Speculation: Edmonton not a likely destination for Fowler

[snipes]

Before we traded for Larson I wanted no part of Vatanen because I didn't want to see him playing 1st pairing minutes, but with Larson playing in front of him, I agree with everything you've said here. I would cough up Nuge or Eberle for Vatanen.

And while that would make the Ducks look a lot more relevant up front, they'd clearly be enabling the Oilers to compete against any team in the league.

Yeah, I would have Vatanen as a 2nd pairing D, 1st pairing PP QB. He would be a huge boost to our team, him and Davidson would be a slick 2nd pairing going forward.

ANA obviously has no interest in giving us exactly the piece we need to really push our division foes.

 

[DraberlyakMcHallkins*]

Fowler is underrated and HERO charts don't tell the full story for D men. You need to use the eye test, strength of competition, D-zone starts, etc.

Dmen are way harder to evaluate than forwards. Having said that, more interested in Vats than Fowler as he fills a need as a RHD PP QB. As division rivals, ANA has zero interest in moving Vatanen to EDM to play on the PP with McDavid. I wouldn't move him to us either.

if eye test is a 100% pass then it's got to show in any kind of metric, it doesn't or at least hasn't for 2 straight seasons

I have more interest in Vatanen, Manson, Montour, Lindholm(doesnt even need to be said) than Fowler. All would be great fits in EDM. I'm not trashing Anaheim's defence, I just find Fowler in particular to be overrated.

 

[Legend123]

Kelfbom only played 30 games. ANd fowler is anything but a popular name.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

IF he is ever on the block I think he ends up in Toronto the 2 teams have a great relationship and have since what 2009?

Not going to speculate on what goes back because there are a TON of factors but I think if he's available he ends up in Toronto

 

[thadd]

Yeah, I would have Vatanen as a 2nd pairing D, 1st pairing PP QB. He would be a huge boost to our team, him and Davidson would be a slick 2nd pairing going forward.

ANA obviously has no interest in giving us exactly the piece we need to really push our division foes.

It's not just Anaheim. No teams are interested in enabling us and they shouldn't be.

I'm happy with the Hall/Larsson trade. It had to be done. We know that the other teams in the league are not going to let us off easy in our search to fix our blueline because when that happens our dynasty starts.

We've got a goalie, we've got a disgustingly awesome group of forward and now we're just a PMD short of being able to embarrass any team in the league.

 

[thadd]

IF he is ever on the block I think he ends up in Toronto the 2 teams have a great relationship and have since what 2009?

Not going to speculate on what goes back because there are a TON of factors but I think if he's available he ends up in Toronto

While I agree he could help the Leafs out a ton I don't think that you could get Ducks and Leafs fans to agree on what would be a reasonable trade involving Fowler.

If the Leafs did acquire Fowler I see them creating another hole in their line-up.
Would JVR likely be in the conversation?

 

[snipes]

It's not just Anaheim. No teams are interested in enabling us and they shouldn't be.

I'm happy with the Hall/Larsson trade. It had to be done. We know that the other teams in the league are not going to let us off easy in our search to fix our blueline because when that happens our dynasty starts.

We've got a goalie, we've got a disgustingly awesome group of forward and now we're just a PMD short of being able to embarrass any team in the league.

A lot of people who didn't watch us probably don't fully understand how putrid our D was. We couldn't even execute basic breakouts, we would just continually get hemmed in. Still need that PP QB, but we're significantly improved on D and actually have an NHL top 4.

Having a Dman like Larsson who can play a defensive role and execute breakouts with a solid first pass is a huge boost to our team. This is the most excited I've been about a season in at least a decade. We're not putting hopes on rookies, it feels realistic to think we can fight for a wildcard spot and compete in our division. I haven't genuinely felt that in forever. Let the chips fall where they may at this point, hopefully the guys come out and compete with pride .

 

[Legend123]

It's not just Anaheim. No teams are interested in enabling us and they shouldn't be.

I'm happy with the Hall/Larsson trade. It had to be done. We know that the other teams in the league are not going to let us off easy in our search to fix our blueline because when that happens our dynasty starts.

We've got a goalie, we've got a disgustingly awesome group of forward and now we're just a PMD short of being able to embarrass any team in the league.

Hard to say both 'dynasty' and 'oilers' after 10 years of being disastrous and just recently finishing bottom 3 in the NHL. They have alot of good young forwards, tho after the hall trade, some are still unproven in the NHL. They have too many identical players or a lack of players filling different roles. And I dont see thier D capable of competing with the west even after a Vatanen trade. None are true top 2 Defense men in cup aspiring teams like the pens, hawks, sharks, TBL, caps and so on. And thier Goalie isnt strong as a #1.

