Prospect Info: Flames prospect rankings: #9
- Thread starter Anglesmith
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Anglesmith
Setting up the play?
This is Klimchuk's spot, for me, if I had to pick just one. Mangiapane and McDonald are on my mind for afterwards.
Yung Rotini
6 Summers
InfinityIggy
Zagidulin's Dad
I went Pollock this time. I think he has good middle six upside, and will have a great year in the AHL.
I can understand anyone picking McDonald, Pollock, Mang
But if you're picking Klimchuk, what are your expectations of him to justify him being at this point? I see him at best a quality 3rd liner, and "gun to my head" that should never be a priority.
Quite a few others have more potential, albeit unlikely.
But if you're picking Klimchuk, what are your expectations of him to justify him being at this point? I see him at best a quality 3rd liner, and "gun to my head" that should never be a priority.
Quite a few others have more potential, albeit unlikely.
MonyontheMoney
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Lunatik
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Klimchuk has the same middle 6 potential as alot of guys, he just hasn't been given an opportunity to display it at the pro level. He also has a higher floor IMO.
Frankly I wouldn't be shocked if he won a LW spot out of camp this year because of his defensive play.
Anglesmith
Setting up the play?
Thing about Mangiapane is we didn't really learn anything new about him this past year that would elevate him above the value of a 6th round pick. He was picked as an undersized 19-year-old who put up great offensive numbers in what would've traditionally been his draft+1 season. All he did this past year is improve upon those numbers in his draft+2 season. All of the same issues which dropped him down to the sixth round are still present and unanswerable: can he play among older players at his size, and will his offensive game translate to professional hockey? Two questions which we'll finally get addressed this season. So for me, I still look at him as as much of a long shot as he was when we drafted him.
And don't get me wrong, for a sixth-rounder, I think he was a great player to put a pick on. I'm very hopeful he'll turn out.
And don't get me wrong, for a sixth-rounder, I think he was a great player to put a pick on. I'm very hopeful he'll turn out.
Tkachuk Norris
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OvermanKingGainer
#BennettFreed #CurseofTheSpulll #FreeOliver
Other than goalies and facepunchers, the last 6th rounder skater the Flames organization signed to an NHL deal was Brett Sutter, eleven years ago. Clearly the Flames do value him more than a sixth round pick as they even identified him as a reason for not qualifying multiple farm team players. He's eligible to play an overage season in the O, yet Treliving identified him as a player he would be shocked if he's not playing pro. The anti-small Burke identified him as a player with a strong chance to be an NHLer.
I don't believe the Flames organization views Mangiapane as a mere sixth round pick. I certainly believe they value him more than Pavel Karnaukhov, the fifth round pick from the same draft. I certInly think his floor is no lower than Klimchuk for instance, and his ceiling higher, despite Klimchuk's status as a first rounder.
As for your comments, 1.8PPG and 50 goals out of any under-20 player is not an insignificant feat even for Junior. It's a mark he hit even with Blandisi gone, which was a concern about his 1.5PPG 2014-15 season as Blandisi went on to make the NHL this last year.
His draft status at this point means very little. Even his undrafted in 2014 ststus means Zilch. His 17, 18, 19 year old seasons when overlayed with past prospects with similar production curves all point towards a high NHL likelyhood.
Lunatik
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The less upside narrative is a complete sham anyhow. Just like him being slow and him not improving each year in the WHL.
What we have is a couple haters, a couple haters.
Some people look at numbers without any context what so ever and make up these works of fiction in their heads to support it. Klimchuk through most of his WHL career was on a poor to mediocre Regina team so he never got the chance to show his offensive abilities because he didn't have other good players to play with.
