Former Bruins EX Bruins Discussion Thread

[KrejciMVP]

I look at Donato thus far and I see a lot of Brad Boyes. A guy who is capable of scoring in bunches in your top 6 while the team enjoys no success whatsoever.

right now he's a .5 PPG with 63 career games played, it will be more clear who is really is of a player at 200 games played. 46 games as a Bruin wan't nearly enough time to have any long withstanding opinions of his play

 

[LSCII]

That was the Clode way and now apparently the Cassidy way, which makes me think maybe it's the Cam way? Clearly someone is dictating a certain style and culture, one in which responsible defensive players are valued and rewarded and offensive guys that don't at least make solid efforts to play D (even if they are terrible at it, like Pasta early on) are not.

Exactly. I initially put it on Claude, but clearly it's an organizational approach.

 

[LSCII]

heaven forbid the coaching staff expects a young player to earn their ice time and show consistent effort in all 3 zones...

But it's not all three zones. It's just offensive players and the defensive zone. Defensive minded players are allowed to still play while literally ignoring the offensive zone.

 

[Absurdity]

Donato was given a silver platter in the Bruins top 6 and did nothing with it. He should have started the season in Providence and his spot should have been given to Cehlarik to start the season.

He wasn't scoring and was having trouble in the offensive end. He was floating in the defensive end. He was sent down to work on his game. Brought back up. Still had the same attitude. Was sent back down to continue working on his game. Then tells the Boston Globe that he thinks he is NHL-ready a short time after Neely brought him up during the season ticket holders meeting saying that he still has a few areas of his game that he needs to work on.

Just because he thought he was ready, doesn't mean he should be given NHL ice time over someone else. DeBrusk and Heinen both spent a year in Providence working on their game. I didn't hear Heinen complain about being sent down after being given 8 NHL games.

He's playing great now, but he went from a team that expects results and playoff success to a team that has no pressure to achieve anything this season. Let's see how he fares when there is pressure on Minnesota and the tough gets going.

 

[Absurdity]

But it's not all three zones. It's just offensive players and the defensive zone. Defensive minded players are allowed to still play while literally ignoring the offensive zone.

If you were an NHL GM or coach, who would you prefer to have on your team right now, Sean Kuraly or Ryan Spooner?

 

[Pia8988]

If you were an NHL GM or coach, who would you prefer to have on your team right now, Sean Kuraly or Ryan Spooner?

Phil Kessel or David Backes

 

[whatsbruin]

By most accounts adding Coyle made the current Bruins roster better.
They are bigger down the middle, and Coyle is tougher to play against than Donato.
In a trade you must give to get. I would imagine the B's would have rather kept Donato than trade him, but
again, you must give to get. Maybe there was not other package Minn wanted , and they had to trade Donato.

 

[jgatie]

As someone who played the game, I can tell you one of the main things that kills team chemistry is a guy who won't backcheck, stick waves at a puck battle, and floats in his own end. None of us watch many practices, but I can see a guy like Cassidy pulling his hair out at someone like Donato or Spooner. Meanwhile guys with lesser talent are busting their ass to get back (not to mention guys with far superior talent like Bergeron, Marchand and Pastrnak doing the same). Adding in the fact that neither Spooner nor Donato were lighting it up on the score sheet only intensifies this effect.

 

[Dr Hook]

By most accounts adding Coyle made the current Bruins roster better.
They are bigger down the middle, and Coyle is tougher to play against than Donato.
In a trade you must give to get. I would imagine the B's would have rather kept Donato than trade him, but
again, you must give to get. Maybe there was not other package Minn wanted , and they had to trade Donato.

Great point, Some in this thread are acting like the Bruins were done with Donato and rushed him out the door. It always seemed to me to be a simpler calculus: Bruins needed a 3c badly to help with a good playoff run. Donato was clearly not helping much right now. He's a talent, Minny wanted him because of that. It was a good hockey trade- Anders Bjork, the rights to Gabrielle, Kuhlman, Blidh, Senyshen, who were the Bruins going to give up to get Coyle (or Schenn, or any other 3c option) that made more sense given their objectives?

 

[GloryDaze4877]

Is this directed at anyone in particular or just in general?

If it's open to everyone, I'd say the reason I didn't bash him is because he played so sparingly that it was irrelevant. I think he was ineffective and deserved to be sent down over that alone.

