How to fix the Playoff Format & Tanking Issue

Souker

Registered User
Feb 10, 2020
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The NHL is facing many challenges right now which were reportedly discussed in some of the last few GM meetings, notably:
  • Not enough teams in the playoffs. The number of teams in the league have went up but not the number of playoffs team.
  • Tanking. How to solve this?
  • Generating more revenue and viewership in the league, specially for some of the bottom teams in the league at the tail end of the season (low attendance and follower-ship).
  • (This point is not necessarily discussed by GMs but) there is definitely some frustration on the fan side with the current format of playoffs by division which penalizes teams in stronger divisions and takes away some of the point of finishing first in the conference for the sake of “rivalry”.

I’ve been following this league for decades and as a business major, have studied the NHL business model quite a bit as part of one of my researches (for what it’s worth, I documented a paper on the potential expansion of the NHL to Vegas and Seattle back in 2009).
This doesn’t mean I know the league’s business model, ownership dynamic and vision inside and out, but I’d like to think that I have some basic understanding of their business model and the CBA.
My proposed solution:

Playoffs:
1-6 of each conference automatically make it in the round of 16.
7 plays 10, 8 plays 9 in a best of 3 or 5 (further market study required) in a Wild-card play-in tournament to get one of the final 2 wildcard spots.
The team ranked first in each conference get to PICK their matchup among the 2 teams that won their wildcard matchup from their conference.
The other wildcard team that isn’t picked plays the 2nd of the conference (then 3vs6, 4vs5).

Objectives attainted:
  • More teams involved in the playoffs.
  • More revenue generated.
  • Better significance to finishing first of the conference.
  • More “buzz” around the wildcard teams and the matchup picked by the team finishing first. (Could you imagine what an upset would do in terms of buzz to the league if a team picked their matchup and lost? You wanted to create rivalry?)
  • More fair advantages to teams finishing top 4 in the conference.

Draft Tournament:
Bottom 8 teams in the league (based on overall NHL standing), get randomly drawn into matchups together (no conference or standing criteria).
This is a single knockoff 3 round tournament.
The 2 finalists of this mini-tournament will get the first 2 overall picks (winner gets first overall).
Everyone else that participated are ordered in the draft based on their final regular season standing regardless of how far they made it in the tournament. For example, this means that the team that finished last in the standings will get 3rd overall at worst if they don’t make it to the final (let’s say they got eliminated in the first round).

Note: For the first round matchups, the team lower in the standings should get home-ice for that single KO game.
For the semi final and final (since it’s a 3 round KO tournament), the team highest in the standings get the home ice.

Objectives attainted:
  • You make teams work for those sought after first 2 overall picks.
  • Cut down on tanking significantly as 8 teams have an equal opportunity for those 2 picks.
  • The teams that finish at the bottom of the league are still not too penalized as they can only drop 2 spots (doesn’t halt their rebuild).
  • Gives an opportunity for those lower-middle ranked teams to get competitive faster.
  • More revenue and buzz generated.

Overall:
When combining these 2 elements, the NHL would arguably create a more competitive environment, while giving more significance to the regular season performance.
Additionally, depending on whether they would go with a best of 3 or 5 format for the wildcard games, the league would generate more revenue with up to 17 additional games (or 13 if it’s a best of 3, which is personally my preference), without mentioning the buzz that it would create.
With this format, all but 4 teams would see some sort of action past the 82 game mark (whether it’s through the playoffs, wildcard play-ins or the Draft Tournament).
The wild card play-in and the draft tournament would be played at the same time.
If the league is indeed planning on expanding in the medium-term, this format becomes that much more interesting.
(On a side note, the league should consider making the preseason a little shorter and start the regular season by the end of September rather than in mid October). At the end of it all, the Stanley Cup final would take place a little earlier. (FYI most teams lose money on preseason games anyway).

Sorry for the long text but felt I had to be somewhat thorough about the explanations.
Curious to hear what people think of this proposal (constructive comments and feedback only please).

