Management GM Pierre Dorion WORST moves #3

[Xspyrit]

GM Pierre Dorion (2016-present) WORST moves

#1 - Mika Zibanejad (23 y/o) + 2018 2nd round pick (#33 OA) for Derick Brassard (29 y/o)
#2- Kyle Turris (28 y/o) + 2019 1st (#4 OA) + Shane Bowers + 2019 3rd (#63 OA) for Matt Duchene (27 y/o)




Of course all of this is with the benefit of hindsight, we are starting to look at the end results of these moves

Some personal notes and options to add later

- Johnny Oduya (35 y/o) contract : 1 year x 2.25 (played way too much for where he was at, it was his last year in the NHL)
- Craig Anderson (37 y/o) extension : 2 years x 4.75 (that seemed very high for a goalie who was aging/declining)
- Anders Nilsson (29 y/o) extension : 2 years x 2.6 (uh too much too fast once again)
- Ron Hainsey (38 y/o) : 1 year x 3.5 (3rd in TOI/GP for D-men, best he could get I suppose)
- Evgeni Dadonov (27 y/o) contract : 3 years x 5.0 (vast majority liked that signing but he didn't fit in Ottawa. Dorion made a nice trade to get out of the contract thought, getting 1 year of Holden and a 3rd round pick)
- Michael Del Zotto (31 y/o) contract : 2 years x 2.0 (doesn't seem like it was a good idea, hindsight or not)
- Alex Chiasson for Patrick Sieloff
- Hiring Guy Boucher and staff
- Hiring DJ Smith and staff

Click to read more...

 

[bicboi64]

Stone trade. Not getting a 1st (even a conditional) or more assets was unacceptable. We traded one of the best all round wingers in the game right now for an B+ prospect, a 2nd and Oscar Lindberg. Its not like Lindberg did anything for us either. Even having another prospect like Hague or Rondberg would've been better since we could've interpreted the trade as quantity over quality.

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

Im actually shocked yall said that Turris trade was his 2nd worst.

Yes, we lost a chance at a top 4 or top pairing defender who would be momentous for us now... but:

1) We made a gamble for a number 1 C who was actually spectacular for us but the team just didnt digest it and other issues arose.
2) The biggggest factor in the trade is we did not sign Turris to a 6x6 deal which is one of the few times Dorion showed competence on player value and let someone go while they peaked.
3) We still recouped Thomson who might very well be a top 4 defender for us

I suppose people voted it because it showed Dorion's inability to read the team's trajectory and was reactionary band-aid move which backfired hardcore?

Mark Stone one was worse. We got a top prospect, but not even a 1st for a star forward.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Dahlen has more goals this season than burrows did the entire last season with us

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Im actually shocked yall said that Turris trade was his 2nd worst.

Yes, we lost a chance at a top 4 or top pairing defender who would be momentous for us now... but:

1) We made a gamble for a number 1 C who was actually spectacular for us but the team just didnt digest it and other issues arose.
2) The biggggest factor in the trade is we did not sign Turris to a 6x6 deal which is one of the few times Dorion showed competence on player value and let someone go while they peaked.
3) We still recouped Thomson who might very well be a top 4 defender for us

I suppose people voted it because it showed Dorion's inability to read the team's trajectory and was reactionary band-aid move which backfired hardcore?

Mark Stone one was worse. We got a top prospect, but not even a 1st for a star forward.

The bolded is the reasoning pointed to by most, but the deal was marred by seeing what Nashville gave up for Turris and knowing that Ottawa could have just as easily sold Turris for a song if they really didn't want to re-sign him.

You add that up with a 1st, 3rd and Bowers and it looked like a positional upgrade for 1 extra season contractually, for the cost of like 6 (at the time) quality pieces.

Good point about Thomson. Hopefully he can make it all worth it since the other pieces are gone.

 

[DrEasy]

The bolded is the reasoning pointed to by most, but the deal was marred by seeing what Nashville gave up for Turris and knowing that Ottawa could have just as easily sold Turris for a song if they really didn't want to re-sign him.

You add that up with a 1st, 3rd and Bowers and it looked like a positional upgrade for 1 extra season contractually, for the cost of like 6 (at the time) quality pieces.

Good point about Thomson. Hopefully he can make it all worth it since the other pieces are gone.

Selling Turris for picks at the time we traded him for Duchene wouldn't have been easily understood by the fanbase either, given our (probably overestimated) playoff aspirations at the time. I mean, we just fluked our way into the ECF just a year before. And waiting till the deadline (and therefore till we likely were no longer in the playoff race) would have further exposed Turris' performance drop ever since the gumby incident, hence decreasing his trade value.

