How much longer do you think physical games will be a thing?

Papa Francouz

Registered User
Nov 25, 2013
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Denver, CO
It's never going to happen, consoles are closed systems by design. Playstation Store (or any console digital store) will never have competition within their own market because they won't allow it. PC is an open system so there's nothing stopping all these store fronts from popping up and doing whatever they want. I've been exclusively a PC gamer for probably close to 10 years now and haven't bought a physical PC game in that time. I don't even want a physical copy of anything. I can find store fronts competing with each other for a cheaper copy. I personally don't even buy many games directly from Steam since you can often find them cheaper on GMG or Humble Store.

Playstation's just going to say "f*** you, you want it, $60."

Good point, I hadn't considered the actual marketplaces being owned and operating by the company that made the console. The consumer is shit out of luck at that point, unless the company decides to be kind and release games for free, which they more than likely won't do. I'm sure it's happened before, but only after the original run of a game is finished, and after the game stopped bringing in regular revenue for the company, so years after its release.

I recently built myself a nice gaming PC, and I'm in the same boat as you. I don't plan on getting a PS5 or Xbox for a long time, and by that I mean once their exclusives are on sale and the console has seen a drop in price. PC gaming offers too many options and too many sales for me to go back, as well as better visuals and much better performance. I'm always going to be a Nintendo fanboy, though, and I'll be content as long as their consoles don't cost an egregious amount and as long as their exclusive titles continue to be super high quality.
 

Hammettf2b

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Jul 9, 2012
22,560
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Two things:

1. If the prices are similar then I'd rather always buy physical whether that be music or games.

2. On the upcoming gen, I doubt the storage space will be big enough to justify getting rid of physical games (which save you storage space). My PS3 games for example have small installation sizes of less than 5GB usually for physical games yet I still ran out of hard drive space and had to upgrade to a 500GB SSD because the included 240GB drive wasn't enough. On PS4, the game download sizes for digital only are in the 40GB+ range and it initially came with only 500GB I think. The PS5 will come out with what, 2TB max and probably even bigger game sizes?
The game size is the same whether it's from a disk or digital. You ever wonder why it takes forever while first putting in a disk? Its because its installing all that data. Theres no difference in storage space. The games don't play from the disk.
 

Static

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Feb 28, 2006
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The frustration of having to buy the game again isn't remotely the issue being discussed, though.

It isn't NECESSARILY about ownership of the asset for me either-- ownership is just the most practical and straightforward method I can think of for getting what I ideally would appreciate and find just. Where I would differ from what you're saying is that the experience that I want to be paying for isn't a single-serving experience that's only available for a limited time, but rather a cumulative lifetime experience that can be revisited and refined and fully appreciated as needed. That single-serving experience isn't lost once the game is over, but it's certainly incomplete and is only a fraction of the thing's overall worth, IMO (a huge chunk of which WOULD be lost if it's only available when it's hot).

If, hypothetically, there were a non-profit-motivated public library that reliably and permanently preserved every videogame in existence forever-- one that had the right intentions in mind, that could be trusted, and that I had direct access to, I probably wouldn't see any value in owning anything and this would all be moot. But that's not the case. Instead, I find the principle behind merely having the privilege to access/rent something as long as it still financially benefits the companies that own them to be a completely gross idea that is not at all satisfactory to me. If the ideal hypothetical case isn't possible (it's only barely manageable in the form of emulation, which isn't going to continue to be a thing if companies have complete control and restrictions on their games), then the next best thing would be to let me manage my own library (which requires owning it), as I trust myself more than I trust the company (or the demands of the masses, which don't align with my preferences) to actually value the things that I find most valuable.

That's basically where I'm coming from. Don't get me wrong, like anyone else, I'll often find myself going along with the system, but in principle, I absolutely don't support it, feel good about that, or find the direction to be a positive. I'd be willing to pay more to do it the other way, personally.

