Goaltending Controversy (A Good One)

[Vashanesh]

The average starter is just an average goalie usually themselves imo. There is such a small gap these days between average and elite due to training of modern goaltenders.

Most fringe starters and backups aren't all that much different than those in front of them. Just waiting to get the chance to play regularly just like Backstrom took the job from Manny back in the day.

Goaltending today, it's a lot different than in the 80's and much of the 90's. Many starters stay above those behind them primarily due to contract. Gm's have a hard time justifying contracts like Backstrom's if they aren't on the ice so much. In previous years Harding looked ready to take the job away from Backstrom easily, but injuries and inconsistent playing time caused his play to go up and down...just like inconsistent play did to Backstrom before Manny finally got injured and Backstrom got to consistently start. People thought I was crazy when I said trade Manny and start Backstrom. Manny was overpaid and Backstrom looked good enough to me...didn't care that he was unproven. Then Risebrough eventually overpaid Backstrom even more, so then I wanted Backstrom gone.

I don't fear letting a so called "unproven" goaltender take the starting job like it seems so many do.

Unproven to me just means never given the chance.

I would never pay a goaltender more than $3 mil yr in today's NHL.

Talon, can I just have you fight my battles for me whenever my Backstrom disdain gets called into question? You're always a lot more eloquent in explaining it, and we're clearing seeing the same thing.

 

[The Kessel Run]

Caught the Wild game last night. I was very impressed with Kuemper, particularly his athleticism/mobility. What has his projection as a prospect been, Wild fans? I don't know much about him.

 

[THEALLKNOWING*]

Kuemper looked very shaky first game, was better last night. He's still way too young to be getting a lot of games. If Harding isn't able to play, put him on LTIR, that opens up a roster spot and cap space, and maybe we have to re-sign Backs as a veteran guy while we work young goalies in.

I was against resigning Harding, but what is done, is done. Harding may end up pulling a PMB, and make an effort to play until his contract runs out. I don't blame him for doing it, but its not the greatest thing for Fletch to have to work around. And even if he went on LTIR, it is still bucks going out the door for CL.

I don't mind resigning Backstrom as the back-up if the price is right. I would rather have him helping out than a newbie to the team, old geezer. If Harding goes LTIR, then shuffle both Kuemper and Hackett up here, and allow them to get experience. Not just backing-up. While the two of them may have some lack of experience issues, Backstrom definitely has some age issues. I would almost rather take a chance on them making mistakes, than trying to pretend Backstrom still has it (if he ever did).

 

[Jarick]

You have to make a decision though...buy out Harding at $4m spread over four years or buy out Heatley at $5m spread over two years? Unless they can work a trade where they can hold back some of Heatley's salary. But Harding on LTIR has no impact on the cap and opens up a roster spot.

If they let Backstrom walk and buy out Harding, I wouldn't mind taking a run at Theodore. He was very good for us the one year he played here. And I'd think if/when FLA gets Luongo, he'll be allowed to walk this summer.

 

[jedisports]

Our goalie situation is definitely complicated to say the least. I can't even begin to figure out what to do with this.

Can someone post the numbers for both Hards and Backs? What precisely is their contact situations?

 

[BigT2002]

He looks good, but I think Backstrom stops that Dats goal. And there were times that he lost sight of the puck. Hell even I did on one series in our own end.

 

[this providence]

Much, much rather see them re-sign Backstrom at a reason 2 year deal than see the Wild either have faith in Harding, bring in someone from outside the organization, or give both jobs to the kids.

In my opinion, you're setting up the team for disaster if you let Backstrom walk. Especially if they don't bring in a legitimate goaltender that can handle an extensive workload. Hate to say it as I respect many people who have let their views known on Backstrom whether it's on here or in public; but I think they're out to lunch on some of the criticism he takes.

 

[Haite]

For example, Washington's goalie duo this year:
Braden Holtby 9GP 4W 5L 0OT 3.68GAA .888Sv.%
Michal Neuvirth 7GP 1W 4L 1OT 3.05GAA .889Sv.%

I'd never have trust in two young guys at the net to start the season. Worst case scenario is that not only are they unable to fulfill their duties between the pipes, but it could also mess up with their confidence and sideline development. It's not rare for goalies to look excellent in their first games, and still take a couple of years until they break into the NHL.

