How Did Colorado Pass Edmonton?
- Thread starter GirardIsStupid
- Start date
AvsGuy
Hired the wrong DJ again
Varlamov and Johnson were, as mentioned, two risky trades that people thought we lost initially, and Colorado's management proved they knew better.
The difference to me, though, has been our high draft picks. When a team picks in the top 3, that is your absolute chance to turn your franchise around. We got Duchene, Landeskog, and MacKinnon, and Edmonton got Hall, Nugent-Hopkins and Yakupov. Case closed.
The difference to me, though, has been our high draft picks. When a team picks in the top 3, that is your absolute chance to turn your franchise around. We got Duchene, Landeskog, and MacKinnon, and Edmonton got Hall, Nugent-Hopkins and Yakupov. Case closed.
landy92mack29
Registered User
Foppa2118
Registered User
- Oct 3, 2003
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Better coaching and better goaltending are the main points. Also a better balance IMO of skill, character, and two way play. There was a bigger emphasis on character and two way play during drafts and trades than with the Oilers IMO.
I think Edmonton is following a similar path as Toronto. They have some good young players, they just haven't nurtured it, and developed a winning culture the way Roy and Joe did last year. Feels like they just brought in the players and stopped, thinking it would happen by itself. This is an organizational problem, and Lowe has stayed way too long with that team. It's like if Eric Lacroix had been kept to run things another few years.
I think Edmonton is following a similar path as Toronto. They have some good young players, they just haven't nurtured it, and developed a winning culture the way Roy and Joe did last year. Feels like they just brought in the players and stopped, thinking it would happen by itself. This is an organizational problem, and Lowe has stayed way too long with that team. It's like if Eric Lacroix had been kept to run things another few years.
cgf
FireBednarsSuccessor
It's no where near that simple. Yes we got a more diverse skillset with Landy in there, but those three players are far from the only reason things went so differently for us.
Beyond the trades, the Avs tried to ease our top picks in, let them work on their games in the best possible circumstances available to the club and establish themselves before really taking over the club. Hall, Ebs and RNH were handed the keys to the team, organization and city from day one. Add management that sat on Its hands re: rounding out the core or supporting cast, and that constantly changed coaches to ill effect so that the players never got any consistent direction, even if it was often poor direction as came from the legendary Tank Commander, Joseph of Sacco. And the reasons for our divergent paths is a lot more than we got Landeskog with our picks and they got a third scorer.
hold3n
Registered Loser
But he has won six Stanley Cups! I think he knows what he is doing! /s
Well we also chose MacKinnon over Drouin/Jones and after MacK we had 4, 4!!! #1-#2 centers. I think you can argue Colorado did the same with MacK, you have to pick the best player at #1 draft choice or TRADE DOWN.
cgf
FireBednarsSuccessor
Exactly, hall, RNH and yak where the right picks. Not making any trades to balance the core or supporting cast by adding a Stastny to make life easier for the kids with the constantly changing coaching staff, and early over glorification are why it's been such a long process.
But I actually think they're getting close to turning it around, firstly cause they have draisaitl, and he's a fellow German, I.e. Awesome, but also cause I think a couple trades sets their roster up brilliantly, use Eberle to bring in a RHD like Gudbranson to grow into their EJ, then use Perron, one of their promising LHD prospects, Purcell and some picks to replace Eberle on the first line with a better fit like Ladd, and to replace Perron on the second line while holding the center spot warm for Leon with someone like Vermette. If they made those few trades and found a good coach they'd be fighting for the playoffs as soon as next season .
a mangy Meowth
Ross Colton Fan
cgf
FireBednarsSuccessor
And Staz. He played a huge role in Matty getting to work through his problems and always having the top wingers to work with. Also helped Ryan develop slowly and was huge last year in helping Nate hit the ground running. Like shermy I expect his vital role to get forgotten, or at least neglected. When it was so important in getting the most out of our picks. In this light Crosby and his trainer should also be mentioned.
agentblack
Registered User
Been said before but they should have taken Murray. So you trade down with CLB who at the time Im sure would have chosen Yakupov. Thus negates the trade for Gaborik later on. Interesting ripple effect for three teams here. EDM, CLB and NYR.
cgf
FireBednarsSuccessor
Not to take anything away from Murray but cbj would have to sweeten the pot a lot for me to have to think about passing on yak.
This is pretty much the summation of why. They're pretty incompetent, and did nothing to try to build a team. Whereas our management took risks to attempt to build a team. Our risks took off and we made a jump forward. Whereas they're stand pat, only make draft picks and hope they pan out theory has them stuck in neutral.
Not sure I fully agree with that. Hall was the right pick, RNH was the right pick but Yakupov was not the right pick. At that point they'd already drafted Hall and RNH, why draft another similar player when you gaping holes elsewhere. It's poor team evaluation by management to make the Yakupov pick, unless they were planning on trading Eberle to get help elsewhere.