Thanks for reading.

 

These Are The Days

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May 17, 2014
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Return to the 1 vs 8 format, abolish the lottery. Playoffs should never have been messed with and we have a lottery because people actually bitched about the expansion (under 1992 rules) Senators being too bad. They ended up with arguably the biggest bust in history.

Just stop it. Teams deliberately tank for draft odds now
 

nturn06

Registered User
Nov 9, 2017
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2,953
Draft Tournament:
Bottom 8 teams in the league (based on overall NHL standing), get randomly drawn into matchups together (no conference or standing criteria).
This is a single knockoff 3 round tournament.
The 2 finalists of this mini-tournament will get the first 2 overall picks (winner gets first overall).
Everyone else that participated are ordered in the draft based on their final regular season standing regardless of how far they made it in the tournament. For example, this means that the team that finished last in the standings will get 3rd overall at worst if they don’t make it to the final (let’s say they got eliminated in the first round).

Note: For the first round matchups, the team lower in the standings should get home-ice for that single KO game.
For the semi final and final (since it’s a 3 round KO tournament), the team highest in the standings get the home ice.

Objectives attainted:
  • You make teams work for those sought after first 2 overall picks.
  • Cut down on tanking significantly as 8 teams have an equal opportunity for those 2 picks.
  • The teams that finish at the bottom of the league are still not too penalized as they can only drop 2 spots (doesn’t halt their rebuild).
  • Gives an opportunity for those lower-middle ranked teams to get competitive faster.
  • More revenue and buzz generated.
If I understand right, the 8th worst team in NHL would be the best suited to win the 1st OV, while the 9-10th place team would be in the draft tournament.

So down the stretch you would have teams in places 7-12 start tanking, wouldn't you?
Terrible teams would still be bad, but now you encourage better teams to start tanking much harder...
 

Souker

Registered User
Feb 10, 2020
240
205
Return to the 1 vs 8 format, abolish the lottery. Playoffs should never have been messed with and we have a lottery because people actually bitched about the expansion (under 1992 rules) Senators being too bad. They ended up with arguably the biggest bust in history.

Just stop it. Teams deliberately tank for draft odds now
It was 1v8 even when the league had under 30 teams. Now we have 32 and probably going to 34 sometime soon.
Makes sense to create a Play-In tournament at this point imo, specially considering that that aligns with what owners seem to want based on my understanding.
As for the lottery, I’m with you. My proposition completely eliminates the lottery and creates a competitive tournament to earn those first 2 picks.
I think we’re aligned
 

dgibb10

Registered User
Feb 29, 2024
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654
Return to the 1 vs 8 format, abolish the lottery. Playoffs should never have been messed with and we have a lottery because people actually bitched about the expansion (under 1992 rules) Senators being too bad. They ended up with arguably the biggest bust in history.

Just stop it. Teams deliberately tank for draft odds now
Ignoring the Penguins Lemeiux tank?
 

Souker

Registered User
Feb 10, 2020
240
205
If I understand right, the 8th worst team in NHL would be the best suited to win the 1st OV, while the 9-10th place team would be in the draft tournament.

So down the stretch you would have teams in places 7-12 start tanking, wouldn't you?
Terrible teams would still be bad, but now you encourage better teams to start tanking much harder...
Incorrect, because there is only such a small window between the Wild-card tournament and the Draft tournament (keep in mind, only 4 teams in the entire league wouldn’t be involved in one or the other). Would be very hard for teams to try to fix their position, definitely more challenging than the current system right now.
Also keep in mind that 8th from the bottom could be matched to 7th from the bottom, it’s a random draw.
And keep in mind that it’s a single elimination game and we know that in the NHL on any given night, any team can beat any team
 
Last edited:

Souker

Registered User
Feb 10, 2020
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205
The worst teams need the most help.

Just let teams tank. Why do people care so much about this?
This is a loser mentality in my opinion. Teams need to be competitive instead of purposely trying to lose. Nowhere else in the world but North American uses this system and it has more flaws arguably than the alternative.
At least with this system, the bottom teams have to try to put a competitive team together to end their season and try to win the draft tournament.
 

