from a competitive standpoint.
This…..but no…..Lavi is the idiot….full career accomplished by smoke and mirrors…./eyeroll…..

The roster is the issue….all along that’s been the problem. Not sure why people choose to ignore this….
 

CapitalsCupReality

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I would say maybe pay closer attention. Last night was a great example.

Snively scratched continuously, then banished.

Clearly 19, 92, and 77 should play every night. It’s the rest of the plugs he continues to put out there boggles the mind.

I would suggest you don’t understand the nuances, or maybe you don’t care.
Snively has had nice games before….only to disappear mostly after….get back to me.

you can’t just bench $23 mil in salary and revered vets….and not expect the room to implode. This isn’t on Lavi to split the room….it’s on GMBM to retool the roster.
 
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AlexBrovechkin8

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I very much agree this is a flawed roster with too large of chunks of the salary cap drastically under performing.

But I also think Laviolette has had plenty of opportunities to make lemonade at various points in his tenure, and he has opted against it at almost every chance. He's buried young, quick forwards behind veterans repeatedly during his tenure. While it's hard to justify benching a Backstrom or Oshie, benching Hagelin or Eller or Raffl or Larsson isn't exactly going to destroy the locker room. This is a guy who gave a roster spot to Daniel Carr over Daniel Sprong in a playoff game. A guy who's put Mantha in a position to fail this season, with zero powerplay time and ever decreasing partners and ice time. A guy who's banished McMichael, Snively, and even Protas to the AHL before considering benching under-performing vets. A guy who keeps trying NAK on the top line. Laviolette's favorable treatment of veteran forwards over the youth and speed this team needs is well documented at this point.
You're not wrong but I also think you're leaving out the whole truth if you think this is strictly a Laviolette issue. This is an organizational issue that starts at the very top. You could change the name Laviolette to Trotz and change names like Daniel Carr and Daniel Sprong to Mike Richards and Jake Vrana or Tim Gleason and Nate Schmidt and it's the same conversations we've been having for 6, 7, 8, 10 years.

Laviolette didn't go sign or trade for Raffl or Carr or Larsson or Hagelin. He didn't hand out extensions to Oshie and Backstrom. He didn't trade Vrana for Mantha. He didn't sign Chara and trade Siegenthaler. He didn't play Stephenson as a 4th line wing. To what extent he was consulted in or requested bringing in some those guys you mentioned in is unclear but what is clear is that for the last decade, this team has prioritized veterans over young players at every step of the way. It's why Burakovsky asked for a trade. And Siegenthaler. And Stephenson. It's why Tom Wilson, drafted in 2012, is the most recent homegrown forward on the roster. Sure you have guys like Snively or Protas who are bouncing in and out of the lineup but they don't have a more recent draft pick playing meaningful minutes at forward than 2012 and that is a marked change from how this team used to operate.

If you want to fire Lavi for a fresh voice or because you don't think he's maximized the roster's potential then that's fine but this starts with Ted. He has no eye on the future for either the Capitals or the Wizards. He has condemned the Wizards to mediocrity because he refuses to look at what's best for the long term of the franchise and only operates on a year to year basis and that flows down to how Tommy runs the team. He's incapable of making short term sacrifices for the betterment of the team longer term. It's been the exact same with the Caps except the players he anchored that directive to are now old, broken, and mostly shitty so the strategy isn't working any more.

Bring in a new coach but still operate under Ted's philosophy and nothing systematically will change.
 

AlexBrovechkin8

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How about Eller? How about Sheary? How about MaJo? How about top line NAK? How about Irwin?

Not saying we bench them all, but they should be sitting regularly for young guys. Back to backs are great examples.

Bottom line, Laviolette is dogshit at mixing in youth. There is no reason at all those 5 guys should get jerseys every night.
You mean the same Sheary and MoJo who are second and third on this team in goals scored and who make a combined $2.6M this year? Those are the guys you have issue with? Maybe he wouldn't have to play NAK on the top line if either of his wingers making more than $5M a year were playing better than them.

Sure, get Eller the hell out of here (which I've been saying for two seasons now) and move NAK and Irwin around or scratch them occasionally but I think you're being disingenuous if you think those moves make this team appreciably better. That's like rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.
 
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Misery74

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This…..but no…..Lavi is the idiot….full career accomplished by smoke and mirrors…./eyeroll…..

The roster is the issue….all along that’s been the problem. Not sure why people choose to ignore this….
But when you have young guys available to you, and scratch them every night, how does Laviolette escape blame.

The coach puts the team down n the ice, and he doesn’t play youth.
 

