GDT: Game 1: Ducks @ Canucks GDT pt II: Electric Boogaloo

[Ducks DVM]

I'm not sure that a sample of one game is enough to draw a conclusion from.

Clearly, Boudreau has him here for a reason. I don't think that reason is to steal time from other prospects. If he gets sent down it will be because Boudreau feels someone else can provide what we're losing with his subtraction.

The only guys that I saw down in Norfolk that could possibly provide that aren't with our team right now, and unlike Devo, are better served polishing their offensive games: Etem and Wagner.

I think the reason is that he provided glimpses of talent last year they are hoping he replicates. Like McMillan, that's not a lock to stick around if year 2 is a regression.

Maybe he's sick. Maybe he has attitude problems. Maybe he has a sophomore slump. I don't know. But clearly they are evaluating the young players, and DSP was the least impressive of the bunch. If they're earning ice time, he needs to get with it.

 

[KaseMeOutside]

It's not completely definitive but do you think that his level is going to raise that much in 4 games? I mean I imagine he will improve but I guess I don't believe he will improve enough to completely justify burning a year off his ELC.

Does the 5 rule count towards first 5 games period or games played? For example what if Holland plays next game and Rakkel sits? How many games does he have left? 3 or 4?

It's possible,
first you need to take into account that the 4th line got stuck out there against the Sedins a few times. The Sedins embarrass good checking lines.

Second, Rakell's improvement from the first period, to the third was noticeable, it's reasonable to think he can get better as he adjusts to NHL speed

 

[Exit Dose]

I think the reason is that he provided glimpses of talent last year they are hoping he replicates. Like McMillan, that's not a lock to stick around if year 2 is a regression.

Maybe he's sick. Maybe he has attitude problems. Maybe he has a sophomore slump. I don't know. But clearly they are evaluating the young players, and DSP was the least impressive of the bunch. If they're earning ice time, he needs to get with it.

I'm not arguing that he's a lock to stick with the team.

 

[Ducksgo*]

I like what someone suggested in the other thread, make Fowler the rover like Scotty, and allow Getzlaf to move back and forth from the half walls to the point. Having 2 shots as deadly as Souray and Getzlaf at the points will make PK'ers think twice about having to block them and with Fowler moving around it won't allow the PK'ers to be stationary, potentially opening up more holes, I hope Niedermayer can teach this to Fowler.

Really think Souray is gonna be a weapon on the PP, I'd dare suggest he's never played on a PP unit as talented as our no.1 group

the defense as a whole is gonna take a little while to gel though, I noticed alot of miscommunication/not knowing partner moments. Allen is gonna be very happy to have Cam back i'll just say that...

Um yah? Sourays a beast I'm not mad at the 3 year deal. We need his shot. We haven't had a shot like his since Pronger. People need to deal with it. Getting pts OFF the point is crucial. Sorry I'm busy trying to win a cup here. What are you doing?

 

[KaseMeOutside]

I think the reason is that he provided glimpses of talent last year they are hoping he replicates. Like McMillan, that's not a lock to stick around if year 2 is a regression.

Maybe he's sick. Maybe he has attitude problems. Maybe he has a sophomore slump. I don't know. But clearly they are evaluating the young players, and DSP was the least impressive of the bunch. If they're earning ice time, he needs to get with it.

I sure hope DSP doesn't turn into McMillan....it's crazy how good McMillan looked, and now due to our prospects improving, he has seemingly been passed over by quite a few guys. but DSP is a more unique player though, the sophmore slump happens to alot of players, wouldn't shock me if it happened to him you're not as hungry when you feel like you have a roster spot locked in, some more trips on the bus in Norfolk might be the medicine he needs....I know Palmieri has talked about that before

 

[KaseMeOutside]

Um yah? Sourays a beast I'm not mad at the 3 year deal. We need his shot. We haven't had a shot like his since Pronger. People need to deal with it. Getting pts OFF the point is crucial. Sorry I'm busy trying to win a cup here. What are you doing?

Well if Souray sucks in year 3 we can utilize the new buyout rules. if he can give us 2 good years i think we'd all take that, I know he trained very hard preparing for the season we haven't had a PP player like him since Pronger, granted he is not the PP QB Pronger was, but Pronger was IMO one of the best i have ever seen at controlling the PP I miss him

 

[Exit Dose]

Well if Souray sucks in year 3 we can utilize the new buyout rules. if he can give us 2 good years i think we'd all take that, I know he trained very hard preparing for the season we haven't had a PP player like him since Pronger, granted he is not the PP QB Pronger was, but Pronger was IMO one of the best i have ever seen at controlling the PP I miss him

Can we or are they limited to this summer?