Ace

Registered User
Oct 29, 2015
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Any discussion of the “tanking issue” that doesn’t begin with eliminating trade protections, fixing the tax disparity and changing offer sheet compensation to reflect that a bad teams pick and a good teams pick don’t share the same value just because they are in the same round…isn’t interested in addressing the “tanking issue“.
 

nturn06

Registered User
Nov 9, 2017
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Incorrect, because there is only such a small window between the Wild-card tournament and the Draft tournament (keep in mind, only 4 teams in the entire league wouldn’t be involved in one or the other). Would be very hard for teams to try to fix their position, definitely more challenging than the current system right now.
Also keep in mind that 8th from the bottom could be matched to 7th from the bottom, it’s a random draw.

Lets see, between having a solid shot at picking lets say McDavid first overall, or a decent chance at Making the wild-card tournament, which one do you think teams would pick? In strong drafts, there would be a lot of tanking around the 8th-10th worst spots.

Also, in your system, it is unlikely but not impossible that the 8 worst teams in the league only include one team from a conference. In that case, the 8th worst team in the league would have a solid shot at the 1st OV pick while also making the Wild-card tournament and maybe the playoffs ;)

This is a loser mentality in my opinion. Teams need to be competitive instead of purposely trying to lose. Nowhere else in the world but North American uses this system and it has more flaws arguably than the alternative.
At least with this system, the bottom teams have to try to put a competitive team together to end their season and try to win the draft tournament.
Most years, the bottom teams in the league are just terrible, not all are tanking.
 

oXo Cube

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This is a loser mentality in my opinion. Teams need to be competitive instead of purposely trying to lose. Nowhere else in the world but North American uses this system and it has more flaws arguably than the alternative.
At least with this system, the bottom teams have to try to put a competitive team together to end their season and try to win the draft tournament.

Problem with this model is that the genuinely bad teams get fewer top picks while the teams closer to competitiveness get more, making the bad teams remain bad for longer.

It already takes far too long in the NHL for bad teams to draft their way back into competitiveness.
 

Souker

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Feb 10, 2020
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Lets see, between having a solid shot at picking lets say McDavid first overall, or a decent chance at Making the wild-card tournament, which one do you think teams would pick? In strong drafts, there would be a lot of tanking around the 8th-10th worst spots.

Also, in your system, it is unlikely but not impossible that the 8 worst teams in the league only include one team from a conference. In that case, the 8th worst team in the league would have a solid shot at the 1st OV pick while also making the Wild-card tournament and maybe the playoffs ;)


Most years, the bottom teams in the league are just terrible, not all are tanking.
In your hypothetical scenario it’s still as true in the current system. A team around 10th would more likely tank today in a year there is a McDavid available.
At least with the proposed system, there isn’t a gold rush to tank at the very bottom.
 

Souker

Registered User
Feb 10, 2020
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Problem with this model is that the genuinely bad teams get fewer top picks while the teams closer to competitiveness get more, making the bad teams remain bad for longer.

It already takes far too long in the NHL for bad teams to draft their way back into competitiveness.
I don’t necessarily agree. Teams drop in the draft all the time. In this model, a team can only drop up to 2 spots, which isn’t Any worse than today.
The main difference is that you force team to be compete for it rather than just continuously lose for the best odds.
Also it wouldn’t be such a terrible thing for a team around the 6-8 from the bottom to get it some years. If anything that will create competitive teams faster while the very bottom still get a very good pick as part of their rebuild
 

Chainshot

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As has been posted, the easiest way to get rid of “tanking“ is just have the worst team draft first. Stop incentivizing moving a position or two to increase the slim odds of moving up in a draft. Truly bad teams will still be bad and they should have the first opportunity at the best player available in a draft because that’s the easiest way, the fastest way, to move toward being competitive again. Play in options and all sorts of other gobbledygook is just more bullshit. Worst gets first, done.
 

