Confirmed with Link: Etem for Jensen and a 6th round pick in 2017

[Hi ImHFNYR]

I'm not talking about you. I've seen you have to tell at least four of five people about the sketchiness coming from Stralman's wife and agent. It's not like you're talking out of your ass, and I really don't know why people don't pay attention to what you say more often

Edit: woops, misread your first sentence. But yes, you're 100% correct

If you read what I posted a page prior to this you'd know why. I found my source pretty damn quick. Also I had asked if anyone had a source and the answer was "no" and "It's buried amongst 87,000 posts". Maybe it's there but obviously I am not looking for that needle in a haystack. No matter what if the Rangers only two offers were 3 years 3 AAv and 3 years 4 AAV then there's really no excuse for what a crap job they did trying to retain this guy. The only reason this has dragged out was bc people wanted to disagree and had no argument to back it up. I was open to a source really really early in this convo

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Not happy in the literal sense. I mean happy as in 'you're ok with these moves they made'.Part of my whole premise is I'm pretty unhappy with the effort they made to negotiate and you're debating me on it so how else am I supposed to view it?

I don't think that I am comfortable saying that they made a poor effort. They offered him before FA started. He then didn't give any hometown discount and was unmoving on the TB deal. Caused the team to move on.

Stralman is still a Ranger if he either took a couple of less years or didn't demand a NTC, IMO.

 

[Hi ImHFNYR]

8

Obviously you didn't, hence the word "lazy".

<sigh>, I guess I'll do it for you.

Roster (currently) cap 70.2M. Salary cap is 71.4M

Add Hagelin = 74.2M

Now, you've got 14 forwards. Etem is gone. Megna is up. Stoll is gone. Send Megna back down (-600K) and you're at 73.6M. Send Mcilrath down (-600K) and you're at 73M. What other winger are you dismissing? Stalberg? Not enough (71.9M). Fast? Not enough. Tanner whipping boy Glass? Nope. Miller, Hayes, Moore? Nope to all. The math doesn't work - unless you resort to making fantasy moves, speculative acquisitions, or other acts that have no basis in fact. The "nonsensical" person here is you.

Even if you find that 1.6M to get to the cap ceiling, it allows for no spare F or D for injuries, road trips, or even routine benching(s)/rest.

We couldn't afford Hagelin. It's that simple. It's not about acquiring Etem, or drafting Gropp, or getting a 6th round pick, or Jensen. All of it begins and ends with the fact that Hagelin wanted more and got more then the Rangers could've offered. They wanted to keep him but knew they couldn't. Period, end of story.

Jesus christ man the whole idea is we should have had Hagelin to start the season instead of Stoll, Etem, Glass and Stalberg

Stoll 500k, Etem 850,000, stalberg 1.1, Glass 1.3. That's 3.7 mil. Hags hit is 4.

But where do we get spare bodies from!? Well isn't that my point? That you'd rather solve the problem of keeping hagelin instead of solving the problem of keeping the bench warmed.

But to answer that AND to answer the question of where do you get the extra .3 mil (plus breathing room?). Solution 1: Hags may have been willing to take 5 years for less AAV or even 4 for less AAV to stay with the team. We don't know although I don't see why it's unreasonable to think that he might have agreed to 5 years 3.25.
Solution 2: DON'T spend 4.5 mil on a broken down RD for 2 years when it precludes you from resigning a critical, young part of your team (I guess in this case it looks like it screwed us on two important players).Add on to this the fact that it's a 35+ contract with no relief options and it's a particularly abominable move.

Solution 3: Maybe DONT trade away a great looking prospect for Yandle and his additional cap hit just so that it languishes on the 3rd pair.

Solution 4: Or trade Yandle during the summer before the season starts instead of Hags. A young winger who will be with the team for another 4 or 5 years (PLUS the return for Yandle) beats having a luxury item as your 3rd pair LD who will prob leave in 1 year. This isn't hindsight either you can look at my posts when we traded Yandle and let Stralman go.These were always terrible moves for the roster and for the cap.

