Hockey parent needs advice

[lorwood]

Hi I am looking for some advice from some experienced travel hockey parents.

My grandson is starting his 2nd year at the 10u travel level. He is one of three returning players from last season. Last year he and his two current "veteran" teammates were the only first year players. Last season these three boys needed to adapt to playing full ice as well as playing a more positioned game and learning offsides/icing etc. This put them at the bottom of the squad in terms of hockey however all three boys were good to excellent skaters so they could keep up. They all advanced wonderfully through the year, so much so that last years coach has said that if it were not for the age restriction he would love to have all three on this years 12u squad.
This years 10u squad could not be more different. In terms of skating ability there is a huge drop off between the three returning players and two other first year players and the rest of the squad. Truth be told the majority of this years squad need a lot of work on the basics, backwards skating, stopping, transitioning etc.
I and the other 2nd year parents were concerned from the first practice as the lack of basic skating abilities really hampered any type of actual practice. The idea of a simple passing drill simply became moot. The first two games have been a disaster as opponents are running over this years squad. They stopped counting last game but I am guessing the actual final was something like 20-0.
To say the returning players are discouraged is an understatement. I was naïve as to how big a difference coaching could make. Last years coach was very strict on what the level of skating needed to be in order to make the travel team. Players needed to have been taking private lessons and the team coach spoke to each skating coach as well as performing a skating only evaluation. Last year I would think "this coach is really into this, I hope not over the top" This year I understand that this is a difficult game and that skating is such an important foundation.
I know that as a squad this years team will improve. But how do I and the other parents who's son's are at a much higher level keep the boy's engaged and make sure that their game continues to improve?

Thanks in advance

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[Yukon Joe]

I know that as a squad this years team will improve. But how do I and the other parents who's son's are at a much higher level keep the boy's engaged and make sure that their game continues to improve?

As you acknowledge, your grandson is going to improve. More time on ice, more skating, more time with the puck, one more year of growing - he will improve. What's more is that by being one of the better kids on the team he'll be seen as a leader and be given lot of opportunities.

So the important part of your question is how to keep him engaged if they're getting blown out every game. That's sometimes tougher. I had the opposite problem when my youngest son was in U7 - he was a weak skater on a team with some really strong players, and as a result he never touched the puck in games.

Best I can say is make sure he's having fun. Keep your own attitude positive and don't complain about the score, the coach or the team around your grandson. Keep your feedback mostly positive. I'm not above a little bribery too - go for a treat after a tough game.



And as a completely unasked for aside, I do really question the need for travel teams for U10 players. Unless you're some kind of crazy elite player it isn't at all difficult to find local teams to play against that will be more than adequate competition. But that's a question for another time.

 

[lorwood]

As you acknowledge, your grandson is going to improve. More time on ice, more skating, more time with the puck, one more year of growing - he will improve. What's more is that by being one of the better kids on the team he'll be seen as a leader and be given lot of opportunities.

So the important part of your question is how to keep him engaged if they're getting blown out every game. That's sometimes tougher. I had the opposite problem when my youngest son was in U7 - he was a weak skater on a team with some really strong players, and as a result he never touched the puck in games.

Best I can say is make sure he's having fun. Keep your own attitude positive and don't complain about the score, the coach or the team around your grandson. Keep your feedback mostly positive. I'm not above a little bribery too - go for a treat after a tough game.



And as a completely unasked for aside, I do really question the need for travel teams for U10 players. Unless you're some kind of crazy elite player it isn't at all difficult to find local teams to play against that will be more than adequate competition. But that's a question for another time.

Thanks for the reply. I agree to a point that any ice time is good ice time. But I also know that it is always better to play up to than it is better to play down. I don't want to see his natural progression hampered by not being challenged. (After all much of life's success lies in being challenged) Having to stop skating so your line mate can catch up or get up, or constantly facing three on one's, four on ones , five on ones would be discouraging for any player. Right now he loves the game. I don't want to see that diminished.

