Speculation: Don't sign UFA Islanders?

[DarkHorse2]

Who was the last Islander to sign a significant UFA contract and live up to it?

Thinking back, you've got
Kyle Okposo - 7yrs/$42 mil - team out of playoffs, 56 pts in 86 games
Frans Nielsen - 6yrs/$32 mil - team out of playoffs, 50 pts in 102 games
Matt Martin - 4yrs/$10 mil - made playoffs, 16 pts in 104 games
PA Parenteau - 4yrs/$16 mil - playoffs 1 of 2 years, 76 pts in 103 games - traded
Matt Moulson - 5yrs/$25 mil - missed playoffs four of four years - 94 pts in 251 games
Andrew MacDonald - 6yrs/$30 mil - missed playoffs two of three years - 39 pts in 167 games
Jason Blake - 5yrs/$20 mil - missed playoffs three of three years - 141 pts in 216 games - traded

Did I miss any good contracts?

Click to read more...

 

[Kamiccolo]

Is this an attempt to dissuade a Tavares contract?

 

[DarkHorse2]

Is this an attempt to dissuade a Tavares contract?

Wasn't the intent (Parenteau was mentioned on TV and I started thinking about it) but I did think of that as I pulled the info together .

 

[72hockey guy]

What it does show is tha Garth is smarter than he's given credit for

 

[WTFMAN99]

Who was the last Islander to sign a significant UFA contract and live up to it?

Thinking back, you've got
Kyle Okposo - 7yrs/$42 mil - team out of playoffs, 56 pts in 86 games
Frans Nielsen - 6yrs/$32 mil - team out of playoffs, 50 pts in 102 games
Matt Martin - 4yrs/$10 mil - made playoffs, 16 pts in 104 games
PA Parenteau - 4yrs/$16 mil - playoffs 1 of 2 years, 76 pts in 103 games - traded
Matt Moulson - 5yrs/$25 mil - missed playoffs four of four years - 94 pts in 251 games
Andrew MacDonald - 6yrs/$30 mil - missed playoffs two of three years - 39 pts in 167 games
Jason Blake - 5yrs/$20 mil - missed playoffs three of three years - 141 pts in 216 games - traded

Did I miss any good contracts?

I suppose Nielsen isn't a terrible signing?

 

[Beautvillier]

I suppose Nielsen isn't a terrible signing?

the term is terrible

 

[Hockeyholic]

What it does show is tha Garth is smarter than he's given credit for

Personally, I think the guy gets way too much hate. He's not a top five gm, but he sure isn't awful.

 

[WTFMAN99]

the term is terrible

Damn near every UFA gets bad term if they are mid to higher tier in their UFA Class, a couple of exceptions (like Shattenkirk aside) it uscks if you're trying to fill a big hole in UFA. I even touched on it in a blog post, a lot of warning about term.

 

[Martin Skoula]

What it does show is tha Garth is smarter than he's given credit for

Or he doesn't have the cash to spend to make long-term mistakes in the first place.

He's a two sided coin. Yeah, you can praise him for stealing Barzal for Reinhart. Then again, you can rip into him for taking Reinhart 4th overall in the first place. Especially when the next 5 picks were all defensemen and all significantly better than him.

 

[SLAPSHOT723]

Or he doesn't have the cash to spend to make long-term mistakes in the first place.

He's a two sided coin. Yeah, you can praise him for stealing Barzal for Reinhart. Then again, you can rip into him for taking Reinhart 4th overall in the first place. Especially when the next 5 picks were all defensemen and all significantly better than him.

Exactly this.

 

[Brobust]

What it does show is tha Garth is smarter than he's given credit for

But then he went and signed Cizikas and Clutterbuck to much dumber deals.

 

[SETHROLLINS]

Who was the last Islander to sign a significant UFA contract and live up to it?

