Proposal: EDM - CAL

[Halla]

so the flames end up having russell get top 4 mins instead of hamonic?

lol

 

[Halla]

We're willing to move Stone because Andersson has top 4 potential and appears to be NHL ready, swapping Stone for Russell doesn't make a ton of sense as it would just push Kulak out of the lineup into the #7 slot and would be a roadblock to Valimaki for 3 more years.

The main people that hated on Russell are the advanced stats crowd (they're mostly the same group that hates on Stone). When we acquired Russell, I hated it, but he played well in a 4/5 role as you stated and was truly a heart and soul player. I for one would welcome Russell back, but not at that term or AAV, even when he was a UFA, I didn't want to give him more than 2 years @ 3 million.

As for the cost to acquire Stone, I think his value is underrated because of the role he played for the Flames and the cost we paid for him. But, I feel the trade to Calgary, was Chayka doing Stone a solid as he and his wife had just had twins and with her family being from Calgary it gave them extra help. I think had Chayka listened to offers and taken the best one, he'd have gotten more than a 3rd and a conditional 5th. I think he easily would have landed a 2nd and a mid-level prospect (like Calgary got for Russell). Most don't agree with me, but I still think Stone can return a 2nd at the very least.

I think they would take a 3rd and D prospect if offered it right now. hard to shoot for at least a 2nd when you didnt pay that much to get him, and he hasnt been as good as he was in zona

 

[Lunatik]

I think they would take a 3rd and D prospect if offered it right now. hard to shoot for at least a 2nd when you didnt pay that much to get him, and he hasnt been as good as he was in zona

He probably played close to the best hockey of his career after we acquired him. He was fantastic with Brodie down the stretch and into the playoffs. Last year he never got the opportunity to fill that role again because of acquiring Hamonic, but whenever there was an injury, he stepped up and played well without being saddled with babysitting Kulak

 

[treple13]

I think from a Flames standpoint it doesn't really do what we want it to do. I think we'd prefer to move Stone for a non-dman asset rather than to take back a contract, especially one like Russell's.

 

[Halla]

He probably played close to the best hockey of his career after we acquired him. He was fantastic with Brodie down the stretch and into the playoffs. Last year he never got the opportunity to fill that role again because of acquiring Hamonic, but whenever there was an injury, he stepped up and played well without being saddled with babysitting Kulak

well thats fine, but he was still a 15min a night dman making 3.5 mil.
flames paid a 3rd and 5th for him when had had 36pts in 75 games the previous year.

only 10pts this year, and while that is not his role ovciously it doesnt look great when your advanced stats are by far the worst of the d group

 

[Lunatik]

well thats fine, but he was still a 15min a night dman making 3.5 mil.
flames paid a 3rd and 5th for him when had had 36pts in 75 games the previous year.

only 10pts this year, and while that is not his role ovciously it doesnt look great when your advanced stats are by far the worst of the d group

I guess it's a good thing NHL teams have scouts then and don't reply on advanced stats like the Corsi bible thumpers of HF eh

 

[Halla]

I guess it's a good thing NHL teams have scouts then and don't reply on advanced stats like the Corsi bible thumpers of HF eh

you think these same scouts are gonna think stone is worth more than a 2nd rd pick?
no one is paying a 2nd + for a 15 min/night guy making 3.5

 

[Skobel24]

you think these same scouts are gonna think stone is worth more than a 2nd rd pick?
no one is paying a 2nd + for a 15 min/night guy making 3.5

I doubt anyone would pay more than a 2nd. If a team offered a 3rd, I'd take it. Who knows though, RHD that has produced when given top 4 minutes, they may get a few teams bidding.

Not getting my hopes up though.

 

[Vancouver Canucks]

Isn't Stone better than Russell?

 

[Volica]

you think these same scouts are gonna think stone is worth more than a 2nd rd pick?
no one is paying a 2nd + for a 15 min/night guy making 3.5

Stone still has value in the league.
A guy who can play in the top 4, big, RHS, PK'er, bomb from the point. If the Flames looked to move him, they'd be able to. Knowing that Tre has loyalty to the guy though; might be the problem.

He probably played close to the best hockey of his career after we acquired him. He was fantastic with Brodie down the stretch and into the playoffs. Last year he never got the opportunity to fill that role again because of acquiring Hamonic, but whenever there was an injury, he stepped up and played well without being saddled with babysitting Kulak

Babysitting Kulak, heh.
Outside of that top pair, Kulak might have been the most consistent Dman the Flames had all year, no ups or downs like Brodie/Hammer/Stone. Guy's a perfect 6D, doesn't make mistakes to hurt you, plays a possession positive game (I.E he shoots the puck on net more than he gets shot on, which is what you ask of your 6D) and plays a positive chance game (on ice for more scoring chances for than against). If you said Bartkowski, I would understand, because that guy's a train wreck.

I know you have some anti-Kulak biases, but the guy was a great little 6D for us. This was the best bottom pair we've had in what seems like forever.

Stone does what he does independent of the pairing. He's a good PK'er, good at pinning. Decision making is still slow, foot speed is average; but he's a solid top 5D in the NHL.

 

[Flames Fanatic]

Hmm, I'm surprised Flames fans are universally oppossed. Russell has the extra year, but the cap hit's simular, and I'd argue he's preformed better than Stone over the last few years. (Not that it makes a ton difference overall, as they both okay #4's/ good #5's at the end of the day.)

Though I do remember him not being perticularly loved near the end of his time in Calgary ahaha. Still I would have thought the chance to get Brodie back to right side would have had fans jumping.


Honestly though what would be the going rate on Stone for just picks? Calgary doesn't utilize him much offensively behind Gio, Brodie, and Hamilton, but as said he'd be a decent fit in Edmonton.

I like Russell a lot, but not on that contract given we don't have a spot for him in the top four currently, and have Kulak and Anderssen already for the bottom pair, with Valimaki, Fox, Kylington in the wings all likely with some form of NHL potential.

 

[ManofSteel55]

Russel is and always has been a better d-man.

No thanks.

This. Anyone suggesting that Russell is "terrible" didn't watch him much last year, he was really good. Far better than Stone, that's for sure. The 500K in savings isn't enough for Edmonton to downgrade from Russell to Stone.

 

[THall4]

Stone has an absolute bomb from the point, Flames certainly have never used it. I don’t think anyone’s used him as a triggerman

So does Matt Benning...His clapper doesn't make him any better

I'm in the minority ...id rather have Russell...little dude is a warrior that is loved by his teammates.

 

[Lunatik]

The argument about Russell vs Stone is ridiculous. They are pretty much equally agood with having different strengths/weaknesses to their games.