AlexBrovechkin8

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I would say maybe pay closer attention. Last night was a great example.

Snively scratched continuously, then banished.

Clearly 19, 92, and 77 should play every night. It’s the rest of the plugs he continues to put out there boggles the mind.

I would suggest you don’t understand the nuances, or maybe you don’t care.
19, 92, and 77 are three of the biggest problems on this team. They are playing at plug level and they're making $23M collectively to do it. This is the problem, not NAK or Sheary or MoJo who are all playing well for what they're slotted to do. Not a lot of nuance needed to understand this. Your highest paid players have to be your best players or you're in trouble. Period.
 

Misery74

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19, 92, and 77 are three of the biggest problems on this team. They are playing at plug level and they're making $23M collectively to do it. This is the problem, not NAK or Sheary or MoJo who are all playing well for what they're slotted to do. Not a lot of nuance needed to understand this. Your highest paid players have to be your best players or you're in trouble. Period.
If your problem is older players, who make a lot of money, you need to mix in younger players, that barely make any money. Not double down with guys that haven’t scored in weeks.

Those guys you mentioned are all flawed by this time, and not playing well. But they are all under contract for years, they aren’t going anywhere. So why not change what can be changed?
 
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AlexBrovechkin8

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If your problem is older players, who make a lot of money, you need to mix in younger players, that barely make any money. Not double down with guys that haven’t scored in weeks.

Those guys you mentioned are all flawed by this time, and not playing well. But they are all under contract for years, they aren’t going anywhere. So why not change what can be changed?
Because it's not going to make a difference? What needs to be changed is the core issue of the problem, which is why I think they should sell. To be clear, I am also fine with selling guys like MoJo, Sheary, Eller, etc but subbing those guys out for Protas and Snively is not going to turn this team into a contender.

Also, to really hammer it home, Johansson has not been a problem. Sheary hasn't been very good in 2023 but he was terrific the first few months of the season. You are advocating subbing guys out who have been some of their better players which is why I don't think it makes sense. Now Eller and Irwin? Yeah, punt them yesterday for Protas and Alexeyev or Johansen but think about what you are saying... you are saying that the guys who are second and third on the team in goals should be scratched because we can't do anything about the guys making 5x their salary.
 

Misery74

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Because it's not going to make a difference? What needs to be changed is the core issue of the problem, which is why I think they should sell. To be clear, I am also fine with selling guys like MoJo, Sheary, Eller, etc but subbing those guys out for Protas and Snively is not going to turn this team into a contender.
We agree on this, they are done as contenders. But plenty of teams get “Dead Cat Bounces” from bringing in a new coach during the season.
 

itsjustsurvival

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Because it's not going to make a difference? What needs to be changed is the core issue of the problem, which is why I think they should sell. To be clear, I am also fine with selling guys like MoJo, Sheary, Eller, etc but subbing those guys out for Protas and Snively is not going to turn this team into a contender.

Also, to really hammer it home, Johansson has not been a problem. Sheary hasn't been very good in 2023 but he was terrific the first few months of the season. You are advocating subbing guys out who have been some of their better players which is why I don't think it makes sense. Now Eller and Irwin? Yeah, punt them yesterday for Protas and Alexeyev or Johansen but think about what you are saying... you are saying that the guys who are second and third on the team in goals should be scratched because we can't do anything about the guys making 5x their salary.

I think this is a good point. I have no issue with the guys making $2 million or less. Mojo Sheary Milano whoever are fine for the price. The depressing thing though is this bolded part. I agree with that. As much as I'd prefer those guys in the lineup versus some other people, it doesn't really move the needle. It's like 10 of their normal roster players and their first 4-5 callups are middle six tweeners at best.
 
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CapitalsCupReality

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Because it's not going to make a difference? What needs to be changed is the core issue of the problem, which is why I think they should sell. To be clear, I am also fine with selling guys like MoJo, Sheary, Eller, etc but subbing those guys out for Protas and Snively is not going to turn this team into a contender.

Also, to really hammer it home, Johansson has not been a problem. Sheary hasn't been very good in 2023 but he was terrific the first few months of the season. You are advocating subbing guys out who have been some of their better players which is why I don't think it makes sense. Now Eller and Irwin? Yeah, punt them yesterday for Protas and Alexeyev or Johansen but think about what you are saying... you are saying that the guys who are second and third on the team in goals should be scratched because we can't do anything about the guys making 5x their salary.
Yup this…..bitch about the peripheral players all you want…..but the core is not delivering…..that’s the issue….not Lavi playing Sheary or Mojo.
 