Edit: Just as another example, if, hypothetically, the current/upcoming system is how things always worked from the start, a fantastic game like Mother 3 would probably be completely inaccessible to anyone who didn't purchase it when it came out, there's a chance that it wouldn't be playable due to controls and restrictions to even the people who did own it, and the chances of it never being emulated (without open, physical copies existing) would also be significantly greater. It would probably just be tragically lost in time, and that's with a game that virtually everyone agrees is great, let alone truly obscure gems or things that companies like Nintendo decide they no longer want to associate their branding with (whether due to subject matter or politics in the case of PT).
I understand the sentiment of not trusting the companies who are selling you digital games to keep the ecosystem in place for them to work. They can't be trusted for that. Even still, I think you are a small portion of the gamer base that feels how you do about playing games over again for both attention span reasons as well as logistical reasons. I personally don't have enough space to keep consoles and physical games or the desire to continuously mess with my media setup in order to play them, unless shit is just being emulated on a PC. But even then, you're just back at square one because that is all digital anyway.

So, I think you have an uphill battle in front of you.
 

Shareefruck

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Apr 2, 2005
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Vancouver, BC
I understand the sentiment of not trusting the companies who are selling you digital games to keep the ecosystem in place for them to work. They can't be trusted for that. Even still, I think you are a small portion of the gamer base that feels how you do about playing games over again for both attention span reasons as well as logistical reasons. I personally don't have enough space to keep consoles and physical games or the desire to continuously mess with my media setup in order to play them, unless shit is just being emulated on a PC. But even then, you're just back at square one because that is all digital anyway.

So, I think you have an uphill battle in front of you.
Oh, absolutely-- I have no illusions about the situation improving or catering to me. It's the unfortunate reality of games that favors endless immediate consumption rather than long term appreciation, I just happen to think it stinks. And again, I have zero problems with digital over physical in theory. I just worry that emulation as a preservation alternative isn't sustainable as companies gain more control over their closed systems. Coders realistically aren't going to be able to emulate games that are streamed, for example (because there's zero access to the source), so it feels like we're moving away from great games being meaningfully preserved the way that great films or music can be (other than the really really famous crowd-pleasers that will always be re-issued and re-made).

Personally, I don't care for videogames as an entertaining distraction to help pass the time with and that just continually replaces itself with new stuff (which is what these systems basically cater to), I care to pick out the exceptions throughout history that I find exceptionally worthwhile as creative works and have a lifetime appreciation for them.

It's just like how, as a music fan, you would never be like "Okay, well, I've listened to this album that's a front-to-back timeless masterpiece for ten years, I guess that's plenty and there's no reason for it to exist anymore-- there's new stuff to listen to afterall!"-- That'd be utterly tragic (especially for future generations who wouldn't have a chance to experience it even if they wanted to).
 
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Osprey

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Feb 18, 2005
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While it contained a digital store front Stadia's aim and purpose was to be a streaming service. In the PC/console argument of apples and oranges Stadia was a pear.

Yeah, Stadia didn't fail because it was all digital. Steam is all digital and has been a massive success. It failed because it tried a different way of delivering the games to you: streaming them to you instead of the client downloading and installing them. I wouldn't be surprised if Valve kicked around the idea of streaming games and ultimately decided that its customers wouldn't be interested.
 

saluki

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Nov 18, 2017
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Valve definitely streams some games.

I know for certain they stream Oblivion, for instance.
 

KeithIsActuallyBad

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While it contained a digital store front Stadia's aim and purpose was to be a streaming service. In the PC/console argument of apples and oranges Stadia was a pear.
Fair enough, but you still can't really share games unless they're tied to your account, which creates a whole other set of issues.
 
Jan 21, 2011
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Massachusetts
I really like having the physical disc, makes it a lot easier to go back and play older games.

I do this all of the time for PS1/PS2. Recently found a retro gaming store that can buff out the scratches so I'm set for life.

I just saw this, I'm just asking to clarify. Are you saying you can buy a game, the license expires, and you lose it? There are games that get taken off digital store fronts because the license expired but if you buy it, you keep it forever. Steam will allow you to download any game that you purchased whether it's still on the store or not. I got the original Prey like 10 years ago right before it got removed from Steam. I can still download it today if I want.

For mobile games this is a huge problem. I bought FIFA14 for Android years ago on my Galaxy s3 and purchased the license to buy all the extra features. On my Galaxy Note 10, I can download FIFA14, but because the license is expired, I can't re-download all the extra features I got years ago! It will just say 'Server Down', and is such a a hassle if I wanted to replay the game at it's full value
 
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saluki

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Nov 18, 2017
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Same thing happened to me with Icewind Dale.

When I bought a new phone it disappeared from my account.
 
