Hard to Take NHL Seriously With Vegas Success
- Thread starter The Red Helmet
- Start date
donghabs98
Moderator
It's hard to take the NHL seriously because a team is doing good? That's just senseless, even if Vegas had a better team coming out of the expansion draft that's a testament to the quality of players the league has these days. As well it was widely expected Vegas wouldn't be good this season. To dismiss them like the OP does is just sour grapes.
HunterSThompson
[}=[][][][][]
A lot is revealed about the league by Vegas winning the Pacific Division and I do not think any of it is bad.
1. This is a team game. No superstars, just four 2nd/3rd lines and three 2nd pairs.
2. Parity is real. A team of players with minimal prior chemistry can be put together from other teams' 12th best players to win a division.
3. Speed wins. More speed more wins.
4. The overall play of the league hasn't gone down. Teams lost good players and barely missed a beat.
The big question mark will be the playoffs. They are a different animal.
In fact, small market teams that have struggled for years should take a page out of the Vegas playbook. Don't whine because you don't have enough superstars and can't pay your best players. Build a solid foundation, that's apparently all that is needed.
1. This is a team game. No superstars, just four 2nd/3rd lines and three 2nd pairs.
2. Parity is real. A team of players with minimal prior chemistry can be put together from other teams' 12th best players to win a division.
3. Speed wins. More speed more wins.
4. The overall play of the league hasn't gone down. Teams lost good players and barely missed a beat.
The big question mark will be the playoffs. They are a different animal.
In fact, small market teams that have struggled for years should take a page out of the Vegas playbook. Don't whine because you don't have enough superstars and can't pay your best players. Build a solid foundation, that's apparently all that is needed.
Goodbahd
Registered User
- Dec 17, 2017
- 652
- 554
I understand the OP’s position, however on paper, and before the season started, nobody expected Vegas to make the playoffs, similarly, nobody expects them to really go far in the playoffs. They’ve simply exceeded expectations. And because of the parity league-wide, they might not even end up making the playoffs next season. Likewise, nobody expected the Oilers to miss the playoffs before the season started.
Like 10 players having career years.
And all the goaltenders used on the year looking like vezina winning goalies.
I don't fully agree with the OP, but I can tell you that talent pool VGK had to choose from exceeds what the last expansion teams had to work with.
I see a lot of these guys labeled as 3rd/4th line rejects. That's not a fair label to put on a guy that scored 30 goals 2 seasons ago in FLA, a 29 year old vet with 3 20-goal seasons, and a 30 year old with 263 NHL goals including a 40-goal season. Add to that a veteran goalie with multiple rings (more on that below). These aren't old timers, and they aren't unproven youth, they are veterans with solid career numbers.
That being said, 2 outliers that have greatly contributed to the success of VGK.
1. Fleury has put up by far the best numbers of his career (GAA/SV%). He is the league leader in both. Why? I have no clue, but he has been the MVP of the team imo.
2. Wild Bill. No one in Columbus thought twice about losing Bill. I loved the guy on the ice, but never dreamed we'd be losing a 40 goal scorer in him. He could be just a flash in the pan (Jordan Tootoo), but I don't think that is the case. He won't score 40 goals again, but he'll be a legit 1C for several years imo. A lot of guys just need to be in the right system, and play for the right coach for it all to click. Bill was given ample opportunities in Columbus to show his skills, but it never all came together.
I see a lot of these guys labeled as 3rd/4th line rejects. That's not a fair label to put on a guy that scored 30 goals 2 seasons ago in FLA, a 29 year old vet with 3 20-goal seasons, and a 30 year old with 263 NHL goals including a 40-goal season. Add to that a veteran goalie with multiple rings (more on that below). These aren't old timers, and they aren't unproven youth, they are veterans with solid career numbers.
That being said, 2 outliers that have greatly contributed to the success of VGK.
1. Fleury has put up by far the best numbers of his career (GAA/SV%). He is the league leader in both. Why? I have no clue, but he has been the MVP of the team imo.
2. Wild Bill. No one in Columbus thought twice about losing Bill. I loved the guy on the ice, but never dreamed we'd be losing a 40 goal scorer in him. He could be just a flash in the pan (Jordan Tootoo), but I don't think that is the case. He won't score 40 goals again, but he'll be a legit 1C for several years imo. A lot of guys just need to be in the right system, and play for the right coach for it all to click. Bill was given ample opportunities in Columbus to show his skills, but it never all came together.
Newsworthy
Registered User
The expansion draft unfairly penalized some teams while others lost nothing. Nothing to do with bad management. More about luck and timing. For instance some teams had a lot of young players(second year) that weren't even required to be protected. The rules were way too favorable. Also having to protect players with NTC hurts that team a lot. In addition Vegas is exempt from the Seattle expansion and having to trade away a first rd pick isn't good for hockey or its fans.
HunterSThompson
[}=[][][][][]
You sound upset, friend.
You're revising history, btw. Everyone was shitting on GMGM (including myself) for some of the decisions and acquisitions at the Expansion draft. Absolutely no one was saying "Wow, the league is gifting them a competitive team".
Everyone thought they were gonna be cellar dweller and weren't very impressed by the team on paper.
Russian Factor
Registered User
OP started off on the right track with VGK being an indictment of the league but points the finger in the wrong direction.
the NHL is a laughing stock because teams around the league make asinine roster and team management decisions that result in the top teams and talent being watered down. Less elite teams and more market inefficiencies, more opportunity for lesser teams with lesser talent to become successful if you can capitalize on those mistakes and exploit inefficiencies.