Hivemind

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You're not wrong but I also think you're leaving out the whole truth if you think this is strictly a Laviolette issue. This is an organizational issue that starts at the very top. You could change the name Laviolette to Trotz and change names like Daniel Carr and Daniel Sprong to Mike Richards and Jake Vrana or Tim Gleason and Nate Schmidt and it's the same conversations we've been having for 6, 7, 8, 10 years.

Laviolette didn't go sign or trade for Raffl or Carr or Larsson or Hagelin. He didn't hand out extensions to Oshie and Backstrom. He didn't trade Vrana for Mantha. He didn't sign Chara and trade Siegenthaler. He didn't play Stephenson as a 4th line wing. To what extent he was consulted in or requested bringing in some those guys you mentioned in is unclear but what is clear is that for the last decade, this team has prioritized veterans over young players at every step of the way. It's why Burakovsky asked for a trade. And Siegenthaler. And Stephenson. It's why Tom Wilson, drafted in 2012, is the most recent homegrown forward on the roster. Sure you have guys like Snively or Protas who are bouncing in and out of the lineup but they don't have a more recent draft pick playing meaningful minutes at forward than 2012 and that is a marked change from how this team used to operate.

If you want to fire Lavi for a fresh voice or because you don't think he's maximized the roster's potential then that's fine but this starts with Ted. He has no eye on the future for either the Capitals or the Wizards. He has condemned the Wizards to mediocrity because he refuses to look at what's best for the long term of the franchise and only operates on a year to year basis and that flows down to how Tommy runs the team. He's incapable of making short term sacrifices for the betterment of the team longer term. It's been the exact same with the Caps except the players he anchored that directive to are now old, broken, and mostly shitty so the strategy isn't working any more.

Bring in a new coach but still operate under Ted's philosophy and nothing systematically will change.

I don't think this is strictly a Laviolette issue, nor did I say it was. GMBM (and perhaps Ted) are certianly not blameless, and I have made my gripes with GMBM public on these boards repeatedly. However, I do think Laviolette is very much a big part of this issue, and he has done very little to suggest otherwise.

For as much as we complain about Trotz and others also having veteran pets, I find it very hard to see any of them as being worse than Laviolette has been in his DC tenure. While there were certainly rocky moments in youth development, Trotz still brought along plenty off skilled, young forwards. Kuznetsov, Burakovsky, and Vrana were given much more of an opportunity to learn and grow without being instantly stapled to the bench than prospects under Laviolette. Tom Wilson started to find his offensive game under Trotz (although the full bloom, at least in terms of regular season performance, came under Reirden). Trotz even had a lot more confidence in players like Brett Connolly than Laviolette gave Daniel Sprong. What young forward has blossomed under Lavi? I suppose a 30 year Nic Dowd has broken out under Laviolette, but that's about it.

Are other coaches perfect? Absolutely not. Nor do I believe that removing Laviolette will fix everything. But he's done little to acquit himself of the complaints against him, and I don't think any suggestion that he's simply been saddled with a bad situation holds a ton of water. GMBM has certainly given him an old and slow roster, but Lavi has refused to utilize the handful of tools he does have to change the situation.

Ultimately, I do want Laviolette fired, but for a confluence of a few reasons. Laviolette's selling point has always been the immediate results in the first couple years with a team. We didn't really experience that Lavi-bump, and it seems unlikely that he's going to reverse course on his career track record for this trend. It's not likely to improve going forwards. Moreover, he's not building towards future success (in either short-term or long-term). He's not pushing his assistants to find new ways to invigorate specific areas of concern (of note - the power play). He's not developing younger assets to step into the types of roles the team needs of them. And he's not producing the type of short-term results that could justify turning a blind eye to the lack of middle-and-long-term planning. I know people talk about Ovechkin not wanting to be part of a rebuild, but under Laviolette the team's trajectory is heading towards that same type of mediocrity and disappointment, only without any of the draft and prospect upside. I've moved beyond just wanting Laviolette replaced in the off-season (which seems more and more likely with the lack of extension in place for him), to wanting him fired in the coming days to see if the team has any chance of a rebound before the trade deadline to help set their course of the remainder of the season.
 

Misery74

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Yup this…..bitch about the peripheral players all you want…..but the core is not delivering…..that’s the issue….not Lavi playing Sheary or Mojo.
So what’s the answer? Do nothing? Change nothing?

The core are all under extended contracts. They are here to stay. The salary caps makes them our problem.

So, since they are all here, until they aren’t, maybe have someone else coach them. Maybe try them with some younger, faster players?
 