Jan 21, 2011
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Massachusetts
Same thing happened to me with Icewind Dale.

When I bought a new phone it disappeared from my account.

If you have android it should still be there under the 'All Apps' tab on the Play Store(?). iOS is the biggest culprit where older apps won't play due to the 'Contact developer to update app to iOS X'
 

RandV

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If you have android it should still be there under the 'All Apps' tab on the Play Store(?). iOS is the biggest culprit where older apps won't play due to the 'Contact developer to update app to iOS X'

I don't do mobile gaming, but I'd imagine this issue is exasperated by annual phone releases creating much more frequent OS updates which put a shorter shelf life on older software? Because this happens on PC too, except OS releases are more like 5 years apart and there's typically backwards compatibility for at least the previous version or 2, so it becomes barely noticeable on PC from when people started getting into Steam.

And on your other post, PS2 DVD's are pretty good but I've had serious issue with PS1 CD deterioration. Not just from mishandling and scratches but these are my own games just sitting in CD sleeves for years. They fall under the category of 'just because you own it doesn't mean its permanent'.
 
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guinness

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I don't do mobile gaming, but I'd imagine this issue is exasperated by annual phone releases creating much more frequent OS updates which put a shorter shelf life on older software? Because this happens on PC too, except OS releases are more like 5 years apart and there's typically backwards compatibility for at least the previous version or 2, so it becomes barely noticeable on PC from when people started getting into Steam.

And on your other post, PS2 DVD's are pretty good but I've had serious issue with PS1 CD deterioration. Not just from mishandling and scratches but these are my own games just sitting in CD sleeves for years. They fall under the category of 'just because you own it doesn't mean its permanent'.

Some of the CD-R's I burnt 20 years ago still work, although I fully expect the dyes to eventually fail. The PS1 laser unit is trash through, I think I'm on my 3rd one.

While I know piracy is frowned upon, there is a legitimate reason for abandonware, emulation, the cost of original hardware is getting more expensive (COVID causing boredom at home?), drives fail, discs go bad, get lost, limited space, etc.

Even old trash Win98 laptops are going for several hundred on eBay.

I have a ODE for my Dreamcast, and while that system was the poster child of run whatever disc, I likely can't find replacement parts for it ad infinitum, although I think I've seen some people on reddit replace like every original part on it by now. I have a action replay copy for my Saturn, because original Saturn games are pricey, something like Panzer Dragoon Saga is about $1000.
 

ItsFineImFine

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Aug 11, 2019
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Ongoing issue on the PS3 (and I think Vita or something too) where people can't download the most recent 18 or so games that they bought. And Sony hasn't even acknowledged that it's a known problem so yeah, I'm pretty uneasy about owning digital-only games.
 

Bruins4Lifer

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Jun 28, 2006
8,759
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Regina, SK
All my gaming is on PC now, so it's been all digital for a long time for me. Can't even remember the last hard copy game I bought, maybe Diablo III?

With the PS5 coming out soon I hope it leads to PC gaming requiring SSDs for new releases. Make storage more efficient instead of ~100 GB games and all that duplicated data needed for HDDs.
 

saluki

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Nov 18, 2017
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397
I still remember the last physical game I bought.

It was that alternate history Scarface game. I bought a used physical copy off of Amazon like 2-3 years ago. Unfortunately my Win XP laptop was not quite powerful enough to play it comfortably. I got to the part where you cruise around the city but it was too choppy and I eventually gave up.
 

Desdichado93

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Jan 7, 2012
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All my gaming is on PC now, so it's been all digital for a long time for me. Can't even remember the last hard copy game I bought, maybe Diablo III?

With the PS5 coming out soon I hope it leads to PC gaming requiring SSDs for new releases. Make storage more efficient instead of ~100 GB games and all that duplicated data needed for HDDs.

The last time I bought a physical copy was in 2009 and it was Empire:Total War but I then had to download the entire game from Steam anyway.
 

RandV

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The last time I bought a physical copy was in 2009 and it was Empire:Total War but I then had to download the entire game from Steam anyway.

That's the game I made the switch to digital on. Was excited for it so on release date went around to a few EB Games (Gamespot) and nobody had it. Bought it on Steam and never looked back... also never knew that if I did get a copy I'd have to download it on Steam anyway.