 

[Ducksgo*]

Well if Souray sucks in year 3 we can utilize the new buyout rules. if he can give us 2 good years i think we'd all take that, I know he trained very hard preparing for the season we haven't had a PP player like him since Pronger, granted he is not the PP QB Pronger was, but Pronger was IMO one of the best i have ever seen at controlling the PP I miss him

Fowler doesn't have a bomb. And we all miss prongs! Beuch has a bomb when he wants to use it, but never does. What's the problem for Souray 3 years? We finally have someone with a cannon at the point? Good pickup IMO

 

[Exit Dose]

Fowler doesn't have a bomb. And we all miss prongs! Beuch has a bomb when he wants to use it, but never does. What's the problem for Souray 3 years? We finally have someone with a cannon at the point? Good pickup IMO

He's injury prone.

 

[KaseMeOutside]

Can we or are they limited to this summer?

The new compliance buyouts, each team gets 2 of and can be used during the summer. luckily for us we don't really have any contracts that are too bad. some would say Cogliano but he's moveable at his number

 

[Kalv]

1) Rakell doesn't need to be better than Holland. He just needs to be a better player for the role.

2) It depends on the player. I don't think Rakell has a whole lot to gain by staying in the CHL. He plays a mature, professional style game which fits better in a professional league than the more free wheeling CHL style. The only real advantage in the CHL would be in allowing Rakell to grow into his body a bit more, and perhaps to focus on his offense.

3) So? Does that mean that minutes are less important for Holland? We're talking about a 4th line spot. 10-13 minutes at even strength is probably all we should expect. I suspect Rakell would end up getting more minutes on the PK, and Holland on the 2nd PP unit.

Also, I'm not even sure Holland and Rakell will end up competing directly for a spot. It could just as easily end up being someone like DSP who loses his spot to make room for Holland. Unless DSP steps up, it probably -should- be him.

1) Yes, i was talking about being better for that open 4C role.

2) He`s barely a career PPG OHL player. I wouldn`t say that he have nothing to prove there No matter how ''pro-game'' he plays. There`s definately the situation where he should only play in NHL now.

3) Yes. Holland is 22 and Rakell is 19. It`s not good for Holland to sit, but there`s a differnece! Holland is in his 2nd pro season, while Rakell now has only 1 pro game under his belt.

 

[Elvs]

Rakell needs to be better in order to stay, imo. It was a good first game, but if all he is now is a 4th liner I don't see the point in burning a year of his ELC. Imo, he could stay in the lineup if he's playing like a 3rd liner (even if it's on the 4th line). But otherwise you could replace him with some veteran, while Rakell gets PP/PK time in juniors and no year is burned off his ELC.

It was the same thing with Smith-Pelly last year. He was good enough to play in the NHL, but you could quite eaisly have replaced him with another physical 4th liner. But at least DSP got a lot of ice time on the 3rd line last season, Rakell probably will be stuck on the 4th line unless he somehow robs Bonino of the 2nd line center spot.

 

[mightyquack]

Um yah? Sourays a beast I'm not mad at the 3 year deal. We need his shot. We haven't had a shot like his since Pronger. People need to deal with it. Getting pts OFF the point is crucial. Sorry I'm busy trying to win a cup here. What are you doing?

What are you doing to win a cup exactly? I didn't know Ducksgo translated to Bob Murray?

 

[Elvs]

The Ducks has had a bomb on the blueline since Pronger, and I'm not thinking of Beauch. Short memory?

 

[Kalv]

Rakell needs to be better in order to stay, imo. It was a good first game, but if all he is now is a 4th liner I don't see the point in burning a year of his ELC. Imo, he could stay in the lineup if he's playing like a 3rd liner (even if it's on the 4th line). But otherwise you could replace him with some veteran, while Rakell gets PP/PK time in juniors and no year is burned off his ELC.

It was the same thing with Smith-Pelly last year. He was good enough to play in the NHL, but you could quite eaisly have replaced him with another physical 4th liner. But at least DSP got a lot of ice time on the 3rd line last season, Rakell probably will be stuck on the 4th line unless he somehow robs Bonino of the 2nd line center spot.

Exactly.

 

[KaseMeOutside]

I guess it was a big mistake starting Getzlaf and Perry as 4th liners, Bobby Ryan to, it really derailed their careers

 

[Kalv]

I guess it was a big mistake starting Getzlaf and Perry as 4th liners, Bobby Ryan to, it really derailed their careers

They weren`t put in the NHL right after juniors, or even in the middle of the season. They had an AHL time to prove they`re worth it. And they also had much better junior careers.

 

[Exit Dose]

Sean Couturier or Ryan O'Reilly?

 

[Kalv]

Couturier doesn`t count in this category. He had way better stats as a 17/18 yo than Rakell have as an 19 yo. I know it`s only statistics, but i believe you have to score more than PPG as an 19yo if you want to make NHL right away.

No matter how developet his 2 way game is, if you can play in the NHL, you should dominate the juniors. By scoring pointsa also.