CapitalsCupReality

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So what’s the answer? Do nothing? Change nothing?

The core are all under extended contracts. They are here to stay. The salary caps makes them our problem.

So, since they are all here, until they aren’t, maybe have someone else coach them. Maybe try them with some younger, faster players?
I think we have to give GMBM a chance to right the ship and change the roster, and it might have to wait largely until summer.
 
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Empty Goal Net

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Ultimately, I do want Laviolette fired, but for a confluence of a few reasons. Laviolette's selling point has always been the immediate results in the first couple years with a team. We didn't really experience that Lavi-bump, and it seems unlikely that he's going to reverse course on his career track record for this trend. It's not likely to improve going forwards. Moreover, he's not building towards future success (in either short-term or long-term). He's not pushing his assistants to find new ways to invigorate specific areas of concern (of note - the power play). He's not developing younger assets to step into the types of roles the team needs of them. And he's not producing the type of short-term results that could justify turning a blind eye to the lack of middle-and-long-term planning. I know people talk about Ovechkin not wanting to be part of a rebuild, but under Laviolette the team's trajectory is heading towards that same type of mediocrity and disappointment, only without any of the draft and prospect upside. I've moved beyond just wanting Laviolette replaced in the off-season (which seems more and more likely with the lack of extension in place for him), to wanting him fired in the coming days to see if the team has any chance of a rebound before the trade deadline to help set their course of the remainder of the season.
And in assessing Lavi's short-term impact, we need to keep in mind who Lavi replaced. A former assistant coach who after being fired returned to being an assistant coach. Some will attribute the absence of a significant bump to the pandemic or some other factor. Regardless, it's time to move on from a bunch of guys on the current roster and from most if not all of the current coaching staff.
 

Raikkonen

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Not so hot take: The team plays better when injured or otherwise missing vets not because Laviolette is some sort of coaching genius that keeps the team on track but because Laviolette is forced to play younger, faster, hungrier players instead of slow, complacent vets.
speed and work rate are essential
 
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YippieKaey

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I think this and the last few comments are both true and unrealistic. It’s true they play better with guys who are younger, faster, healthier, and hungrier. They have multiple years of data to show that.

But, do you honestly think he has a choice in playing or benching Backstrom, Kuznetsov, Mantha, and Oshie? You think it’s possible for him to healthy scratch decent chunks of their cap space on a regular basis? Saying Lavi should be fired because he’s not scratching underperforming veterans for young guys is wild when almost all of his highest paid players are underperforming and he literally can’t ice a team due to the salary cap if he benched all of the vets that got outplayed by young guys.

This is a deeply flawed roster because guys like Backstrom, Kuznetsov, Oshie, and Mantha are not pulling their weight and because they’re missing four very important players at the moment. That is not the fault of Laviolette. Their best players have been guys who were brought in on prove it contracts or who are working to break into the league. If anything it shows that his system works because the young cats and new guys can come in and play well within it. They need to get rid of guys on retirement contracts who are stealing money at this point.

These two have pretty severe injury troubles though so can't blame them really. Mantha and especially Kuzy on the other hand....both healty
 

RedRocking

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Wait, when was that?

He's only played 19 games and he's got 10 points despite playing less than 12 minutes on average. Seems to me he's made the most of his limited opportunities.
I’m just going by memory here, so forgive me for not looking it up.

But I recall Snively bursting onto the scene last year with like 3 or 4 goals in his first handful of games, including at least one on the PP. There was a game against MTL where I think he had a couple.

They signed him to a nice two-way deal shortly after. It was a great story - the Herndon kid playing for the big club. He trailed off after that fast start. Lavi shuffled him around, but he wasn’t producing anymore. Not sure how long after that he got hurt (shoulder?) and was then shut down for the year. So I think the injury contributed to the feeling that he just faded after a fast start.

He started a few games this year, but in odd spots like the Dowd line. I remember him standing out in an otherwise embarrassing loss to FLA this past fall. So, hopefully he gets a sweater on Thursday, as the team needs his speed and offensive spark.
 

Neil Racki

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Wait, when was that?

He's only played 19 games and he's got 10 points despite playing less than 12 minutes on average. Seems to me he's made the most of his limited opportunities.
The Snively snub .. I just dont get.

Why resign him last year after he showed some spark and speed .. just to keep him down in Hershey?

Snively brings a sense of urgency in his play, fast, gets on the D on forecheck quickly .. so of course hes the type of player we dont want. We need more over 30 slow guys who have to dump a puck in when entering the zone bc they cant skate it in anymore.
 
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