But yeah they have something going, but way too early saying dynasty and oilers^^

i would acquire some real top 2 defensemen, they had a chance at Subban but didnt want to overpay to acquire him yet still massively overpayed for Larsson.

 

[Blitzago*]

Hard to say both 'dynasty' and 'oilers' after 10 years of being disastrous and just recently finishing bottom 3 in the NHL. They have alot of good young forwards, tho after the hall trade, some are still unproven in the NHL. They have too many identical players or a lack of players filling different roles. And I dont see thier D capable of competing with the west even after a Vatanen trade. None are true top 2 Defense men in cup aspiring teams like the pens, hawks, sharks, TBL, caps and so on. And thier Goalie isnt strong as a #1.

But yeah they have something going, but way too early saying dynasty and oilers^^

i would acquire some real top 2 defensemen, they had a chance at Subban but didnt want to overpay to acquire him yet still massively overpayed for Larsson.

Larsson is a number 2, and Talbot is just fine as a #1

 

[Legend123]

Larsson is a number 2, and Talbot is just fine as a #1

He isnt for a Dynasty. Talbot isnt for a dynasty.

 

[Blitzago*]

He isnt for a Dynasty. Talbot isnt for a dynasty.

Fair enough, I missed that point, but now with how the CBA is written and no longer can you have cap circumventing contracts, building a Dynasty will be near impossible.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

While I agree he could help the Leafs out a ton I don't think that you could get Ducks and Leafs fans to agree on what would be a reasonable trade involving Fowler.

If the Leafs did acquire Fowler I see them creating another hole in their line-up.
Would JVR likely be in the conversation?

See thats why I didn't want to speculate because if I had to answer you today I'd say no.

Thing is that's today that's not December, if Mathews, Marner, Nylander perform as we expect them too then perhaps the answer changes.

But even if the answer were to change there is an issues, the ducks are a budget team, JVR makes more money than Fowler

So if a deal were to be made anf Fowler did become a Leaf I don't think JVR is in that deal because he' makes more money and the ducks aren't a cap team

 

[DraberlyakMcHallkins*]

Hard to say both 'dynasty' and 'oilers' after 10 years of being disastrous and just recently finishing bottom 3 in the NHL. They have alot of good young forwards, tho after the hall trade, some are still unproven in the NHL. They have too many identical players or a lack of players filling different roles. And I dont see thier D capable of competing with the west even after a Vatanen trade. None are true top 2 Defense men in cup aspiring teams like the pens, hawks, sharks, TBL, caps and so on. And thier Goalie isnt strong as a #1.

But yeah they have something going, but way too early saying dynasty and oilers^^

i would acquire some real top 2 defensemen, they had a chance at Subban but didnt want to overpay to acquire him yet still massively overpayed for Larsson.

do you trade Hall for Larsson or trade Draisaitl, Puljujarvi, Klefbom/Nurse, and some for Subban? really?

I'd argue they have 2 top 2 defenceman, no definite #1 though. If they fill in 2RD then they are fine. Larsson and Sekera somehow worse players after coming to Edmonton, Klefbom would be a god if he wore a blue maple leaf

 

[Legend123]

do you trade Hall for Larsson or trade Draisaitl, Puljujarvi, Klefbom/Nurse, and some for Subban? really?

I'd argue they have 2 top 2 defenceman, no definite #1 though. If they fill in 2RD then they are fine. Larsson and Sekera somehow worse players after coming to Edmonton, Klefbom would be a god if he wore a blue maple leaf

Im not a leafs fan^^.

Your trade speculation for Subban is 100% false. A 9M$ contract doesnt get traded for 2M$, more or less, combined. I would say it was either Hall, RNH or Eberle. Habs obv pick Hall. So:

Hall for Larsson (no where close to as good as Subban and will never be)

Hall, Pulji, and Yakupov for Subban and a third/second. You then have McDavid and Subban. Thats incredible talent.
I easily pay more in Pulji to get alot more. A klefbom - Subban pairing would have been pretty nice methinks.

Btw i believe the trade was gonna be done had the jackets picked pulji. Oilers GM rejected the subban trade bcuz he preferred pulji over dubios, but then again how much of an upgrade is that?

 

[snipes]

Im not a leafs fan^^.

Your trade speculation for Subban is 100% false. A 9M$ contract doesnt get traded for 2M$, more or less, combined. I would say it was either Hall, RNH or Eberle. Habs obv pick Hall. So:

Hall for Larsson (no where close to as good as Subban and will never be)

Hall, Pulji, and Yakupov for Subban and a third/second. You then have McDavid and Subban. Thats incredible talent.
I easily pay more in Pulji to get alot more. A klefbom - Subban pairing would have been pretty nice methinks.

Btw i believe the trade was gonna be done had the jackets picked pulji. Oilers GM rejected the subban trade bcuz he preferred pulji over dubios, but then again how much of an upgrade is that?