Don't blame Gary Bettman. Blame FLA for paying VGK to take Marchessault and R. Smith to protect a #5 D man. Blame teams like EDM and CGY for hamstringing their own teams and elite talent with old school thinking and creating a vacuum for other teams to take their place by gaining easy points against them. And those are just a few examples off the top of my head. The league is littered with them. Asset management is a laughing stock in the NHL and one of the main reasons its growth is stunted.
What a league lol. Its best player won't be able to show his skills in the postseason and grow the game despite having over 100 points in the era of goaltending dominance. Embarrassing.
the NHL is a laughing stock because teams around the league make asinine roster and team management decisions that result in the top teams and talent being watered down. Less elite teams and more market inefficiencies, more opportunity for lesser teams with lesser talent to become successful if you can capitalize on those mistakes and exploit inefficiencies.
Don't blame Gary Bettman. Blame FLA for paying VGK to take Marchessault and R. Smith to protect a #5 D man. Blame teams like EDM and CGY for hamstringing their own teams and elite talent with old school thinking and creating a vacuum for other teams to take their place by gaining easy points against them. And those are just a few examples off the top of my head. The league is littered with them. Asset management is a laughing stock in the NHL and one of the main reasons its growth is stunted.
What a league lol. Its best player won't be able to show his skills in the postseason and grow the game despite having over 100 points in the era of goaltending dominance. Embarrassing.
powerstuck
Nordiques Hopes Lies
Dear OP,
I hope you will humbly accept my offer as it follows :
* Buffalo Sabres relocate to Quebec City and become Quebec Nordiques
* 20 years later the City of Buffalo is awarded an expansion team in the NHL
* The new team gets exceptional drafting advantages and win the Stanley Cup the very year their team joins the league.
Dear OP, please say yes.
/sarcasm off
In all honesty, McPhee did an amazing job. A lot of 30 other GMs were looking like puppets after they had a talk with McPhee.
And, in all honesty, Vegas took a bunch of 3rd and 4th liners, gave them 1st line ice-time and saw them work their asses off.
I hope you will humbly accept my offer as it follows :
* Buffalo Sabres relocate to Quebec City and become Quebec Nordiques
* 20 years later the City of Buffalo is awarded an expansion team in the NHL
* The new team gets exceptional drafting advantages and win the Stanley Cup the very year their team joins the league.
Dear OP, please say yes.
/sarcasm off
In all honesty, McPhee did an amazing job. A lot of 30 other GMs were looking like puppets after they had a talk with McPhee.
And, in all honesty, Vegas took a bunch of 3rd and 4th liners, gave them 1st line ice-time and saw them work their asses off.
KingsFan7824
Registered User
Expansion drafts have always treated some teams better than others. That's not out of the ordinary.
The cap and NMC's are what made this expansion draft different. It wasn't great, you got a team, here's our crap. It's the first time a % of payroll had to be kept/exposed. It was the first time players had the chance to say no, you're going to protect me. Actually they didn't even have to say that, it was implied contractually.
All the owners collectively agreed to the expansion draft rules, right? I don't know what anyone is complaining about then. They all knew who they might lose as a result. And they all did it for a little extra money, so blame your favorite team's owner.
It's the nature of the game. This would never happen in the NBA or NFL. Hockey has inherently more parity that those sports. Imagine being able to just walk the puck into the offensive zone and setup like you see in the NBA.
It means quite the opposite: that the praised stars aren't that dominant. Basically Vegas proves what I've been saying for years: a KHL team could compete in the NHL.
Okay, you repeated all the nerratives implanted by the league and the media. They are still not true. I pay to watch great hockey. Most of today's NHL is dull.
This is it. The League is a joke because most of the teams are just run by a rotating cast of guys from the Old Boys Club, and get to continually make monumentally bad decisions over and over.
The fact that Vegas is the best team in the Pacific (and obviously luck has a large part to do with it though) is a testament to this. NHL GMs were falling over themselves to hand Vegas top-line calibre players.
This is exactly the case. The game now days sucks balls and is nigh unwatchable. It's turned into whack a puck and collapse down low for 5 goalie defence.
The goalies aren't exciting anymore.
The pace of the game is fast but nothing really happens...rarely do quality scoring chances develop.
It's the ultimate team game that just so happens.. the better the teams play.. the less exciting the game.
I don't even know if anything can be done about it though. Everyone still seems to watch even though the product has degraded over the years.
They're too fast for the refs.. so they've turned into game managers. So the fans really don't know what's going on other than it's time fore a penalty.
Fighting and hitting are going away and it's tough to argue it when we seem to be finding out concussions are more dangerous than previously thought.
The league and the union absolutely hate each other so don't expect any rules of the game to change to help excite the game up.
Coaching in the game is entirely focus'd on mitigating talent and they do a fantastic job of it.
What is considered generational talents don't crush the other players in scoring.. rather they just consistently stay at the top of the pack.
The whole focus of the game now isn't to score a goal.. but try not to give one up. Mitigate talent and transition.
Helistin
Dustin's equilibrium
No it doesn't. You seem to know it as well since you once again started promoting KHL.
So you just opened up its unfair that buffalo sucks and vegas doesnt. I understand your frustrated. Hope they play well next season. And glad to see that team like vegas with roster that they have can play so well. Just shows that hockey isnt always about big names, it's teamsport aswell.
Machinehead
GoAwayTrouba