An important point of distinction in digital vs physical in regards to the PC sphere is that physical retailers themselves abandoned the market first. When I started PC gaming in '99 it got just as much shelf space at EB as any of the consoles. 10 years later shelving space devoted to PC was practically non-existent in store. Then Steam took over the PC industry and practically resurrected it with their digital storefront.
 

Frankie Spankie

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Feb 22, 2009
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Dorchester, MA
Valve definitely streams some games.

I know for certain they stream Oblivion, for instance.
What? Steam doesn't let you stream games from their server unless you mean like remote play or streaming to another device in your own personal network. You still have to download every game and have a machine to run it on.
 
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saluki

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Nov 18, 2017
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I don't know if they've been testing streaming on older games or what but I know my Oblivion game was streaming.

My character would suddenly stop and walk in place. It was very frustrating because I had to quit the game and restart every time it happened. Then I noticed that the times he was freezing in place coincided with my fritzy internet going in and out. It wasn't a coincidence; the same thing happened over and over again.

It's clear as day that the game was being streamed. Again - why exactly it was being streamed I'm not sure.

It's happened on other games as well, just not as clearly and on Oblivion.
 

Supermassive

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Feb 19, 2007
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I don't know if they've been testing streaming on older games or what but I know my Oblivion game was streaming.

My character would suddenly stop and walk in place. It was very frustrating because I had to quit the game and restart every time it happened. Then I noticed that the times he was freezing in place coincided with my fritzy internet going in and out. It wasn't a coincidence; the same thing happened over and over again.

It's clear as day that the game was being streamed. Again - why exactly it was being streamed I'm not sure.

It's happened on other games as well, just not as clearly and on Oblivion.

sounds like you maybe didn’t have offline mode enabled. I’m not an expert though.
 

saluki

Registered User
Nov 18, 2017
730
397
I haven't dealt with the steam offline/online thing in a long time. It was a pain at one time iirc, in the 2000s. I know that when I try to start a game nowadays when my internet is out it asks whether I want to start offline. That's pretty much it. But I've never had a game quit because my internet went out (I never played those internet only titles like Diablo 3 and the newest SimCity which would quit if you got disconnected).

But if steam ended my game because I lost connection wouldn't the game simply quit? Why would my character get stuck walking in place?

I think, and it's only my opinion, that steam HAS experimented with streaming games. Maybe to test the feasibility of going full streaming at some point in the future.
 

Srsly

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Feb 8, 2011
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I have mixed feelings on the matter. While I recognize the impact on reduction of waste that comes with physical media, I also tend to resell consoles and games at the end of their life span. There’s certain titles that I try to avoid purchasing digitally(First party Nintendo titles) while others such as the NHL series don’t retain value and don’t really warrant a physical purchase.

I also feel bad for rural gamers. I grew up on rural Ontario and didn’t have access to a high speed connection. My parents still live out there and have similar problems. Until rural areas get a real solution(it’s not satellite or lte) I don’t feel a physical media free world is possible.
 

Gnova

CowboysR^2
Sep 6, 2011
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For the past 5+ years the only time I have puchased a physical game is as a gift (this is still pretty relevant I think) or obscure PS3 titles that never made it to the PSN store.
The amount of money I have save by not paying sales tax and purchasing a large percentage of my games when they are on sale dwarfs any money I would get back by selling them used, and I still have the game.
Also physical media is clutter. I used to hate having a large part of my living room taken up by shelving used to hold my DVDs/VHS, CDs, LPs, and games.

I also think people forget how buggy games that aren't patched over the first couple of months are. It is great having the physical disc for prosperity sake but the game is likely a buggy mess and would likely ruin your memory of the game more than help it.

I realize that if I didn't have uncapped high speed internet my opinion may be different.
 

Big McLargehuge

Fragile Traveler
May 9, 2002
72,188
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S. Pasadena, CA
I've been 50/50 for basically this entire generation and I'd prefer to keep things that way. There are certain games I want to have a physical representation of, there are those that I'm uncertain about and may re-sell, and there are certain games I don't give a shit about one way or another.

The biggest change in my gaming purchasing habits just comes down to the digital storefronts replacing physical ones. I buy far more games on sale on eShops now than I've ever bought used games since the days of the Dreamcast.

Selling the games I'd already played was how I was able to afford like 90% of the games I played growing up, so...eh. Tough mindset to fully kick.
 

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