Hall or No Hall (Koivu84 Edition)

[arrbez]

...Best offensive player on the Cup-winning team.

There aren't many who aren't in.

Sure, he was excellent in 1993, but it wasn't an offensive display for the ages. He was 4th in playoff scoring. Jamie Langenbrunner and Craig Simpson have also done it. Rick MacLeish did it in back-to-back seasons. None of these guys are Hall of Famers.

It's a nice thing to add on to your resume, but Damhpousse was simply never one of the truly elite players in the league. And no single playoff year is enough to change that.

 

[Novak Djokovic]

Since, it's "Hockey" Hall of fame, I think Neidermayer will get in.

If it was NHL, then I would say he would need couple more good seasons.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

Belfour is a lock. The fourth best goaltender of the strongest era ever for goaltenders. Mixed playoff resume early in his career, but he more than made up for it in the later half. Has a good chance at first ballot, but it depends on the competition. Lock, possible first ballot.

Niedermayer is borderline for me, but will probably get in because voters will remember the end of his career, when he racked up all star bids against relatively weak competition. A Conn Smythe in 2007 and a Smythe-worthy post season in 2003. He was great in the 1995 finals, but overall, wasn't one of the top 3 postseason performers on that team (Lemieux, Stevens, Brodeur). Regardless of weak competition, however, he would be a lock if he played his whole career like he has since 2003. He spent most of the first decade of his career floating, which is why he's borderline for me. I wouldn't induct him on the first ballot. I agree with the poster who said that one more elite season, or a few more very good ones will make him a lock to at least get in. Better than 50% chance.

Blake is kind of the reverse of Niedermayer - looked like he was HOF-bound early in his career, only to fade fast towards the end. He definitely gets "fame" points for the buttchecks he was famous for early in his career. Right now, he's even with Niedermayer, but Niedermayer has a much better chance of adding to his resume. Could go either way.

Recchi is the only forward on the list with a chance to get in anytime soon. He's the type of player that you don't think of as a HOFer, but looking back... it wouldn't be a travesty if he got in. Definitely not first ballot, however. Could go either way.

Andreychuck will not get in while those who actually saw him play are on the committee. Never an elite player in the league for even a season. There's a small chance, that in the distant future, the committee will look at his goal-scoring stats, which are very impressive. Not any time soon; probably never.

Turgeon is notoriously soft. Better peak than Andreychuk, but still never elite. His career numbers are good, but nothing stands out like Andreychuk's goal total. Never.

Mogilny had two elite regular seasons, and one very good one. He spent most of the rest of his career floating and was never very good in the playoffs. Never.

 

[kmad]

Player | From | To | GP | G | A | PTS | PTS/G
Joe Sakic | 1990 | 2004 | 1085 | 519 | 821 | 1340 | 1.24
Jaromir Jagr | 1991 | 2004 | 1027 | 537 | 772 | 1309 | 1.27
Brett Hull | 1990 | 2004 | 1116 | 667 | 574 | 1241 | 1.11
Adam Oates | 1990 | 2004 | 1091 | 287 | 934 | 1221 | 1.12
Mark Recchi | 1990 | 2004 | 1158 | 455 | 744 | 1199 | 1.04

The rest of the top ten are Yzerman, Francis, Turgeon, Modano and Roenick.

Gartner had amazing consistency, and while Recchi isn't exactly on that level he might make the HHOF eventually. But he probably isn't on my list of top 10 players that should be inducted - Nieds and Belfour are, however.

It might have been a different range of years I was remembering. Giving it a second thought, I'm not sure he'd be able to surpass Jagr in any range of years, though. I'm not sure why that seemed like such a sure thing in my head.

 

[Wings4Life]

As much disdain as I had for the 90's Avs, Blake imo does deserve a spot in the HOF. Not first ballot, but he will get in eventually.

 

[cupcrazyman]

once eligible,these players or similar players will get in but will have to wait after Yzerman,Hull,Robitaille.

 

[MXD]

Sure, he was excellent in 1993, but it wasn't an offensive display for the ages. He was 4th in playoff scoring. Jamie Langenbrunner and Craig Simpson have also done it. Rick MacLeish did it in back-to-back seasons. None of these guys are Hall of Famers.

It's a nice thing to add on to your resume, but Damhpousse was simply never one of the truly elite players in the league. And no single playoff year is enough to change that.