I also have doubts in being able to fill goaltending hole with a free agent. Outside Mike Smith and Jimmy Howard (who I think will both re-sign) the only option is Theodore, and I fail to see how he'd be an improvement over Bäckström.

Re-sign Bäckström to a reasonable 1 or 2-year contract, and if Hards is done (man it would suck if his last start was that Detroit game where he was pulled) let Hackett and Kuemper compete for the back-up spot. In my opinion Gustafsson should spend one more year in Sweden. I've seen too many promising young Finnish goalies try to make the transition and then come back because they weren't ready.

 

[Quicy]

Our goalie situation is definitely complicated to say the least. I can't even begin to figure out what to do with this.

Can someone post the numbers for both Hards and Backs? What precisely is their contact situations?

http://capgeek.com/wild

Backstrom: 1 year @ 6M
Harding: 3 years @ 1.9M

For example, Washington's goalie duo this year:
Braden Holtby 9GP 4W 5L 0OT 3.68GAA .888Sv.%
Michal Neuvirth 7GP 1W 4L 1OT 3.05GAA .889Sv.%

I'd never have trust in two young guys at the net to start the season. Worst case scenario is that not only are they unable to fulfill their duties between the pipes, but it could also mess up with their confidence and sideline development. It's not rare for goalies to look excellent in their first games, and still take a couple of years until they break into the NHL.

I agree with this, I've seen a lot of the Caps' games this year and you can tell that having two young goalie starters brings its fair share of growing pains. The inconsistencies are there and you can tell it hurts the team at times when they need a big save and it just hasn't been there. I think one veteran is needed for at least another season.

 

[Jarick]

Amazing how those two young goalies numbers are so similar, right?

Or maybe it's the system?

Under Hunter:

Neuvirth = 2.82 / .903
Holtby = 2.49 / .922
Vokoun = 2.51 / .917

Under Boudreau:

Neuvirth = 2.45 / .914
Varlamov = 2.23 / .924
Hotlby = 1.79 / .934

Caps are almost a full goal per game worse and of course the save percentage plummets. Amazing how terrible a decision it was to fire Boudreau...Caps got worse offensively and defensively. And losing Semin hurts too.


FYI, Theodore had pretty much identical stats splitting with Backstrom:

Backstrom = 2.66 / .917
Theodore = 2.71 / .917


Depends on money and health IMO...if he's willing to play for $3m or less, I'd do it. If he can stay healthy the rest of this year.

 

[Northland Wild Man]

Tough decisions are ahead. Backstrom has always been decent for the Wild, but he can't move like he once did. Harding is still good but I have my doubts about him being able to handle the majority of games in a season. Hackett and Kuemper are the 2 guys I think will be the duo for the future unless Gustafsson blows them out of the water, which still could happen.

 

[DANOZ28]

backs is way overpaid, but sometime this year he'll get hot and you'll remember why its good he's a steady eddie on this team. i would only let backs go if T-rex theodore was available. just my one cent. (low cost experienced option)

 

[PariseSuterKoivu]

I personally would like to see Kuemper and Hackett get the majority of starts here and Houston. this year. One should be the #1 goalie up here, and the other the #1 in Houston. The Wild is all about next year and beyond. Unless you think we can win the cup this year (and after watching Chicago recently, we have a long way to go to catch them) we need to let the young guys play as much as possible and prepare for next year.

 

[Blizzard6411]

I personally would like to see Kuemper and Hackett get the majority of starts here and Houston. this year. One should be the #1 goalie up here, and the other the #1 in Houston. The Wild is all about next year and beyond. Unless you think we can win the cup this year (and after watching Chicago recently, we have a long way to go to catch them) we need to let the young guys play as much as possible and prepare for next year.

I think it is important for developing a cup run in a couple years that they DO make the playoffs this year, that is invaluable experience. They are a playoff caliber team right now with Backs getting the #1 minutes, I don't think that is true if you put the bulk of the work in the hands of a kid who has a grand total of 2 starts in the NHL. Even if Kuemper stays right here as the #2 he is gaining experience that he couldn't gain being the #1 in Houston.
Backs is a steady hand who has been through it all and there is something to be said for that alone. If he wants some ridiculous dollar amount to stay then that changes my tune but we won't know til we get there.

 

[Quicy]

Caps are almost a full goal per game worse and of course the save percentage plummets. Amazing how terrible a decision it was to fire Boudreau...Caps got worse offensively and defensively. And losing Semin hurts too.