At the time they could have gotten a kings ransom for the 1st overall pick. They should have traded back a few slots and taken a dman, and picked up another asset in the process. There was no need to take another small skilled forward as they had plenty of those. It was a poor mistake by management to draft Yakupov, unless they had no deals possible which I find difficult to believe.
cgf
FireBednarsSuccessor
Yak has so much more talent than Eberle or anyone else in that draft that not taking him would've been an error that got held against them for the rest of the decade at least. The only mistake of the yak trade is that it wasn't followed with team trading Eberle either for someone to fill the role draisaitl now fills, or for someone to fill the role nurse now fills on the left and ... Fills on the right. But passing on yak would've been a bigger mistake than us picking Seth jones over Nate.
Yak's not just a small skilled skater, he's an excellent skater, who'll fight for the puck , his some of the softest hands and a shot that'll challenge Stamkos's for years to come. You just can't pass on thAt even with an attacking stud win get and attacking stud center.
They then compounded the error by surrounding their kids with attacking vets like Hemsky, Gagner and Perron, instead of the kind of gritty vets that could've taught them to round out there games where the coaching was failing.
I actually don't think they're that screwed if competent management where brought in. Hall and RNH is a great young duo, draisaitl and Yakubov could end up even better. Nurse is a great young LHD prospect while Klefblom and Marincin both could end up really good number 3s. Fayne is good pickup to be a top 4 RHD and scrivens is the goalie patty and allaire wanted.
They just need to have the balls to use Perron, Eberle, one of Klef or Marincin and next years first to go out and get Gudbranson to be their lesser version of EJ, Ladd to be their lesser version of Staz, and a guy like Vermette to keep them from rushing draisaitl, while also solidifying that second line defensively once drai takes over. That means a few big ballsy trades that they may "overpay" in, and in ladd's case they'll need to overpay him on an extension, but with those moves they could be a playoff team next season after they replace the coach and suddenly look like a serious threat moving forward.
Hall-RNH-Ladd
Vermette-Draisaitl-Yak
Nurse - Gudranson
Klefblom - Fayne
Nikitin - Schultz/Petry
Scrivens
Not-Eakins
Would grow into a team you had to take seriously who could beat you in different ways and would make it tough to play against them.
dahrougem2
Registered User
The problem here in Edmonton seems to be that the kids don't care. Win or blow out loss, you can sure bet on finding Hall, Eberle, Schultz etc at the clubs partying it up afterward. They own this city, and they know it. They know that no matter what happens, fans will come back for more and continue to pay ridiculous amounts of money to see them.
I personally like Taylor Hall as a player, and I think he's the kind of guy you win a cup with on the ice. But off the ice, I think he's got some maturity issues, they just aren't as documented.
The Oilers need to mature if they ever want to compete, but I don't think Dallas Eakins is the guy to help with that. He's a "my way or the highway" kind of coach, and that doesn't work with kids these days. He doesn't seem to be willing to coach; he seems to want to force his way upon players. That's fine if you've earned respect in this league, but as a first year coach in the NHL coaching a bunch of 1st overall picks, that won't fly, hence the disaster last year
I personally like Taylor Hall as a player, and I think he's the kind of guy you win a cup with on the ice. But off the ice, I think he's got some maturity issues, they just aren't as documented.
The Oilers need to mature if they ever want to compete, but I don't think Dallas Eakins is the guy to help with that. He's a "my way or the highway" kind of coach, and that doesn't work with kids these days. He doesn't seem to be willing to coach; he seems to want to force his way upon players. That's fine if you've earned respect in this league, but as a first year coach in the NHL coaching a bunch of 1st overall picks, that won't fly, hence the disaster last year
agentblack
Registered User
Thats how I felt about the Eakins hiring. Like he would be ideal for the Calgarys and Columbus' type teams of the NHL but not for a group like EDM, not now anyway. I actually thought Kruger was a better fit. They want to play a certain way so you need to bring in a guy like a Lindy Ruff who builds a system that fits the personality of the club.
cgf
FireBednarsSuccessor
This is why I think it would be really good for them to trade Eberle away for that RHD that they need. Send him to Florida for Guds and that sends a big message to RNH and hall. Then go after someone like Ladd to replace him, say with Klef/Marincin and a 2nd pick + a 2nd next year if they work out an extension, to really drive home the point that they need to start playing winning hockey, and not just entertaining hockey.
And for the love of god, just once side with your coach and not those stars. Eakins can't hold them accountable because everyone knows they'll outlast him in Edmonton. So something like trading Eberle and replacing him with a true leader could show hall and RNH that they're not infallible and management won't tolerate absolutely everything from them any more. With Ladd doing the teaching that Eakins can't I think it would be very good for them.
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Skip2myBordyloo
Stay the course
- Apr 7, 2010
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WarriorOfGandhi
Was saying Boo-urns
Edmonton is better than Colorado. Cogliano-Schremp-Hemsky is going to destroy anything the West has to offer.