Me too, I think a deal was in place contingent upon Dubois being available at #4. CBJ altered the entire draft.

 

[Legend123]

Me too, I think a deal was in place contingent upon Dubois being available at #4. CBJ altered the entire draft.

yup i dont understand what they see so special in dubois. Maybe they really didnt like pulji? The lottery also messed up the draft, the trade and the excitement level the draft would have received.

 

[snipes]

yup i dont understand what they see so special in dubois. Maybe they really didnt like pulji? The lottery also messed up the draft, the trade and the excitement level the draft would have received.

Big, strong potential Centre with probably the best two-way game in the draft. Plus he has a nasty physical edge, I loved Dubois pre-draft and was very high on his two-way abilities.

Dubois is also a Francophone Canadian and that matters to the Quebecois people, you can't underestimate that or neglect that consideration.

Edit: You may have been talking about CBJ and not MTL re-reading the post.

 

[Legend123]

Big, strong potential Centre with probably the best two-way game in the draft. Plus he has a nasty physical edge, I loved Dubois pre-draft and was very high on his two-way abilities.

Dubois is also a Francophone Canadian and that matters to the Quebecois people, you can't underestimate that or neglect that consideration.

Edit: You may have been talking about CBJ and not MTL re-reading the post.

yeah CBJ. Why did they just go off the board and pick dubios when they could have picked pulji, a fin as is the jackets GM.

Mtl didnt really care, their offer stayed the same. Pulji or dubois along hall and likely yakupov. They werent interested in Klefbom as they didnt see him as a top 2 D. Thats why they were linked to Fowler. But those ducks asked for the #9, which Bergevin thought Murray was insane.
But yeah the habs and oilers def had serious talks regarding Hall and Subban before, during and after the draft. Hall was traded 15 minutes, or so, before Subban was. They couldnt reach to an agreement and both decided for plan B.

 

[snipes]

yeah CBJ. Why did they just go off the board and pick dubios when they could have picked pulji, a fin as is the jackets GM.

Mtl didnt really care, their offer stayed the same. Pulji or dubois along hall and likely yakupov. They werent interested in Klefbom as they didnt see him as a top 2 D. Thats why they were linked to Fowler. But those ducks asked for the #9, which Bergevin thought Murray was insane.
But yeah the habs and oilers def had serious talks regarding Hall and Subban before, during and after the draft. Hall was traded 15 minutes, or so, before Subban was. They couldnt reach to an agreement and both decided for plan B.

I really believe Chia had a few trades lined up if the top 3 went as expected.

With Pulju being a right shot (easier for left handed Centres to pass to their right, forehand to forehand pass) in combination with his size, elite skating, 200 foot game/hockey IQ made it a no brainer to run to the stage.

They might not play together this year on the same line except on the PP, but I can see McDavid-Pulju being one of the best, if not the best, C-RW combination in the NHL one day.

 

[Legend123]

im not sold on pulji after the fin GM let him slide to #4. I was always sold on Laine, much more than matthews.
But yeah if pulji reaches his potential, hes very scary looking esp paired up with McDavid.

 

[HanSolo]

Advanced stats aren't everything but that's terrible for a supposed top 2 defenseman...

These charts also show that Shea Weber is pretty terrible fwiw

 

[PG Canuck]

yeah CBJ. Why did they just go off the board and pick dubios when they could have picked pulji, a fin as is the jackets GM.

Mtl didnt really care, their offer stayed the same. Pulji or dubois along hall and likely yakupov. They werent interested in Klefbom as they didnt see him as a top 2 D. Thats why they were linked to Fowler. But those ducks asked for the #9, which Bergevin thought Murray was insane.
But yeah the habs and oilers def had serious talks regarding Hall and Subban before, during and after the draft. Hall was traded 15 minutes, or so, before Subban was. They couldnt reach to an agreement and both decided for plan B.

Dubois wasn't an off the board pick at all. Nationalities don't matter for anything.

 

[snipes]

Dubois wasn't an off the board pick at all. Nationalities don't matter for anything.

Especially considering need. CBJ needed a centre and drafted Dubois to be a centre judging by post draft comments from the organization and Dubois himself.

 

[PG Canuck]

im not sold on pulji after the fin GM let him slide to #4. I was always sold on Laine, much more than matthews.
But yeah if pulji reaches his potential, hes very scary looking esp paired up with McDavid.

Your opinion keeps flip-flopping now - is Puljujarvi better than Dubois or not? CBJ went off the board, you said, and now that they passed on Puljujarvi you're not sold on him? So which is it?

 

[PG Canuck]

Especially considering need. CBJ needed a centre and drafted Dubois to be a centre judging by post draft comments from the organization and Dubois himself.

Well they just traded Johansen so it really wasn't much of a head scratcher.