I think it has more to do with the change of system but not players. After they got upset by Montreal (mainly Halak), the team tried to be more "defensive minded," but the lacked the players to do that. Sure they made a decent run last year in the playoffs, but they weren't the better team in either series.

I also think it is tough to evaluate the stats of goalies for that team. There are so many defensive lapses that happen right in front of the net lately. Its as if the team collapses into the crease. I do think you are right about the firing of Boudreau, neither new coach they have brought in should be coaching that team.

 

[Kaptain]

The way Backstrom is playing this year? No thanks. He's clearly not the player he was two years ago.

But really, Keumper has looked far superior to Hackett in the NHL and AHL.
I'd be happy with Backs/Keumper for this year and the next.
Buyout Harding. PLEASE.

 

[Dampland]

Goalies always need seasoning in the minors. and so I 'd like to see both Hackett and Kuemper split the starts next year in the AHL. Then for the Wild, re-sign Backs at a much lower contract, and if Hards is ok, keep him. If he is not doing ok, then grab a cheap back up, or perhaps let The Swedish goalie play back up.

Then for 2014-2015, we can have Hacket, Kuemper & the Swede battle it out for the Wild's two, with the loser being "the man" in the AHL.

Then just run a goalie tandem with the Wild, letting each start 41 games or so.

IF done correctedly, it can work to roll out 2 goalies on a regulr basis.

 

[saywut]

There is no goalie controversy right now. Backstrom's clearly our starter and Harding's his back-up when he's ready to go.

It does get tricky next year though, when Hackett will require waivers and Harding's still under contract unless we buy him out. Certainly not comfortable with that tandem or with Kuemper in the mix instead of one of them. Decisions have to be made, be interesting to see what Fletcher does. History shows he's not comfortable giving young players spots, so I do expect Backstrom or another proven starter to be on our team next year, and wouldn't be surprised to see a 2nd veteran, perhaps on a 2-way contract(or Harding on his current) who could potentially be our back-up. Yeah, that may crowd Houston(especially if Gustafsson comes over, but I have no problem keeping him in the SEL for another year) but if the organization feels Kuemper has surpassed Hackett then Hackett should be moved for anything, since he'll be on waivers next year.

 

[TaLoN]

You have to make a decision though...buy out Harding at $4m spread over four years or buy out Heatley at $5m spread over two years? Unless they can work a trade where they can hold back some of Heatley's salary. But Harding on LTIR has no impact on the cap and opens up a roster spot.

If they let Backstrom walk and buy out Harding, I wouldn't mind taking a run at Theodore. He was very good for us the one year he played here. And I'd think if/when FLA gets Luongo, he'll be allowed to walk this summer.

If he's available, I'd be absolutely pleased with him as the Wild tender at a reasonable price.

 

[tomgilbertfan]

Pretty sure Theodore was talking about how he wanted to retire to Florida before he signed there. Not sure if he's going to keep playing after his contract is up.

But if he does I'd love to have Theo back.

 

[Billy Mays Here*]

There is no goalie controversy right now. Backstrom's clearly our starter and Harding's his back-up when he's ready to go.

The controversy I was referring to is more the future of Wild goaltending with so many good prospects and what's going to happen with each of our current and future goalies. I wasn't referring to our current situation with Backstrom/Harding because that's not a situation at all.

 

[Aapo]

I might have missed Brodin (even though I consider myself one of his first disciples), but I hereby claim to be the first on HF with a Gustafsson avatar.

Many are those who shall follow.

(And thats really all I have to say in theese matters.)

 

[saywut]

The controversy I was referring to is more the future of Wild goaltending with so many good prospects and what's going to happen with each of our current and future goalies. I wasn't referring to our current situation with Backstrom/Harding because that's not a situation at all.

The only real controversies for next season is we currently have nothing guaranteed for either NHL spot and that Hackett is subject to waivers, so if we're still high on him we shouldn't expose him, though goalies do tend to clear quite a bit since normally teams have their 2 before training camp opens.

 

[Victorious Secret]

Meh. I voted for Hackett as #3 Wild prospect in summer and Kuemper at #4. Knew he was good, but didn't think he'd hop Hackett so fast. Yes, smug face on.

 

[Bookman]

I still think Gustafsson is the future #1.

You oughta do a poll for funzies.