O`Reilly is a bit different case, though. He surprised many. I don`t think Rakell have that in him. I wish i`m wrong on this, though.

This all is based on stats, i know. But i`ll hold on on my opinion, that Rakell have to grow a little each year in points. No matter how good he is defensively.

 

[Elvs]

They weren`t put in the NHL right after juniors, or even in the middle of the season. They had an AHL time to prove they`re worth it. And they also had much better junior careers.

Yupp, years from their ELC's were gonna get burnt either way for them. Also, they weren't 4th liners. Well, they played on the 4th line but Getzlaf was pretty much top six calibre in his rookie year and Perry good 3rd line material.

 

[mightyquack]

In my opinion, Rakell isn't the type of player you just look at the stats for to decide what to do with him. Rakell will never be a player who will completely dominate the scoresheet, no matter what level he plays at (and his history shows this bar 1 season in an U18 Swedish league)

If we're talking about a Getzlaf-esque center then stats have a little bit more weighting, but for me, there is a lot more then just pure scoring in Rakell's game hence (again IMO) that you shouldn't just look at stats about him.

I don't think Rakell will stay up personally as I have a feeling Holland is going to have a real solid season (wouldn't be disappointed if Rakell stays up though, was impressed in game v Vancouver), but just because Rakell doesn't light it up offensively in the CHL, doesn't mean he should be sent down because of that, as it isn't the biggest part of his game IMO.

 

[KaseMeOutside]

Couturier doesn`t count in this category. He had way better stats as a 17/18 yo than Rakell have as an 19 yo. I know it`s only statistics, but i believe you have to score more than PPG as an 19yo if you want to make NHL right away.

No matter how developet his 2 way game is, if you can play in the NHL, you should dominate the juniors. By scoring pointsa also.

O`Reilly is a bit different case, though. He surprised many. I don`t think Rakell have that in him. I wish i`m wrong on this, though.

This all is based on stats, i know. But i`ll hold on on my opinion, that Rakell have to grow a little each year in points. No matter how good he is defensively.

Rakell's game is not about stats, never has been

 

[Kalv]

In my opinion, Rakell isn't the type of player you just look at the stats for to decide what to do with him. Rakell will never be a player who will completely dominate the scoresheet, no matter what level he plays at (and his history shows this bar 1 season in an U18 Swedish league)

If we're talking about a Getzlaf-esque center then stats have a little bit more weighting, but for me, there is a lot more then just pure scoring in Rakell's game hence (again IMO) that you shouldn't just look at stats about him.

I don't think Rakell will stay up personally as I have a feeling Holland is going to have a real solid season (wouldn't be disappointed if Rakell stays up though, was impressed in game v Vancouver), but just because Rakell doesn't light it up offensively in the CHL, doesn't mean he should be sent down because of that IMO.

That goes for every player, and even more for players like Rakell, who plays good in all 3 zones.

The fact that i stressed myself, is that he doesn`t progress on scoresheet... at all.
Yes, he can very well progress in the defensive play etc and that doesn`t show anything on the scoresheet.

I, personally, want to see some progress from Rakell also on scoresheet... in 3 seasons in juniors.

I`m not saying that he`s a bad player or will bust out. I really like him, i just want to see him develop the offense a little bit more.

 

[Elvs]

In my opinion, Rakell isn't the type of player you just look at the stats for to decide what to do with him. Rakell will never be a player who will completely dominate the scoresheet, no matter what level he plays at (and his history shows this bar 1 season in an U18 Swedish league)

If we're talking about a Getzlaf-esque center then stats have a little bit more weighting, but for me, there is a lot more then just pure scoring in Rakell's game hence (again IMO) that you shouldn't just look at stats about him.

I don't think Rakell will stay up personally as I have a feeling Holland is going to have a real solid season (wouldn't be disappointed if Rakell stays up though, was impressed in game v Vancouver), but just because Rakell doesn't light it up offensively in the CHL, doesn't mean he should be sent down because of that, as it isn't the biggest part of his game IMO.

Rakell's game is not about stats, never has been

Stats has nothing to with it. My point is, if Rakell plays like your average 4th liner I don't see any reason to keep him up. In that case you might as well trade for Darroll Powe or any other random gritty 4th liner, and let Rakell play important minutes in juniors without his ELC kicking in. If however, Rakell plays well above the average 4th liner he can stay, imo.

I know your posts wasn't particulary in responses to mine, I'd just thought I'd clarify my thinking.

 

[Kalv]

Rakell's game is not about stats, never has been

Seriously, it`s not only for Rakell. All players must be judged also by his game, but stats are a big part of the whole picture. Maybe it`s not even the biggest, but they`re also not worthless.

In this case i judged only by stats, therefore, i won`t say it`s completely accurate, but, i`ll still say that Rakell should put up more points.