That's also why Hank taking 8 instead of 7 really kills us. He deserves it (although I suspect that 4 years from now his play will dip and this contract will turn out to be a very poor value) Every million is critical. Not that I blame him. He prob realized they'd spend the extra million AAV on buying useless plugs like Glass a beachfront property so he got his $. This is the GM's job. He's supposed to consider crap like this. As much as I give Sather a lot more credit than a lot of folks have around here I find he was absolutely goddamn stupid in his last two seasons

 

[Hi ImHFNYR]

I don't think that I am comfortable saying that they made a poor effort. They offered him before FA started. He then didn't give any hometown discount and was unmoving on the TB deal. Caused the team to move on.

Stralman is still a Ranger if he either took a couple of less years or didn't demand a NTC, IMO.

If the offer is what we think it is then I view that as a piss poor effort. But that's my view and I accept if there's a diff of opinion on it

 

[Hunter Gathers]

If the offer is what we think it is then I view that as a piss poor effort. But that's my view and I accept if there's a diff of opinion on it

I think the years was the biggest issue here, Shin. They gave Boyle equal money to Stralman. It was the term length that I think they were most concerned about. They allegedly offered 3 or 4 at 4M. Thinking the 5+NTC is what spooked them fully. That and the lack of home town discount after they basically resurrected his career.

 

[Hi ImHFNYR]

I think the years was the biggest issue here, Shin. They gave Boyle equal money to Stralman. It was the term length that I think they were most concerned about. They allegedly offered 3 or 4 at 4M. Thinking the 5+NTC is what spooked them fully. That and the lack of home town discount after they basically resurrected his career.

But the only reason i'd be spooked is because I'd have worries that his presence will prevent them from signing important young players. By taking on a 35+ multi year contract for the same hit they ended up having this happen anyway. What was going to happen if Boyle doesn't feel motivated to take a much publicized pay cut?

I factor in the quality of Stralman's play, potential cap raises (even though obviously that's stalled a bit) too. I also factor in things like the ability to trade guys if need be. I tend to think they really just wanted Boyle for reasons I can't comprehend when you compare the overall game of both players, age, etc

 

[Brooklyn Ranger]

All-time? You must not remember the dark ages..

Which one? I've lived through several of them.

 

[Brooklyn Ranger]

I posted it a couple of pages back.

The one that mis-quoted Larry Brooks' article?

 

[aufheben]

Etem playing with Linden Vey and Jake Virtanen in his first game.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

8 minutes and a -1 so far.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

12 minutes, no points, and a -1 for the game so far.

 

[BenningHurtsMySoul]

12 minutes, no points, and a -1 for the game so far.

We're quite happy with his play tonight.

 

[SA16]

He also almost just won the game in OT and drew a penalty on the play

 

[aufheben]

He also almost just won the game in OT and drew a penalty on the play

Yeah he's gotten more responsibility in 1 game under WD. Canucks score on the PP.

 

[Ori]

Megna comes up and in his first game of the season plays more time with Stepan and Nash than Etem did in his 19 gp.

Why did Megna deserve that shot and not Etem?


Even if Gropp was the key to the Hagelin trade, this whole thing with Etem was just poor asset management and it seemed like AV just didn't like him and never came close to giving him a legitimate chance. I wasn't in love with Etem by any stretch, but I definitely felt like he's a skill guy who at least deserved a few games in the top 6 to see what he could do there, especially because of the injuries the opportunity was there.

AV clearly has a massive say in all of the moves being made. I'm 100% convinced Sather only signed Glass because AV wanted him.

Yeah, I think this might be AV last year as a Ranger coach unless he win us the cup, and he managed to get us to playoffs and one president trophy, but I feel our team with recent trades with Etem and Hagelin with almost nothing in return is on decline here unfortunately.

So I am actually worried about the Rangers org. since we are suppose to be among the top teams in NHL. I am aware it`s about players too which need to perform on the ice, but the Rangers Org. need to have a good plan for the future in NHL, and I fail to see the light in this trade.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Yeah he's gotten more responsibility in 1 game under WD. Canucks score on the PP.

