How do teams get rights to undrafted players?

[Tage2Tuch]

I feel like a moron for not knowing how Chicago comes to get panarin or the Sabres new prospect who got a couple assists said undrafted ......?

Someone please help
?

Is everyone from the khl or other leagues just fair game I mean if this is the case why are third or second round draft picks so important to gms? If you can just go and sign someone else ? But if it's not that way then how is it determined can someone please enlighten me because Google didn't work. Thanks!!!

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[Marc the Habs Fan]

They were UFA's not eligible to be drafted anymore.

Players in Europe can be drafted up until age 21.

It's age 20 for North Americans.

 

[Big McLargehuge]

Unrestricted free agency is just that, unrestricted.

Once you're past the age of being draft eligible and you're out of contract you're fair game.

To use an example the Penguins just signed Ethan Prow out of St. Cloud State. Prow just finished his senior year and was never drafted, so once his season ended he was free to sign anywhere he wanted. Had Prow been drafted but wanted to test free agency he'd have had to wait until the August 15 deadline, when drafting teams' exclusive rights expire (like Vesey is doing).

Generally speaking there's only a handful of relevant players that reach this stage each year, and situations like Panarin are so special because they're so rare.

There is part of me that misses drafting 29 year-old Czech guys in the 9th round for the sheer randomness of it, but we haven't seen that since the 2004-05 lockout.

 

[Tage2Tuch]

Unrestricted free agency is just that, unrestricted.

Once you're past the age of being draft eligible and you're out of contract you're fair game.

To use an example the Penguins just signed Ethan Prow out of St. Cloud State. Prow just finished his senior year and was never drafted, so once his season ended he was free to sign anywhere he wanted. Had Prow been drafted but wanted to test free agency he'd have had to wait until the August 15 deadline, when drafting teams' exclusive rights expire (like Vesey is doing).

Generally speaking there's only a handful of relevant players that reach this stage each year, and situations like Panarin are so special because they're so rare.

There is part of me that misses drafting 29 year-old Czech guys in the 9th round for the sheer randomness of it, but we haven't seen that since the 2004-05 lockout.

Okay, clears it up a bit more but I guess I still am left to wonder how some teams just go on singing players here and here while other gms who have cap room and need talent don't, it's hard to understand really for me anyway...

 

[Leafs]

Okay, clears it up a bit more but I guess I still am left to wonder how some teams just go on singing players here and here while other gms who have cap room and need talent don't, it's hard to understand really for me anyway...

UFA's choose where they go so I guess they dont want to go to certain teams. Doesn't mean the GM isnt trying to sign those players

 

[Brodeur]

Okay, clears it up a bit more but I guess I still am left to wonder how some teams just go on singing players here and here while other gms who have cap room and need talent don't, it's hard to understand really for me anyway...

There's also limitations defined by the CBA as to what type of contracts players can receive. Here's an article which describes several elements of the CBA: http://www.wingingitinmotown.com/2013/6/14/4414710/getting-to-know-the-cba-episode-2-the-draft

18-21: 3-year deal
22-23: 2-year deal
24: 1-year deal
25-27 (EUROPEANS ONLY) - 1-year deal

The CBA also caps guaranteed money in ELCs, but teams can offer bonuses (which for most players won't be attainable). So if there's a 22 year old NCAA free agent, teams aren't able to offer (for instance) a four year deal for 10 million guaranteed. It would have to be a two year, two way deal.

Most of the undrafted guys who are getting offers are going to want to go into situations where they feel like they fit the best. In the vast majority of cases, many undrafted players are going to have to start in the minors.

The other limiting factor is that teams can have 50 contracts max. So teams have to be a little judicious with handing out deals.

And another thing is that most undrafted UFAs are going to end up being minor league depth. Some teams would rather preserve those contract slots for drafted prospects and/or future trades.

 

[Limekiller]

Also, sometimes teams simply don't sign their draft picks to contracts, which gives them freedom to go wherever they want. That's what happened with Joonas Donskoi that the Sharks signed (and who would be in serious Calder consideration if this were a normal year). Florida drafted him in 2010, but never signed him. So, once he was a free agent, he could choose where he wanted to go, and agreed to sign with the Sharks.

 

[NHL RankKing]

There is also a limit to the number of players an NHL team can have signed under a contract (I think it's 50).
For every UFA you sign, that eats up one of your contracts so teams need to be careful if they're approaching the max

 

[tony d]

As others have said they passed the age of being eligible for the draft.

 

[Atas2000]

Okay, clears it up a bit more but I guess I still am left to wonder how some teams just go on singing players here and here while other gms who have cap room and need talent don't, it's hard to understand really for me anyway...

You need scouting. A GM in NA can't possible know enough about every player playing hockey in the world, so somebody has to be able to say "there is that guy we should give a closer look". That means a team must invest into proper scouting.

Then the player you talk about are UFA. They can choose a team absolutely freely. Even an absurd "my girlfriend doesn't want to move to that city" can have an effect on it. So the teams have to convince a player not vice versa.