So all in all, I understood the trade when it happened. I was excited by the Duchene acquisition. I don't think we would have made the playoffs without this trade either, but for sure it appears in hindsight that bringing in Duchene precipitated our fall instead of improving our fate.

tl;dr Really hard to know what would have happened in a parallel universe when this trade doesn't happen, but my guess is we would have been a seller at the deadline, with Turris not having much trade value by then.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Selling Turris for picks at the time we traded him for Duchene wouldn't have been easily understood by the fanbase either, given our (probably overestimated) playoff aspirations at the time. I mean, we just fluked our way into the ECF just a year before. And waiting till the deadline (and therefore till we likely were no longer in the playoff race) would have further exposed Turris' performance drop ever since the gumby incident, hence decreasing his trade value.

So all in all, I understood the trade when it happened. I was excited by the Duchene acquisition. I don't think we would have made the playoffs without this trade either, but for sure it appears in hindsight that bringing in Duchene precipitated our fall instead of improving our fate.

tl;dr Really hard to know what would have happened in a parallel universe when this trade doesn't happen, but my guess is we would have been a seller at the deadline, with Turris not having much trade value by then.

Those are some good points and I wasn't necessarily arguing for what I said, rather just portraying what I read a lot of here and why it was voted as second worst. It was a complicated situation if Dorion knew the financial backing wasn't going to be there for the upcoming UFA's, so I understand wanting to upgrade, it's just not the route he probably should have gone and in hindsight (or foresight depending who you ask) the team was suffering from personnel losses and injuries too much to matter either way.

It wouldn't have been as simple as selling Turris for the same and a deadline sell off would have changed the return, I can agree with that, but the meme sort of stuff at the time was that on paper it looked like an embarrassing list of assets for what looked like merely a small center upgrade for less than two seasons. I think that part stands to an extent, it was a king's ransom for what turned out to be less than two seasons of a fairly one dimensional player. Granted Duchene did outperform Turris statistically, so theoretically it was a bigger upgrade than it appeared at the time with Turris turning in to a potato so quickly.

 

[Puikiou]

26 years old, 6ft3, PPG, Selke level right winger

for

20 years old, 5ft9 defenseman that had yet to play a game in the NHL + 2nd round pick

That was our GM's proudest day.

 

[Laphroaig]

Drafting Boucher instead of Sillinger is the most inexcusable move for me. Getting cute with such an early pick never works out. See Brian Lee.

If I remember correctly Cody Glass is the guy we wanted for Stone but Vegas wouldn't part with him. He now looks like a bust. Our options were limited as Vegas is where Stone wanted to be.

 

[SPF6ty9]

Those are some good points and I wasn't necessarily arguing for what I said, rather just portraying what I read a lot of here and why it was voted as second worst. It was a complicated situation if Dorion knew the financial backing wasn't going to be there for the upcoming UFA's, so I understand wanting to upgrade, it's just not the route he probably should have gone and in hindsight (or foresight depending who you ask) the team was suffering from personnel losses and injuries too much to matter either way.

It wouldn't have been as simple as selling Turris for the same and a deadline sell off would have changed the return, I can agree with that, but the meme sort of stuff at the time was that on paper it looked like an embarrassing list of assets for what looked like merely a small center upgrade for less than two seasons. I think that part stands to an extent, it was a king's ransom for what turned out to be less than two seasons of a fairly one dimensional player. Granted Duchene did outperform Turris statistically, so theoretically it was a bigger upgrade than it appeared at the time with Turris turning in to a potato so quickly.

In hindsight, would have been nice to sell Turris for spare parts if it meant keeping that pick. Byram is more valuable than the entirety of the deal on both sides today.

I'd be hypocritical to call it the worst, since I thought it was a bit of an overpay but was excited at the time. But looking back, that trade cost us a year of rebuilding / one less year of contention with this core. It really is the type of deal you'd expect to see proposed on hfboards, where a fan gets so excited about acquiring a specific player that they become blind to the risks, no matter how unlikely, of the deal. An experienced executive that can take emotions out of play may have been more patient.

Anyways, I'm still voting the Stepan deal, was stupid the day it was made, was stupid now, not to mention there was clearly minimal due diligence done. The guy didn't even want to play here and we didn't know that.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

In hindsight, would have been nice to sell Turris for spare parts if it meant keeping that pick. Byram is more valuable than the entirety of the deal on both sides today.