Truth be told there is no way the skating gap between the 4 or 5 better skaters and the rest of the squad will be closed in one season, it's years of difference. (My grandson started lessons at 3 years of age the other two returning players around the same time. All three have had private skating coaches for years) It also does not help that my grandson hates to lose. He is very competitive by nature. My wife made a very astute observation. Last years squad lost one game and swept through two tournaments she observed that maybe this year he learns about getting up every time you get knocked down. Maybe that's this years lesson.

I agree about staying positive. I never talk to the coach about the team. I cheer for every player out there, even the opponents, I am friendly with all of the other parents and make it a point to know all of their kids name so I can cheer them by name. My last words before every practice and every game is "Have fun"

As far as the "need" for travel at 10u. Believe me the cost and the commitment is something that could be less of a burden but ( at least in my area) that is where the proper level of competition is. As an example the travel players are invited to play in the local house league. They league tries to sprinkle these kids through various teams however it is very common for the refs to stop a house league game that is getting out of hand score wise and make mid game trades trying to even out the travel players between the two teams.

Thanks again for the reply.

 

[Yukon Joe]

Your wife is right - learning how to lose is just as important as learning how to win. A 20-0 loss is going to sting, but even playing in your own end most of the time is going to teach you how to backcheck and play defence. And I don't necessarily agree it's always better to play up than play down. If you're playing down it gives your kid a chance to be the star, gives them the room to learn how to make plays. If you're always playing against better players you're just not going to have the puck very much.

 

[lorwood]

I don’t know if being the “star” has any value especially when he moves up next year. The majority of last year’s squad jumped to 12u this year and watching those practices and games and comparing them to the 10u team is akin to watching the NHL and then beer league. As far as learning the game the experienced players already know the basics. My grandson ( left defense ) knows how to cut the ice in half. He knows that if the opponent has the puck with his back turned in the defensive zone to go attack and if he does not to keep the attacker to the outside. He knows when to pinch in the offensive zone how to cover the boards how to go high glass the outlet pass etc. This is all the result of some great past coaching and a lot of ice time. His returning teammates are equally versed as they had the same coaching. They even played delayed off sides last year. This year the squad is truly starting from square one. Absolutely nothing wrong with that. They are great kids. I just wonder how he and the others are going to advance when the coach, rightfully so, has to concentrate on teaching the others the basics. The one bright spot is that the 12u coach had seemed to notice and will “sneak” these boys into the 12u practice when he can. They also get moved to the older advanced group at clinics.
I think for me that the bottom line is I am not sure grouping kids solely by age is the best way.
Again thanks for the conversation.

 

[Yukon Joe]

I think for me that the bottom line is I am not sure grouping kids solely by age is the best way.

Is that the only criteria being used?

We're finally coming to the end of about 3 weeks of tryouts and evaluations for my 3 kids, and that's a shortened process due to the pandemic (they want to get them onto individual teams as soon as possible, to minimize the number of different exposures). In affiliated minor hockey they have Tiers 1 through 6, plus then AA and AAA for older age groups. They have the kids do 4 skating drills, time them, then divide them into different tiers based on that. Pre-covid they'd also play some scrimmages and adjust the rankings based on that.

I'm sure there's lots of different ways of doing it, but yeah you have to somewhat group the kids based on both age and skill.

I'm actually worried that my youngest in U9 may have done well in his skating drills, but might be in a group too high for his actual ability. We'll see how this year goes.

 

[lorwood]

Is that the only criteria being used?

We're finally coming to the end of about 3 weeks of tryouts and evaluations for my 3 kids, and that's a shortened process due to the pandemic (they want to get them onto individual teams as soon as possible, to minimize the number of different exposures). In affiliated minor hockey they have Tiers 1 through 6, plus then AA and AAA for older age groups. They have the kids do 4 skating drills, time them, then divide them into different tiers based on that. Pre-covid they'd also play some scrimmages and adjust the rankings based on that.