And obvously the organisation's image is important. That's why Chicago got Panarin. SC Champion, SC contender and the probably hinted they plan to put him together with Kane. They won the race. They were definitely not the only team interested. But there were also obviusly some teams not informed enough togo after Panarinat all.

It's the real world. Nobody is perfect.

 

[Pyromaniac]

Let's say a team likes a player but just not enough to draft him. Do they have to wait till he is 20 in order to sign him. I do remember draft eligible but passed over players sign with NHL teams. How does this work? Is there a period where a team can sign these undrafted under 20 year player. Like Hicketts from Detroit who was undrafted plays in the WHL is less than 20 but the Wings signed him.

 

[Marc the Habs Fan]

Let's say a team likes a player but just not enough to draft him. Do they have to wait till he is 20 in order to sign him. I do remember draft eligible but passed over players sign with NHL teams. How does this work? Is there a period where a team can sign these undrafted under 20 year player. Like Hicketts from Detroit who was undrafted plays in the WHL is less than 20 but the Wings signed him.

You can sign a guy at age 18 or 19 but I believe it's not something you can throughout the calendar year. There's a window.

Flyers stole Phil Myers as a FA signing last fall when he was 18 and could have been picked in the 2015 draft.

 

[mouser]

Article 8.9 covers draft-related UFAs.

CBA 8.9 Eligibility for Play in the League. No Player shall be eligible for play in the League unless he:

(a) had been claimed in the last Entry Draft, or was ineligible for claim under Section 8.4; or

(b) had been eligible for claim in the last Entry Draft, but was unclaimed, and:

(i) had played hockey in North America the prior season and was age 20 or older at the time of the last Entry Draft, and signed an SPC which was signed and registered with the League between the conclusion of the Entry Draft and commencement of the next NHL Season.

(ii) had played hockey in North America the prior season and was under age 20 at the time of the last Entry Draft, and signed an SPC which was signed and registered with the League between the conclusion of the Entry Draft and commencement of the Major Juniors season (except that if such Player had signed an NHL try-out form, which was signed and registered with the League during the aforesaid time period, then the deadline for signing and registering with the League an SPC with such try-out Club shall be the commencement of the NHL Season).

(iii) had played hockey outside of North America in the prior season and was age 22 or older at the time of the last Entry Draft and signed an SPC which was signed and registered with the League between the conclusion of the Entry Draft and the commencement of the next NHL Season.

(iv) The words "eligible for claim in the last Entry Draft" in subparagraph (b) above mean "eligible for claim in all rounds of the last Entry Draft." The words "the prior season" in subparagraph (i), (ii) and (iii) above mean "a full season prior to the last Entry Draft."

Additionally CBA 8.4 details that players over the draft age limits are eligible to join the league as UFA's under Article 10.1(d).

CBA 8.4 Eligibility for Claim.

(a) All Players age 18 or older are eligible for claim in the Entry Draft, except:

(i) a Player on the Reserve List of a Club, other than as a try-out;

(ii) a Player who has been claimed in two prior Entry Drafts;

(iii) a Player who previously played in the League and became a Free Agent pursuant to this Agreement;

(iv) a Player age 21 or older who: (A) has not been selected in a previous Entry Draft and (B) played hockey for at least one season in North America when he was age 18, 19, or 20 and shall be eligible to enter the League as an Unrestricted Free Agent pursuant to Article 10.1(d); and

(v) a Player age 22 or older who has not been selected in a previous Entry Draft and shall be eligible to enter the League as an Unrestricted Free Agent pursuant to Article 10.1(d).

 

[Brodeur]

Let's say a team likes a player but just not enough to draft him. Do they have to wait till he is 20 in order to sign him. I do remember draft eligible but passed over players sign with NHL teams. How does this work? Is there a period where a team can sign these undrafted under 20 year player. Like Hicketts from Detroit who was undrafted plays in the WHL is less than 20 but the Wings signed him.

There's a window (essentially post-draft to the start of the player's junior season) to sign undrafted North American (trained) players who have remaining draft eligibility. Typically teams will invite a bunch of undrafted players to fill out rosters for summer prospect camps. Occasionally a couple guys stand out and teams are willing to give them an ELC rather than risk another team drafting them.

Martin Jones is probably the most notable guy who was signed after going undrafted. Along with Philippe Myers with the Flyers, Kole Sherwood went undrafted and signed with Columbus; Columbus tried to trade back into the 7th round to take Sherwood but weren't able to find a trade partner.

A couple teams have misunderstood the rule. Back in the day, the Flyers tried to sign Tomas Hyka after an impressive camp. Hyka was scheduled to play in the QMJHL but had played the previous season in Europe. The free agent clause only is available to players who played the entire previous season in North America. We saw that clause in action when Edmonton tried to sign Vladimir Tkachev who had spent the majority of the previous season in the OHL but also played a handful of games in Russia.

 

[Pyromaniac]

Thanks ^