I'd be hypocritical to call it the worst, since I thought it was a bit of an overpay but was excited at the time. But looking back, that trade cost us a year of rebuilding / one less year of contention with this core. It really is the type of deal you'd expect to see proposed on hfboards, where a fan gets so excited about acquiring a specific player that they become blind to the risks, no matter how unlikely, of the deal. An experienced executive that can take emotions out of play may have been more patient.

Anyways, I'm still voting the Stepan deal, was stupid the day it was made, was stupid now, not to mention there was clearly minimal due diligence done. The guy didn't even want to play here and we didn't know that.

I would agree, that deal alone essentially added a year to the rebuild and started it all off on a sour note knowing we didn't have our own pick.

 

[Xspyrit]

I would agree, that deal alone essentially added a year to the rebuild and started it all off on a sour note knowing we didn't have our own pick.

We actually decided to draft Tkachuk 4th OA the draft before, but in the 2nd draft of the rebuild (2019), not having our own pick and the 19th OA pick instead kinda stung a lot

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

We actually decided to draft Tkachuk 4th OA the draft before, but in the 2nd draft of the rebuild (2019), not having our own pick and the 19th OA pick instead kinda stung a lot

Ah yes, that's right. Thanks for the memory bank bump.

Me saying it delayed the rebuild was probably overkill regardless since they still had other picks that year, but it was prolonged suffering without the premier piece that are the tanking prize.

 

[Xspyrit]

Ah yes, that's right. Thanks for the memory bank bump.

Me saying it delayed the rebuild was probably overkill regardless since they still had other picks that year, but it was prolonged suffering without the premier piece that are the tanking prize.

You thought that way because it was the first season we knew right from the start that we were going to end up in the lottery... and we didn't even have our first round pick

What a shitty season that was

 

[supsens]

Mark Stone was a pending UFA and was not being resigned Brann was a high end "can't miss" prospect. It was a good trade at the time. Sucks how it's turning out but you guys really need to move on. The toxic poop throwing in every single thread has turned these boards into a empty negative echo chamber with the same 4 complaints voiced over and over.
17,000 whaaa mark stone, Zero yay EK trade, yay no Duchene yay no Turris

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Mark Stone was a pending UFA and was not being resigned Brann was a high end "can't miss" prospect. It was a good trade at the time. Sucks how it's turning out but you guys really need to move on. The toxic poop throwing in every single thread has turned these boards into a empty negative echo chamber with the same 4 complaints voiced over and over.
17,000 whaaa mark stone, Zero yay EK trade, yay no Duchene yay no Turris

This is the Dorion worst moves thread. Content seems applicable.

 

[supsens]

This is the Dorion worst moves thread. Content seems applicable.

It’s brought up in every thread every day. you all just agree to say the same thing to each other over and over and attack anyone who dares to say anything else. It’s so depressing and negative

 

[Bileur]

Mark Stone was a pending UFA and was not being resigned Brann was a high end "can't miss" prospect. It was a good trade at the time. Sucks how it's turning out but you guys really need to move on. The toxic poop throwing in every single thread has turned these boards into a empty negative echo chamber with the same 4 complaints voiced over and over.
17,000 whaaa mark stone, Zero yay EK trade, yay no Duchene yay no Turris

It must be frustrating living in a fantasy world and not having anyone else live the same fantasy with you.

The trade was widely seen as underwhelming at the time (at best) and has since gotten worse.

 

[supsens]

It must be frustrating living in a fantasy world and not having anyone else live the same fantasy with you.

The trade was widely seen as underwhelming at the time (at best) and has since gotten worse.

Oh your right not one person thought Bran was a high end blue chip prospect.......
Way to drop your knowledge, please go complain some more about every single trade and draft pick I am sure you will continue to be proven right blindly once in while then you can walk around tough internet talking everyone...
Haha

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

It’s brought up in every thread every day. you all just agree to say the same thing to each other over and over and attack anyone who dares to say anything else. It’s so depressing and negative

And you spend most of your time here complaining about complaining. Contribute something positive.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Mark Stone was a pending UFA and was not being resigned Brann was a high end "can't miss" prospect. It was a good trade at the time. Sucks how it's turning out but you guys really need to move on. The toxic poop throwing in every single thread has turned these boards into a empty negative echo chamber with the same 4 complaints voiced over and over.
17,000 whaaa mark stone, Zero yay EK trade, yay no Duchene yay no Turris

Dude you’re in the “Dorion worst moves” thread