I'm sure there's lots of different ways of doing it, but yeah you have to somewhat group the kids based on both age and skill.

I'm actually worried that my youngest in U9 may have done well in his skating drills, but might be in a group too high for his actual ability. We'll see how this year goes.

Age based at our rink

 

[wrister]

I feel your pain and worry my youngest may be in a similar situation next year. My biggest concern I have is losing your goalie(s). Your situation is ripe for kids quitting the game especially goaltenders.
From reading your posts, it sounds like your hockey director sucks. Coaching is so important and a poor coach at 6u/u7 and 8u/u9 can cause damage for years. IMO, good associations have hockey directors that catch this early and correct it. There are way too many coaches who coach how they were taught even though the game has changed. I spent 8 years coaching in 8u and saw a few coaches refuse to change - no matter how badly their teams got beat. Parents are upset, kids aren’t having fun and they certainly stop working hard and many eventually leave the game.
I would gather other parents and have a conversation with your director and demand assistance. Ask for an extra practice temporarily, get a figure skater to run these practices (be willing to pay for the extra ice). Put down the stick, get on one foot - it’s the best and fastest way to improve skating. It may not help much with this year but it will in the future or maybe in the second half of this season. If you can’t get an extra practice do it for the first 20 minutes of your normal practice but push for it. Good coaches will embrace it. If you aren’t successful, find resistance from your director or coach look for another association if possible. Or, have a parents only meeting and see if parents will do it on their own- rent ice, hire an instructor. I know travel teams have a lot of commitments but it’s more fun for kids when they are able to compete.
I did this with my boys and they love it. They got their butts kicked the first few sessions but now the power they generate and their mobility improvements is truly remarkable. We’ve done privates with ex professionals and high level college players and this was our best decision and the one we will always do.

 

[Marotte Marauder]

Did you not see this coming at the tryouts, before you committed?

Did you not notice what was coming up the pipeline behind your grandson?

Often, people will do summer skates at a variety of clubs to gauge what is going on.

You are in for a trying season. Good luck

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Hi I am looking for some advice from some experienced travel hockey parents.

My grandson is starting his 2nd year at the 10u travel level. He is one of three returning players from last season. Last year he and his two current "veteran" teammates were the only first year players. Last season these three boys needed to adapt to playing full ice as well as playing a more positioned game and learning offsides/icing etc. This put them at the bottom of the squad in terms of hockey however all three boys were good to excellent skaters so they could keep up. They all advanced wonderfully through the year, so much so that last years coach has said that if it were not for the age restriction he would love to have all three on this years 12u squad.
This years 10u squad could not be more different. In terms of skating ability there is a huge drop off between the three returning players and two other first year players and the rest of the squad. Truth be told the majority of this years squad need a lot of work on the basics, backwards skating, stopping, transitioning etc.
I and the other 2nd year parents were concerned from the first practice as the lack of basic skating abilities really hampered any type of actual practice. The idea of a simple passing drill simply became moot. The first two games have been a disaster as opponents are running over this years squad. They stopped counting last game but I am guessing the actual final was something like 20-0.
To say the returning players are discouraged is an understatement. I was naïve as to how big a difference coaching could make. Last years coach was very strict on what the level of skating needed to be in order to make the travel team. Players needed to have been taking private lessons and the team coach spoke to each skating coach as well as performing a skating only evaluation. Last year I would think "this coach is really into this, I hope not over the top" This year I understand that this is a difficult game and that skating is such an important foundation.
I know that as a squad this years team will improve. But how do I and the other parents who's son's are at a much higher level keep the boy's engaged and make sure that their game continues to improve?

Thanks in advance

My daughter is in a similar situation.

She played 10u AA major last season and was one of only three 9 year olds to make the team.

Some politics that I won’t get into, came into play during tryouts this spring for both teams she’s on.

One decision was within our control and one wasn’t, long story short she’s playing on two teams now where the talent downgrade is significant on both squads.

