Forbes 2017 values are out

JD1

Registered User
Sep 12, 2005
16,133
9,708
Whole different situation. We have a hard number to work with Vegas.
The Ottawa appraisal is mostly speculative.

revenue items in the public domain

tv deals. check
parking. check
attendance. check
ticket prices. check
concession estimates based on pricing and event spending. check

there's very little that isn't public if you want to look.

expenses.
player salaries. check.

the methodology they use is spelled out in detail and it's fairly comprehensive
 

Caeldan

Whippet Whisperer
Jun 21, 2008
15,459
1,046
revenue items in the public domain

tv deals. check
parking. check
attendance. check
ticket prices. check
concession estimates based on pricing and event spending. check

there's very little that isn't public if you want to look.

expenses.
player salaries. check.

the methodology they use is spelled out in detail and it's fairly comprehensive

How is parking in the public domain? Do you know how many parking spots they sell per game?
Ticket prices vary based on when they are purchased, so at best its an estimate for total ticket revenue.
Do you know the details of the concessions arrangement between Melnyk and Aramark? Pretty sure that's the opposite of public domain.
Player salaries are unofficially released. And expenses aren't public. What are we paying the training staff? How about the ushers?

Their 'detailed and comprehensive analysis' largely relies on a survey and hearsay from media reports. Again, I refer to my comment of it being largely out of thin air.
 

Golden_Jet

Registered User
Sep 21, 2005
23,033
11,262
What do we spend on Bellevile,
What does flying around the country cost
What does hotels cost
What do sticks cost, per diems cost, etc
 

Golden_Jet

Registered User
Sep 21, 2005
23,033
11,262
playoff home dates are included in revenue so they are also in the operating profit calc

Well half the playoff revenue is in operating cost, half the playoff money goes to revenue sharing.
 

JD1

Registered User
Sep 12, 2005
16,133
9,708
How is parking in the public domain? Do you know how many parking spots they sell per game?
Ticket prices vary based on when they are purchased, so at best its an estimate for total ticket revenue.
Do you know the details of the concessions arrangement between Melnyk and Aramark? Pretty sure that's the opposite of public domain.
Player salaries are unofficially released. And expenses aren't public. What are we paying the training staff? How about the ushers?

Their 'detailed and comprehensive analysis' largely relies on a survey and hearsay from media reports. Again, I refer to my comment of it being largely out of thin air.
there are apparently 8000 parking spots at the facility. that's a number I've heard often but whatever it is, it is verifiable

estimate revenue based on attendance and known pricing information all of which is public isn' that hard to do

idk the details between Aramark and Melnyk. Aramark is a public company though and if I made it my business to know I could build a very accurate business model on concession revenue and revenue splits. Such models exists in a competitive industry with major public companies playing in it.

Same goes for arena operating expenses. Models exists.

You can read their reports. They publish a series of footnotes to their findings that provide insight into their methodology.

Between info in the public domain and using industry cost models the info they produce is pretty accurate.

And if you think that industry cost models are hogwash....what do you think the banking industry uses when financing the construction of major stadiums?

Billion dollar construction projects get financed using these types of models. They need to ascertain that the building is viable prior to lending money to build it. it's common practice.
 

Caeldan

Whippet Whisperer
Jun 21, 2008
15,459
1,046
The banks obviously will get more detailed numbers than Forbes magazine.

Perhaps they've refined their models since the Arizona ownership stuff, but when we had actual numbers to see then it proved how far off Forbes valuations were.
 

Tnuoc Alucard

🇨🇦🔑🧲✈️🎲🥅🎱🍟🥨🌗
Sep 23, 2015
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Let's not get confused with which revenues are for the the CTC and which are for the Senators.

They're operated as two separate entities, and the Senators actully pay "rent" to the CTC to play there, even they're both owned by the same Owner.

I don't know exactly how HHR are calculated, but I suspect there is a standard formula for all teams, that may not include parking revenue, as not all teams have parking revenue.

So let's not assume all revenue generated on a game day, goes into profit column of the Senators, and they may actually be going into the CTC's profit column.
 

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