Expected more from him in his first game. Expected a real FU type of game. Got about what I expected. Didn't see the entire game (was going back and forth between the NC and the Van game), but surprised to not see more impact in his first game.

 

[thepuckmonster]

Expected more from him in his first game. Expected a real FU type of game. Got about what I expected. Didn't see the entire game (was going back and forth between the NC and the Van game), but surprised to not see more impact in his first game.

Honestly he was pretty good given that he was playing with Vey and Virtanen. That was our third line.

Drew two penalties, had two (well three, he almost scored in OT) dangerous shots, his speed was very noticeable.

It's definitely a case of "oh **** this is my last chance" itis.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Honestly he was pretty good given that he was playing with Vey and Virtanen. That was our third line.

Drew two penalties, had two (well three, he almost scored in OT) dangerous shots, his speed was very noticeable.

It's definitely a case of "oh **** this is my last chance" itis.

Yeah, I think this is truly what he needs. Like I said, though. I expected even more, frankly. More hustle and energy. I think he at least gets the HINT that this is his last real chance.

 

[thepuckmonster]

Yeah, I think this is truly what he needs. Like I said, though. I expected even more, frankly. More hustle and energy. I think he at least gets the HINT that this is his last real chance.

That's fair. Had you been able to catch the whole game you'd really see how ****ing horrible we are right now. He was a bright spot on a team filled with underwhelming nonsense (aside from Horvat, Baertschi, Hutton, Tanev, Markstrom, McCann, Virtanen, Sedins).

He seems to have found a bit of chemistry with Vey from the old days so that looks decent moving forward. He's allowed us to ditch Higgins (who I do love but the time is up) so it's a good move for our future, even if he's not necessarily a part of it going forward.

 

[Ori]

I think nucks did a good trade here..
Maybe Etem will find good chemistry on one of Nucks lines. AV didn't give him a good chance on the top lines when we had injury issues, and other players who have been really bad this regular season.
Kreider, Stepan, Girardi, Staal to mention a few key players..

 

[Canucks LB]

Honestly, not sure the type of player etem was for the rangers, but his 1st impression as a Canuck was a huge positive.

He looked like a player who is doing everything to stay in the NHL, high work ethic, drew 3 penalties, nearly scored in OT.

 

[haohmaru]

8

Jesus christ man the whole idea is we should have had Hagelin to start the season instead of Stoll, Etem, Glass and Stalberg

Stoll 500k, Etem 850,000, stalberg 1.1, Glass 1.3. That's 3.7 mil. Hags hit is 4.

But where do we get spare bodies from!? Well isn't that my point? That you'd rather solve the problem of keeping hagelin instead of solving the problem of keeping the bench warmed.

But to answer that AND to answer the question of where do you get the extra .3 mil (plus breathing room?). Solution 1: Hags may have been willing to take 5 years for less AAV or even 4 for less AAV to stay with the team. We don't know although I don't see why it's unreasonable to think that he might have agreed to 5 years 3.25.
Solution 2: DON'T spend 4.5 mil on a broken down RD for 2 years when it precludes you from resigning a critical, young part of your team (I guess in this case it looks like it screwed us on two important players).Add on to this the fact that it's a 35+ contract with no relief options and it's a particularly abominable move.

Solution 3: Maybe DONT trade away a great looking prospect for Yandle and his additional cap hit just so that it languishes on the 3rd pair.

Solution 4: Or trade Yandle during the summer before the season starts instead of Hags. A young winger who will be with the team for another 4 or 5 years (PLUS the return for Yandle) beats having a luxury item as your 3rd pair LD who will prob leave in 1 year. This isn't hindsight either you can look at my posts when we traded Yandle and let Stralman go.These were always terrible moves for the roster and for the cap.