This said, none of these guys were the best offensive players of their teams...

 

[arrbez]

This said, none of these guys were the best offensive players of their teams...

For those playoffs they were. I mean, would Damphousse have been the best offensive player on his team if he had Mark Messier or Bobby Clarke as a teammate? Or Mario Lemieux, as Recchi did in 1991?

The point is, simply, Vincent Damphousse was never really one of the elite players in the league. His point totals in his prime look nice, but the highest he ever came in league scoring was 18th.

 

[Randall Graves*]

Niedermayer is borderline for me, but will probably get in because voters will remember the end of his career, when he racked up all star bids against relatively weak competition. A Conn Smythe in 2007 and a Smythe-worthy post season in 2003. He was great in the 1995 finals, but overall, wasn't one of the top 3 postseason performers on that team (Lemieux, Stevens, Brodeur). Regardless of weak competition, however, he would be a lock if he played his whole career like he has since 2003. He spent most of the first decade of his career floating, which is why he's borderline for me. I wouldn't induct him on the first ballot. I agree with the poster who said that one more elite season, or a few more very good ones will make him a lock to at least get in. Better than 50% chance.

Well he must've done something before 2003 to impress Hockey Canada enough to be on the 2002 gold medal olympic team..

 

[nerdman60]

Alex Mogilny scored 76 goals which included the 50/50, first player to leave the Soviet system to join the NHL, first Russian to wear the C (in Buffalo temporarily), one of the most dynamic players to play the game, how can he not be in the hall of fame?

 

[JCD]

Alex Mogilny scored 76 goals which included the 50/50, first player to leave the Soviet system to join the NHL, first Russian to wear the C (in Buffalo temporarily), one of the most dynamic players to play the game, how can he not be in the hall of fame?

Because one great season doesn't make you a Hall of Fame player. While I would say his case is better than some on the list, he isn't a Hall of Fame caliber player.

 

[David Puddy]

...Best offensive player on the Cup-winning team.

There aren't many who aren't in.

But most of the best offensive players on Cup winning teams are guys like Gretzky, Bossy, Lafleur, Lemieux, Beliveau and Howe.

 

[Tad Mikowsky]

Dave Andreychuk

Scott Niedemeyer

Rob Blake

Ed Belfour

Mark Recchi

Pierre Turgeon

Alexander Mogilny

Nieds maybe. I mean sure he's played on some great teams, but he has always played good, won some major hardware. I don't see why he couldn't make it.

Blake is pretty much like Nieds. If he can make it, i don't see why Blake couldn't as well.

Belfour should be a shoe in. Posted amazing stats, won at the great times, and even for more feel good story, he came in undrafted. the only hit i see is because of his...well surly attitude at times.

Recchi, is probably 100%. He's averaged a .97 PPG average, which is pretty damn good. Having over 1000 points and 500 goals sure helps your case as well. His problem is that he's underrated.

Tugeon, as well should be in it. He's has an even better PPG, his stats are there. However, hardware might be an issue, as he only one a lady byng award once.

Andy , i dunno i never liked him. Maybe Biased.

Mogilny no. Like stated, talent can come so far, and his peak was very brief.

 

[Big Phil]

Alex Mogilny scored 76 goals which included the 50/50, first player to leave the Soviet system to join the NHL, first Russian to wear the C (in Buffalo temporarily), one of the most dynamic players to play the game, how can he not be in the hall of fame?

Wait a minute, I dont recall Mogilny hitting the 50/50 mark in '93. From what I remember, it is only Richard, Bossy, Gretzky, Lemieux, Hull and Neely who have done it. Neely not doing it in consecutive games though just in games he played spread out through the season.

 

[dcinroc]

Wait a minute, I dont recall Mogilny hitting the 50/50 mark in '93. From what I remember, it is only Richard, Bossy, Gretzky, Lemieux, Hull and Neely who have done it. Neely not doing it in consecutive games though just in games he played spread out through the season.

The official list is Richard, Bossy, Gretzky, Lemieux, Hull

Kurri, Lemieux (again), Mogilny and Neely all scored 50 in their first 50 or fewer games played, but not by their teams 50th game.

Mogilny scored 50 goals in his first 46 games in 92-93.

 

[The Kingslayer]

2000 to 2003 Rob Blake was a better defenseman than Nik Lidstrom

From birth to present day Lidstrom is a better defenseman then Blake