Suntouchable13

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Dec 20, 2003
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1 vs 8 playoff format, none of that play in BS. 16 teams is plenty, even if they expand to 34 teams. Why do we need to involve so many teams? The regular season becomes even more meaningless. If you’re not good enough after 82 games, not in a top 8 position, sorry no playoff revenue for you. Also, players don’t care about draft position. To ask them to care about a draft tourney is not realistic.
 

biturbo19

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Jul 13, 2010
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That playoff format issue is easy. Just go back to 1 vs 8 seeding and let "rivalries" develop organically. We don't need more teams in the playoffs. Bad teams already get in every year. The regular season already means little enough and is too long as it is. No need to undermine the importance of that even further by letting even more teams into the dance.


As far as tanking goes...who cares? Honestly, the worst teams need the most help. It more or less functions as intended, to try to promote parity. The reality is...when teams "tank" out...they often end up stuck there for a lot longer than intended. It's something a team does at their own potential peril...and typically because they just don't have much of a choice.
 

Romang67

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What possible motivation would players have to compete in a draft tournament? Especially the upcoming free agents that I assume wouldn't be traded as rentals since they all of a sudden could be the difference maker in getting to pick first overall.
 

PoutineSp00nZ

Electricity is really just organized lightning.
Jul 21, 2009
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The worst teams need the most help.

Just let teams tank. Why do people care so much about this?

Worst teams deserve the best prospects.

I could be talked into expanded playoffs and some form of play-in though. More revenue for teams and players.

Not sure how this hasn't happened yet to be honest.
 

oXo Cube

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What possible motivation would players have to compete in a draft tournament? Especially the upcoming free agents that I assume wouldn't be traded as rentals since they all of a sudden could be the difference maker in getting to pick first overall.

"Hey guys we need you to go win some games so that we can draft some better players to replace you with."
 

Kupo

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The last 1st OA that won a Cup was MacKinnon, who was drafted in 2013 and won in 2022. Prior to that, Stamkos, drafted in 2008, finally won cups in 2020+2021.

McDavid and Matthews, drafted 1st OA in 2015 and 2016, haven't won Cups yet either.

If a team wants to tank, let them f***ing tank. It's not a blueprint to success.
 

Ted Hoffman

The other Rick Zombo
Dec 15, 2002
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The worst teams need the most help.

Just let teams tank. Why do people care so much about this?
Because people demand someone assuage their hurt feelings.

One of the mods should merge this in with any number of past threads on this topic, we can see if any new ground is broken or if it's the usual rehash of the same dumb ideas.
 

Romang67

BitterSwede
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The last 1st OA that won a Cup was MacKinnon, who was drafted in 2013 and won in 2022. Prior to that, Stamkos, drafted in 2008, finally won cups in 2020+2021.

McDavid and Matthews, drafted 1st OA in 2015 and 2016, haven't won Cups yet either.

If a team wants to tank, let them f***ing tank. It's not a blueprint to success.
Well, there you go. This proposal solves the issue of #1 overalls having to go to shitty teams, by instead letting them go to potentially the best team in the bottom 8 every year.
 

kevsh

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Nov 28, 2018
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The tanking issue can be mostly resolved by limiting the number of times a team can get the top pick/2nd/3rd over a specified number of years.

E.g. The simplest version: Teams draft based on position, no lottery. A team can only draft in the top 3 twice every 5 years, and 1st only once over the same period. If a team finishes in the bottom 3 (or last) over their limit they are simply bumped out of the top 3 (1st -> 4th, 2nd -> 5th, 3rd -> 6th). Open to tweaks- I get there are some flaws in my example - but that's the idea.

Of course a team that is still eligible for the top pick could still tank when the newest generational player comes along, but given that those players are still rare and that will be it for them for awhile based on the criteria above (to qualify to get him they haven't got the top pick at all or drafted in the top 3 more than once in the past 5 years, and after they get their McDavid they can't get the top pick again for the next 5).
 

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