That's also why Hank taking 8 instead of 7 really kills us. He deserves it (although I suspect that 4 years from now his play will dip and this contract will turn out to be a very poor value) Every million is critical. Not that I blame him. He prob realized they'd spend the extra million AAV on buying useless plugs like Glass a beachfront property so he got his $. This is the GM's job. He's supposed to consider crap like this. As much as I give Sather a lot more credit than a lot of folks have around here I find he was absolutely goddamn stupid in his last two seasons

And here it is - exactly what I was talking about. No facts. All conjecture. If we could trade Glass. If Hagelin would take less. If we trade Yandle. If only we didn't sign Lundqvist to his contract. If we didn't sign Girardi or Staal or Nash.If we didn't sign Boyle. IF IF IF IF IF. My math is still right. And, FWIW, I don't even disagree with a lot of your "moves" and loved Hagelin as a Ranger. I wish we could've kept him and stayed clear of Etem.

We could go back and forth about the moves forever. 4M for Hagelin is simply too much.

If we didn't sign Boyle for 4.5M then we would've signed Stralman for probably more than that. No Hagelin.

If Lundqvist didn't get the contract he got, which probably was close or under to market value -AND- is , in part, because of his loyalty to the team AND being the face of the franchise, then maybe he's not here. No Lundqvist, but maybe Hagelin.

Glass is untradeable unless you're eating part of his contract.

Rangers weren't trading Yandle after reaching the ECF's three years in a row and the SCF once. Be realistic - they're coming off a President's trophy, more points than they've ever had in history, etc... They're not trading their best PMD coming off of that season with high expectations going into a new one. And I'm not a big Yandle guy. I liked the move short term but hated it long term.

"Stoll 500k, Etem 850,000, stalberg 1.1, Glass 1.3. That's 3.7 mil. Hags hit is 4. "

And here is the core of the problem. Glass isn't a guy you can move and even if you dump him in Hartford nearly half of his cap hit is retained. The math doesn't work unless, like I said, you go back and start doing fantasy transactions, undo trades/acquisitions, or un-sign people. I like Hagelin, but he's not a 4M player and you can't sacrifice 3-4 roster spots to keep him when you're pretty thin at forward to begin with.

 

[haohmaru]

Honestly, not sure the type of player etem was for the rangers, but his 1st impression as a Canuck was a huge positive.

He looked like a player who is doing everything to stay in the NHL, high work ethic, drew 3 penalties, nearly scored in OT.

He's also got to be getting close to the point where he realizes he's going to run out of teams that want to give him a shot. I wish him the best.

 

[Mikos87]

Honestly he was pretty good given that he was playing with Vey and Virtanen. That was our third line.

Drew two penalties, had two (well three, he almost scored in OT) dangerous shots, his speed was very noticeable.

It's definitely a case of "oh **** this is my last chance" itis.

Honestly, not sure the type of player etem was for the rangers, but his 1st impression as a Canuck was a huge positive.

He looked like a player who is doing everything to stay in the NHL, high work ethic, drew 3 penalties, nearly scored in OT.

He's also got to be getting close to the point where he realizes he's going to run out of teams that want to give him a shot. I wish him the best.

Yeah best of luck to him. He showed none of that in NY. The old Van City staple Tanner Glass out played him here.

But I think being with his old coach and realizing that it's probably his last kick at the can barring an expansion opportunity, he's actually putting an effort out there.


BTW can you guys explain AV and Tanner Glass from their days back in Vancouver?

Was he actually a useful player?

 

[eco's bones]

I have nothing against Etem salvaging his career. As a Ranger he sucked----and sometimes the fit and situation isn't right. To take another Canuck as an example who was horrible as a Ranger--Chris Higgins. He played himself out of our lineup several times in his half season or so in New York. He found a home in Vancouver--though I'm not sure he's that good of a player anymore. I had no regret over his being moved and no regrets later when he became a key player for Vancouver.

Right now though I will say Etem needs to figure his game out quick--find a niche to be an effective night in night out player or his career is not going to be long. It helps sometimes when you make yourself useful in other areas. If he could help his team on the PK for example.