Hindsight is 20/20, were these the right decisions?

[LeafGrief]

Fair enough, I don't agree but I get where you're coming from and I respect your opinion. And yes, the key is where we are in our rebuild, I say yes we're better than we thought we would be by now and ahead of schedule etc. but still, not quite good enough to sacrifice futures to go for it, especially when we're already underdogs in round 1! Were we in a different division then it might be a different story - I really think that the fact that we'd likely be underdogs for all 4 playoff rounds is a HUGE factor.

Of course we didn't know that we would lose in the 1st round, my thinking though is that we knew we would be underdogs and JVR doesn't make that much of a difference anyway. We could win or lose with him or without him. And last year he kind of sucked in the playoffs so it wasn't totally a surprise that he wasn't much of a factor this season either.

I meant one more year meaning 2017-18. I would also not let Gardiner walk, I would trade him or resign him but my thinking was always that JVR is overrated anyway, we're not quite ready to win the cup anyway so all the conditions are perfect to gather assets this one last time. Then next year I think we'd be ready to really make some noise (and this would especially be true if we were to package those assets we got for JVR and/or Bozak for some immediate help like perhaps that Dman we've all been dreaming of).

And yes, we're not doomed, we can still make noise next year and so on. I just really hope we can sign Tavares, that would make me forget about those picks we didn't get in a big hurry. I'm also thrilled that Dubas is now at the helm, I have big hopes for him.

I happily agree with everything in here. In particular, I share your thoughts on Gardiner and I do agree that JVR was not a make-or-break factor.

What I do hope though, is that by keeping the rentals we have attracted Taveres' attention. He's said publicly that he wants to be on a team that's doing everything it can to win and that's part of why I'm okay with the Leafs making these moves to win, even if they came a little too early and ended up backfiring. Doughty has said similar things, it's all the long con!

 

[Gary Nylund]

I happily agree with everything in here. In particular, I share your thoughts on Gardiner and I do agree that JVR was not a make-or-break factor.

What I do hope though, is that by keeping the rentals we have attracted Taveres' attention. He's said publicly that he wants to be on a team that's doing everything it can to win and that's part of why I'm okay with the Leafs making these moves to win, even if they came a little too early and ended up backfiring. Doughty has said similar things, it's all the long con!

I've never understood the theory that keeping JVR might encourage someone like Tavares to come here but I suppose it could be true. I'll keep my fingers crossed that it is true, that Tavares signs with us at a friendly price and if he ever says that us keeping JVR was a factor in him coming here then I will take back everything I ever said about trading JVR.

Make it happen Kyle!

LOL long con.

 

[Gabriel426]

I think the window to trade JVR and Bozak was in the summer. By TDL, it is a bit late to trade them, as the team was 6th overall in the standings, and if the team managed to missed the playoffs(could happen) it would have been a huge blow to the kids. However, they could have trade Leo at the TDL to get a 2nd rounder as the MGT should have seen how he was playing and he was not much better than Moore.
I think Jake will either by sign or trade in the summer b.c thats the only two options.

 

[m1ker]

One problem with this is that when you keep everyone instead of selling and even buy on top of that and then lose in the 1st round, that sends an even stronger message to the kids that they're not good enough. Selling instead of buying at least would have taken some pressure off and who knows, without that pressure maybe they even beat Boston, we'll never know.

As far as "serious cup run", that was the party line of everyone in favour of not selling. It was always possible with or without JVR but was also always a long shot, are we really still talking about "cup run" as if that was a realistic expectation? It didn't make much sense before, it makes no sense now.

Exactly the kids tasted defeat from their own hand not management. Motivation to train harder this off season.

 

[Cams]

re: JVR - For a guy with his production, and expiring UFA - I really think options were very limited as far as who could have been a trade partner. What would they have got for him realistically? I was trying to look at comparable trades that happened this deadline, and it's hard to gauge what his return would've been. Tatar got a 1st, 2nd, 3rd, but he is signed for 3 more years. Marron (exp UFA) only fetched an unsigned prospect and a 3rd in 19. Stastny (a C) got a protected 1st, and unsigned prospect (or a 4th if still unsigned). A bottom feeder team (high pick) certainly wouldn't acquire JVR for picks or higher end prospects when he could just walk - thus returning nothing for you high pick/prospect(s), no matter if bottom feeder needs offense or not. Is it realistic to think the Leafs would sign JVR just to trade him this summer? I highly doubt that scenario playing out - very rarely does this happen. A player like JVR probably wouldn't want that anyway.

IMO - Bozak and JVR would have been trade targets for contending teams, should the Leafs have been out of the playoffs/rebuilding. Is one of your rivals/contenders going to trade you 1st rd picks/high end prospects for this type of player? This a sell type deal, not a make a run deal. Use Boston - if they get JVR instead of Nash - would this even happen?

Had JVR had term remaining, his value would be very high, but then the Leafs aren't trading him...right?

I really don't think management/coaching goes into a trade deadline when they are in the position the Leafs were thinking "Well, I know we are on record pace for points/win/pushing for home ice, but we are going to get our butts kicked by Boston or Tampa so let's sell." It sends the wrong message to the players and fans. I think the approach was appropriately cautious - sure they gave up a 2nd, but they higher SJ's higher 2nd still, and they didn't have to give up a very good prospect.