But I will say that I also don't think the team generally puts young offensively minded players in the best position to succeed given they want to remake and reshape the overall way those guys play before they really get trusted enough to utilize their offensive skills. So a guy like Donatao was struggling and then instead of reacting to the play in front of him, was overthinking things so he didn't get into the coaches doghouse. All that did was land him in what he was trying to avoid.

That post was directed at a specific poster, but was edited, perhaps due to my colorful language, or for some other unknown reason.

Let me be blunt, I didn’t like the effort I saw from Donato in all three zones (which was the difference from a player like Pasta) or the tone that I was getting from him when he commented to the media.

I watched Donato in college a bit and I really liked what I saw. I thought the B’s had a good one.

I watched his first stint with the B’s (12 games) and after a hot start (7 pts in 7 games), I thought that some holes in his game appeared. He was good offensively but needed work in the D zone. Not the end of the world. Young kid, good offensively, but needs to be better in all 3 zones. We hear it all the time.

Fast forward to Camp this year, and I was not impressed. Was seeing the same issues I saw last year, plus he didn’t look sharp in the offensive zone. I honestly thought (and believe I said it at the time) that Cehlarik was better in Camp and Donato should have gone down to PRO then.

I saw a kid in Boston that had a great shot, good hands, and showed hustle in the offensive end. When he was in the O zone, it appeared to me that he was a “never met a shot I didn’t like guy” who would take ill-advised shots from bad angles when he had teammates in better shooting positions.

I didn’t see the same effort in the other two zones. I thought his defensive zone coverage of the opposing D at the point was awful and his compete was bad. The most concerning thing to me was that while it was pretty obvious what the issues were, and the coaches must have been addressing it with him, he continued to make comments to the media about how he “deserved” to be on the NHL squad. Then someone (his agent?) sets up the story in the Globe by a writer who doesn’t cover the team, and he has some more comments to the effect that they told him he needed to get better in certain areas, but that “he knows what his strengths are”. All in all, it didn’t paint a very flattering picture.

Kids are going to be kids and they need time to develop, but it seemed to me (and I could be wrong) that he was sending out signals that he disagreed with the coaches assessments and felt he should be in the NHL. When he came back up the first time it appeared that he had the same bad habits as before?

Maybe the trade woke him up a bit (Seguin admitted as much after he was dealt)?? This early on, it’s likely the same issues still exist in his game, but the goal-starved Wild are more willing to live with that if he can provide some offense.

 

[Over the volcano]

Why is it every offensive minded player has to be proficient in the defensive end in order to play, yet defensive minded players do not have to be proficient in the offensive end? If you want complete 2 way players that play in all 3 zones, that's fine. But that's not the dynamic here. Seems a bit hypocritical to me.

Which of the kids around Donato's age on the team are defensive minded and not expected to be proficient in the offensive end?

Debrusk- nope.
Heinen - nope.
Khulman - 2 goals in 7 games- maybe?
McAcvoy- nope.
Bjork - not "defensive minded" and certainly expected more offense.
Pasta - nope
Carlo - seems to fit the bill.

So which other kids fit this model you say the team rewards? Maybe Colby Cave?

 

[Mainehockey33]

The only thing the Bruins could have done to accommodate Donato more would be to let him camp out by the blue line while everyone else plays defense.

 

[BMC]

Exactly. I initially put it on Claude, but clearly it's an organizational approach.

And if it is an organizational approach they need to do a better job of weeding out players who don't have what they're looking for like Spooner & Donato.

 

[LSCII]

If you were an NHL GM or coach, who would you prefer to have on your team right now, Sean Kuraly or Ryan Spooner?

It would all depend on what role I needed to fill, no? If I needed a 4th line grinder, I certainly would not use Spooner. If I needed a player to provide secondary scoring, I certainly would not use Kuraly.

Which is why you can't look at things in a vacuum, but the organization apparently is when it comes to young offensively minded players.

 

[LSCII]

And if it is an organizational approach they need to do a better job of weeding out players who don't have what they're looking for like Spooner & Donato.

Absolutely BMC, and this is the heart of the issue. If they want a guy because of his offensive abilities, why change him and get mad when he's not the guy you want him to be? It's why I say the organizational view is flawed. Draft guys that posses the skills you covet instead of trying to change a player from ground up. The results will be far better than remaking a player's game over.

 

[ODAAT]

The only thing the Bruins could have done to accommodate Donato more would be to let him camp out by the blue line while everyone else plays defense.

Agreed, for me, the issue is never about every player being potential Selke finalists, it`s about effort, willingness and doing some things that are outside of your comfort zone for the betterment of the team.

