Hart Trophy: Who has better claim?

[Romang67]

It is going to be close

Kucherov has the bigger point gap argument.

McKinnon has the argument well look at Kucherov he has 5 guys above 70 heck at 75 and I only have 3 guys above that number.

One could argue he recieved more help. It will be close.

MacKinnon also has much better defensive numbers when he's on the ice. We'll see how the voters view that, but I don't think MacKinnon's winning it would be surprising at all.

 

[Outl4w]

Its a 50/50 toss-up, for some reason some kuch fans are trying to make it seem like its an obvious choice and if he doesn't win it will be a robbery but in reality it could go either way between him and Mackinnon.

Mack does bring a lot more overall value than pts, but kuch did have a better offensive season. Each game is a game, vs top teams , bottom feeders, whatever it is, its a game. Both put up a similar amount of pts, kuch 6 (or less) more pts and Mack 7 (or more) more goals.

Should be a close vote

Six more points in the same amount of games played is quite a difference.

 

[Breakfast of Champs]

Six more points in the same amount of games played is quite a difference.

Same amount of games is irrelevant , Kucherov missed a game so going 82/82 is actually better. The gap could end up being 3 for all we know, that's not a big gap at all. Considering the one with fewer pts has 7 more goals. Their basic stat lines are basically even.

Now there are arguments based on other reasons for both guys to be mvp. I think it's pretty funny how far kuch fans are willing to go to convince themselves the voting is already rigged, that's for sure

 

[The Macho King]

Kucherov has not won the Art Ross yet yall geeze.

 

[Breakfast of Champs]

What value does Mack bring compared to Kucherov? His (lol) defense and faceoff %?



Kucherov played in the ASG exactly the same way he plays in games. Slow, methodical, uninspired. A lot of media/fans caught sand in their vagina over it.

Mackinnon is definitely a better 200 foot player , numbers and the eye test would both support that. He won't win a selke but he's got that on kuch for sure

 

[FunkySeeFunkyDo]

MVPs don’t disrespect the All-Star game. MacK is the pick.

 

[Cup or Bust]

Based on overall season and looking at each teams roster, I pick Mackinnon.

 

[Calderon]

Points (excluding empty nets) against the Top 10 teams in the NHL:
MacKinnon: 26pts in 22 GP (1.18 P/GP)
McDavid: 27pts in 20 GP (1.35 P/GP)
Kucherov: 50pts in 26 GP (1.92 P/GP)
He performs better against tougher competition.

Is this top teams at the time of each game or when the stats were compiled?

 

[GirardSpinorama]

Its a narratives trophy so its gonna be mack for both this and lindsay. No NHL player thinks Kucherov is better than Mack.

 

[Toby91ca]

It's Kucherov. Scoring 54 more points than his closest teammate is crazy.

Not this again......

 

[AhosDatsyukian]

Kucherov > McDavid > MacKinnon

But I think the voters give it to MacKinnon, sadly.

 

[Toby91ca]

He did? MACK plays in an easier division and conference LESS CUPCAKES SUCH as sj,az,and ana. He has worse points per game against the top 10 teams points wise in.the nhl. Kucherov more points, broke two nhl records this year, more points per game, and a better shooting percentage. Also let's be honest of kucherov didn't have the season he had, the LIghtning aren't in the playoffs. Mack has to get 6 points tonight to tie him and mcdavid is the best center on the ice tonight.

He does? Someone else said the complete opposite....who is correct?

 

[BraveCanadian]

I think MacK is the better player, and he had my Hart vote up until the stretch run, but Kucherov ran wild down the stretch and so now I'm leaning towards him. He had a hell of a season.

 

[DFC]

Points (excluding empty nets) against the Top 10 teams in the NHL:
MacKinnon: 26pts in 22 GP (1.18 P/GP)
McDavid: 27pts in 20 GP (1.35 P/GP)
Kucherov: 50pts in 26 GP (1.92 P/GP)
He performs better against tougher competition.

That's a kind of amazing stat.

 

[Eegs]

Both MacKinnon and Kucherov are deserving. This is one of the tightest MVP races in the last few years. It might very well be a situation where the MVP/Lindsay winner are not the same guy.

Heck, the Lindsay winner might not even be a Hart Candidate - McDavid.

 

[T REX]

Another dumpster fire of a thread. Everyone crapping all over the finalists.

SMDH.

 

[Roomtemperature]

Best player has the most value

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

Kuch, hope he gets it , will be disappointed in the media bias if he doesn't

 

[Outl4w]

He does? Someone else said the complete opposite....who is correct?