She was really upset with the first situation and locked herself in the bathroom when she found out - but we found out about the politics from other shocked parents and tried to calm her down with these explanations.

Over the next couple weeks other players we knew had similar things happen and she didn’t feel like a “loser” anymore as she put it.

So as an example, my daughter played both boys and girls hockey last season… for girls played 12u major as a 9 year old, which I told her was extremely impressive.

Now over politics (her former coach warned us to move her from the old program) she is playing 12u minor.

It’s a huge step down, but it’s a way better program for her to be in, but the major team never takes any girl under 10, no matter what.

So we are playing the long game here and tried to make her understand this is what her former coach advised us to do.

So she is simply skating with and against kids that aren’t on her level and she gets really frustrated.

They will do really simple, basic drills and I can tell my daughter gets annoyed, but to her credit she goes full tilt.

Her boys team is not even close to the talented team she played on last season and her coach asked her to try and lead and step up for him and “the boys”.

Overall I told her it’s a great chance to get puck touches, learn how to be the star player and make her teammates better, and push through adversity.

I emphasized ignoring the score and winning each shift - and the score doesn’t matter.

It’s all you can really do TBTH.

 

[lorwood]

I feel your pain and worry my youngest may be in a similar situation next year. My biggest concern I have is losing your goalie(s). Your situation is ripe for kids quitting the game especially goaltenders.
From reading your posts, it sounds like your hockey director sucks. Coaching is so important and a poor coach at 6u/u7 and 8u/u9 can cause damage for years. IMO, good associations have hockey directors that catch this early and correct it. There are way too many coaches who coach how they were taught even though the game has changed. I spent 8 years coaching in 8u and saw a few coaches refuse to change - no matter how badly their teams got beat. Parents are upset, kids aren’t having fun and they certainly stop working hard and many eventually leave the game.
I would gather other parents and have a conversation with your director and demand assistance. Ask for an extra practice temporarily, get a figure skater to run these practices (be willing to pay for the extra ice). Put down the stick, get on one foot - it’s the best and fastest way to improve skating. It may not help much with this year but it will in the future or maybe in the second half of this season. If you can’t get an extra practice do it for the first 20 minutes of your normal practice but push for it. Good coaches will embrace it. If you aren’t successful, find resistance from your director or coach look for another association if possible. Or, have a parents only meeting and see if parents will do it on their own- rent ice, hire an instructor. I know travel teams have a lot of commitments but it’s more fun for kids when they are able to compete.
I did this with my boys and they love it. They got their butts kicked the first few sessions but now the power they generate and their mobility improvements is truly remarkable. We’ve done privates with ex professionals and high level college players and this was our best decision and the one we will always do.

I know how bad this is going to sound but…..the truth is the rest of the squad is not going to catch up skating wise in one season. This is going to sound biased but for his age my Grandson is an excellent skater. Every coach tells me this. He has been invited to skate with the high school JV team and has no problem keeping up. He has been skating since he was 3 and his current skating coach is an ex AHL player who confirms how advanced he is for his age. I agree that the program should take skill and age into account not just age.
There are a few steps I am contemplating. The first is to play him with the 12u kids in the weekly clinics. This should be easy to do. The second is to seek advice from last years coach.
There is also an opportunity to join another rinks 10u program through the high schools team. I am going to see about getting a feel for that program from the coach involved . This may cost a few bucks and ruffle some feathers with his current team. Will see how this works out.

 

[lorwood]

Did you not see this coming at the tryouts, before you committed?

Did you not notice what was coming up the pipeline behind your grandson?

Often, people will do summer skates at a variety of clubs to gauge what is going on.

You are in for a trying season. Good luck

You are correct I should have paid more attention. Covid basically stopped the feeder system last year as only travel was truly active. Even the rinks house league was basically made up of travel players. We used to joke about the house league basically being travel scrimmages. It never occurred to me that the lack of a feeder system would have this effect. Basically I may have screwed up.