In his draft year he put up 76 points in 72 games, finished 2nd in team scoring just 4 points behind a 20 year old overager. In his draft plus one season he only put up 74 points, but also played in 15 fewer games; he still finished 3rd in team scoring behind a couple of 20 year old overagers, both of whom had a lower point per game rate. In his draft plus 2 year he was moved to his off wing and used as a mentor for 16 year old Sam Steel, this hurt his numbers but he was still averaging over a point per game. Finally Klimchuk was traded to a team with some offensive horses for the 2nd half of the season and what did he do? Just 50 points in 33 games, which is a 100+ point pace. But now he has a poor offensive season in his first year as a pro and suddenly he is hot garbage according to some haters that clearly have never seen him play because if they had seen him play they would know that offense what the only part of his game that didn't click last year.
So you say he's improved on his numbers, but you're concerned about his numbers translating.....did you think the same thing with Gaudreau?
I watched a few Colt games this year, and in each game both Mang & Andersson stood out.
[mod] It has been no secret that you've coveted this guy since he was picked, even saying he's better than Poirier. You can make all the excuses you want, but at the end of the day he did very little to justify him being selected at this point.
Now this isn't slagging Morgan. I've said a few times, I think his basement is good - I just don't think his ceiling is high.
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WeegarUnderwood
Fan of Intangibles
You can't just look at a players stats and definitely determine if he's been playing well or not. You have to look at the how the player is used, opportunites given, quality of the team etc. Like how Jankowski wasn't putting up a lot of points during his first few seasons in College, he was a better player than stats indicated. Like 100TG has said before, Klimmer was given bottom six for a majority of the season. I think Klimmer is a good player, he's a smart player. I think he'll have a good sophomore pro season
Anglesmith
Setting up the play?
Yeah, I'd be lying if I said I was confident that Gaudreau was going to be impactful at the NHL level before that first debut and the World Championships soon after; however, there are some factors which made Gaudreau a little bit safer of a bet.
Firstly, he was playing college, not junior. He still wasn't playing against 30-year-olds, but there is what I would call a significant difference in the age and physical maturity of his peers in college compared to Mangiapane's peers in junior. As a junior, when Gaudreau was in his last year, he was still about average age for the league, given players can enter the league at 21 and play four years. As a 20-year-old, Mangiapane was right close to the upper limit age of players in the league. Secondly, Gaudreau set a scoring pace at that level in his draft+2 year which was not just good, but amazing. Mangiapane wasn't even the highest scoring player on his team, let alone the highest scoring player in the entire NCAA in over a decade, as was the case with Gaudreau.
Like I say, I'm very encouraged by Mangiapane's progress. There's basically nothing else he could do to prove himself last year other than, say a 150-point season. However, my skepticism was there to start out with, and there just isn't anything to shake that as of yet. Hopefully this year that will change.
Lunatik
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And why was it I said he was better than Poirier? Or right, plays a better all around team game, better defensively... etc. After 1 year in the AHL Klimchuk struggled offensively but was a top PKer and shutdown forward at seasons end.
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I just think it is very possible that Mang takes one of the top 2 LW spots, and Klimchuk is still on the bottom 2.
And to prove your point you slagged Emile. Yet he went on to be pretty successful for a 20 year old on a team that you have said was terrible offensively.
You were wrong then, and wrong now.
Top shutdown F? LMFAO
Lunatik
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With your last sentence it is painfully apparent you never watched a game.
And I never once "slagged" Poirier. I always said it was very close between the two, but Klimchuk was a better playmaker and better defensively. Now please stop fabricating things.
Ace Rimmer
Stoke me a clipper.
Same here, because I think he's more of a sure thing (as much as anybody can be) to ultimately have an NHL career, just has the tools to survive in the NHL at worst as a regular call-up guy.
In hindsight McDonald should be in the top ten, and probably in this spot. I usually forget about him because I never get to see him play regularly and forget that the stat line he puts up in the Q is actually not too bad. Oh well.
I should just stay out of it but this is getting absurd. To me Klimchuk, Pollock and Dube are all lumped together as "B" tier prospects with Mang slotted in somewhere in the middle. It's really not worth the huge debate because the reality is, it's highly unlikely any of them make a significant impact at the NHL level. Honestly, I can't remember the last time any 20 year old forward that could only muster 9 points in their first 55 games of pro, ever made any impact in the NHL, shut down player or otherwise.
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