Donato and what he can do offensively is not a question mark and likely won`t be for years to come. The concern I had with Donato and would have moving forward if he remained a Bruins is, would he be a guy who would, at bare minimum, commit to competing in his own end in the heat of the playoffs when so often a mistake is amplified?

The answer I came up with was nope, now, I see Pasta not always making the right play out of his own zone, or Heinen, Kuraly etc....but they and others all display the willingness and sometimes the guts it takes to make the right play, I don`t see Donato being a guy who will do that, kind of like the baseball player who doesn`t want to get his uniform dirty

This deal will work out for both teams, in Minny, Donato is playing for a coach who can`t spell defense let alone employ a game plan involving any focus on D so it`s right in his wheelhouse

 

[Montecristo]

Coyle is a better fit for the Boston bruins short term and long term. Boston needs secondary scoring and a minutes eater at the center ice spot. Donato is a wing who can’t play hard minutes. Is donato a potential 55-65 point guy? Yup. Would he have been that sitting behind krejci, debrusk, pastrnak. Marchand and Bergeron? Nope. With this bruins team donatos game wasn’t needed. Donato is scoring for Minnesota in the same spots and with less frequency than pastrnak and Marchand do. Boston needed exactly the player coyle can be. Minnesota needed the type of player pastrnak can be. I don’t think coyle will ever be anze kopitar and I don’t think donato will ever be pastrnak. But for this team, it’s more important for their success to have a Anze kopitar knock off than a pastrnak knock off.

Donato wouldn’t score here like he is there. I can say that because he didn’t when he was. He’s probably well hidden in Minnesota on a scoring line where in Boston where he slotted is to play tougher minutes against better forwards. Things he can’t do and coyle can

 

[KrejciMVP]

Name me a player the mastered the Bruins playing well in both zones at 22 and 46 games played. Donatos expectations are not that of a seasoned veteran

 

[jgatie]

Name me a player the mastered the Bruins playing well in both zones at 22 and 46 games played. Donatos expectations are not that of a seasoned veteran

Substitute "mastered" with "give an effort". Nobody asked him to master playing well in both zones. They didn't even ask him to be "proficient" as Lonnie said. They wanted him to give an inkling of effort, while also showing some of the offensive ability he was drafted for. Donato did neither.

You know who did give an inkling of effort at 22 (19, 20, 21)? David Pastrnak, and he is light years more offensively talented than Ryan Donato.

 

[ODAAT]

Name me a player the mastered the Bruins playing well in both zones at 22 and 46 games played. Donatos expectations are not that of a seasoned veteran

mastered? Few, that`s not what I think the coaches expect or expected, it`s about effort and he bailed or didn`t show that effort.

 

[KrejciMVP]

mastered? Few, that`s not what I think the coaches expect or expected, it`s about effort and he bailed or didn`t show that effort.

I dont buy the effort argument and none of us have a clue if they are truely giving effort. Perhaps he was wasn't utilized properly. It's a stupid smear imo. I assume any hockey player who worked his way to the NHL and played for team USA gives effort

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

Name me a player the mastered the Bruins playing well in both zones at 22 and 46 games played. Donatos expectations are not that of a seasoned veteran

no one said he had to master it, or expected him to....both among fans and Bruins coaches

all that was asked of him was to put in effort in all 3 zones and work on improving his issues defensively and puck battles.

he didn't.

if simply asking a young player to put in effort is asking too much, then idk what to say

 

[KrejciMVP]

no one said he had to master it, or expected him to....both among fans and Bruins coaches

all that was asked of him was to put in effort in all 3 zones and work on improving his issues defensively and puck battles.

he didn't.

if simply asking a young player to put in effort is asking too much, then idk what to say

Is there some NHL effort meter we can use to see if a player is giving effort or not?

 

[Mainehockey33]

Donato is handed a spot out of college, then makes the team next year ahead of more deserving players, then gets put on the 2nd line when he didn’t earn it and played like shit in all three zones. Why is this so hard to understand? He didn’t only look bad in the defensive zone, he looked bad in every zone.

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

I dont buy the effort argument and none of us have a clue if they are truely giving effort. Perhaps he was wasn't utilized properly. It's a stupid smear imo. I assume any hockey player who worked his way to the NHL and played for team USA gives effort

bull

when a player never gets below the dots in the D zone, is always behind the play in the neutral zone, or constantly curls away from the puck along the boards to avoid contact...that's pretty blatant lack of effort