Check the standings top to bottom. Check the president trophy winner. The west has 3 sub 60 point teams and 6 sub 0.500 teams points wise 82 points . The east has zero sub 60 point teams and four sub 0.500 82 point teams. The east three teams with 110 points or more to one team in the west . They both have 5 teams of 100 points or more going to the playoffs and three teams with 90-99points making the playoff. East is deeper and has less bottom feeders this season.

 

[Outl4w]

10/10 for persecution complex score, nice work.

However, I agree Kuch has to work harder than others for credit due to Russian/personality factors. What you didn't mention was his All-Star Skills Competition performance, which was self-inflicted. I wouldn't be surprised if some voters remember that at voting time.

Rightly or wrongly, many viewed it as unprofessional, unsportsmanlike, classless, or whatever the word you want to choose is.

If the allstar game has a factor in the mvp trophy then it should be renames the John Scott trophy.

 

[Romang67]

Check the standings top to bottom. Check the president trophy winner. The west has 3 sub 60 point teams and 6 sub 0.500 teams points wise 82 points . The east has zero sub 60 point teams and four sub 0.500 82 point teams. The east three teams with 110 points or more to one team in the west . They both have 5 teams of 100 points or more going to the playoffs and three teams with 90-99points making the playoff. East is deeper and has less bottom feeders this season.

If (when) the Kings beat the Blackhawks tonight, 8 of the top 13 teams are in the West. The East just have a large group of utterly mediocre teams in the middle. Which is why two of their playoff teams have a GD of 38 and 58 worse than the worst playoff team in the West.

Not sure how you can say that the East is deep.

 

[flying squirrel]

10/10 for persecution complex score, nice work.

However, I agree Kuch has to work harder than others for credit due to Russian/personality factors. What you didn't mention was his All-Star Skills Competition performance, which was self-inflicted. I wouldn't be surprised if some voters remember that at voting time.

Rightly or wrongly, many viewed it as unprofessional, unsportsmanlike, classless, or whatever the word you want to choose is.

What came first, chicken or egg? Did Kucherov build up not caring about NHL's glorified yearly popularity contests & awards. After witnessing his Lightning teammates getting looked over yearly with individual accolades. Or did Kucherov get all nasty from get go of his career? Kuch wasn't defending himself that #1 BS night, Kucherov was defending his teammates accomplishments, like Vasy. That's a quantity that seems alright to in my eyes, but each their own. A bear has a right to poke back after being poked and dissed, especially one defending teammates.

An all star event should not have any baring on regular season work for an award., especially considering All-star game is a glorified popularity contest these days. Kucherov had every right to relax after early mistake during competition, it was during a meaningless All-star event. Kucherov cares about championships, not bragging rights in some practice like event.

 

[MacMacandBarbie]

I am afraid Kucherov has ran away with it and I think the voters will share the same opinion. Unless MacK piles on multiple points against the Oilers tonite, Kucherov has a nice easy gap, and led the Art Ross race for such a huge percentage of the season.

 

[Toby91ca]

Check the standings top to bottom. Check the president trophy winner. The west has 3 sub 60 point teams and 6 sub 0.500 teams points wise 82 points . The east has zero sub 60 point teams and four sub 0.500 82 point teams. The east three teams with 110 points or more to one team in the west . They both have 5 teams of 100 points or more going to the playoffs and three teams with 90-99points making the playoff. East is deeper and has less bottom feeders this season.

1) I wasn't necessarily challenging the comment, it just looked strange to read your comment saying Kuch plays in the tougher division and conference and literally 2 replies after that someone says MacK plays in the tougher division and conference.

2) I looked at the standings and your comments are entirely correct...well, actually I guess technically correct when you say 3 teams in each getting into the playoffs with 90-99 pts, but misleading as the East has 2 teams getting in with 91 and 94 pts and the West looks to have no one under 99pts getting in.

3) What's most important to this though is the number of goals teams are giving up....you can have a conference where the teams are WAY BETTER because they score 7 goals a game, but if they are also giving up 5 goals a game, you'll score a lot of points playing against them. Personally, I wouldn't make the argument at all about strength of division/conference, but since it was raised, the Western conference in total, has given up less goals than the East....so theoretically, you'd score more playing in the East.

 

[Soul Assumption]

Harder to score than it is to get an assist

harder for whom? Matthews might score 70 goals one day, but he will NEVER score 70 assists, let alone 100. so it's definitely harder for him to assist because he's not a playmaker