Thinking back, you've got
Kyle Okposo - 7yrs/$42 mil - team out of playoffs, 56 pts in 86 games
Frans Nielsen - 6yrs/$32 mil - team out of playoffs, 50 pts in 102 games
Matt Martin - 4yrs/$10 mil - made playoffs, 16 pts in 104 games
PA Parenteau - 4yrs/$16 mil - playoffs 1 of 2 years, 76 pts in 103 games - traded
Matt Moulson - 5yrs/$25 mil - missed playoffs four of four years - 94 pts in 251 games
Andrew MacDonald - 6yrs/$30 mil - missed playoffs two of three years - 39 pts in 167 games
Jason Blake - 5yrs/$20 mil - missed playoffs three of three years - 141 pts in 216 games - traded

Did I miss any good contracts?

Was PA hurt during that contract? 76 points in 103 games for a $4M cap hit player is a bargain.

 

[Reality Czech]

Damn near every UFA gets bad term if they are mid to higher tier in their UFA Class, a couple of exceptions (like Shattenkirk aside) it uscks if you're trying to fill a big hole in UFA. I even touched on it in a blog post, a lot of warning about term.

I think you got it. There are some cases where a player doesn't go for max term for various reasons, usually because they have one preferred destination (Shattenkirk in NY, for example). But for a lot of these guys like Backes, Ladd, Eriksson, Okposo, etc. there are probably several teams all offering roughly the same contract. So then it just comes down to which team bites the bullet and offers that extra year. Seems that's what it usually takes to sign a guy in that middle-upper tier of free agents.

Although teams will likely be more careful in the future as they see that most teams end up regretting these deals in the long-term.

 

[Beautvillier]

But then he went and signed Cizikas and Clutterbuck to much dumber deals.

cizikas deal is fine. clutterbuck contract is bad.

 

[WTFMAN99]

I think you got it. There are some cases where a player doesn't go for max term for various reasons, usually because they have one preferred destination (Shattenkirk in NY, for example). But for a lot of these guys like Backes, Ladd, Eriksson, Okposo, etc. there are probably several teams all offering roughly the same contract. So then it just comes down to which team bites the bullet and offers that extra year. Seems that's what it usually takes to sign a guy in that middle-upper tier of free agents.

Although teams will likely be more careful in the future as they see that most teams end up regretting these deals in the long-term.

Hell, you regret it in the short term too. I remember Nonis said he was only worried about year one with David Clarkson but he sucked years 1 and 2.

Eriksson, Lucic etc etc are regrettable as soon as the ink is dried.

 

[AKA Chief]

Who was the last Islander to sign a significant UFA contract and live up to it?

Thinking back, you've got
Kyle Okposo - 7yrs/$42 mil - team out of playoffs, 56 pts in 86 games
Frans Nielsen - 6yrs/$32 mil - team out of playoffs, 50 pts in 102 games
Matt Martin - 4yrs/$10 mil - made playoffs, 16 pts in 104 games
PA Parenteau - 4yrs/$16 mil - playoffs 1 of 2 years, 76 pts in 103 games - traded
Matt Moulson - 5yrs/$25 mil - missed playoffs four of four years - 94 pts in 251 games
Andrew MacDonald - 6yrs/$30 mil - missed playoffs two of three years - 39 pts in 167 games
Jason Blake - 5yrs/$20 mil - missed playoffs three of three years - 141 pts in 216 games - traded

Did I miss any good contracts?

Since "overpaying" is par for the course when signing UFA's, I would think most teams who let UFA's walk would have similar results.

 

[MatthewBarnabysTears]

cizikas deal is fine. clutterbuck contract is bad.

The obsession HF has with carping about "bad" contracts is one of the more irritating tics here. Cizikas and Clutterbuck are good players—not all stars, but they're both quality PKers, Cizikas is the best face-off man on the team. If either was replaced with a literal replacement level player, the drop off would be noticeable. And each makes well under $4mm. Neither contract will be what prevents the Isles from making a necessary move over the life of the deals.

Are these contracts good value? No. But every team will be a mix of players on severely under-value rookie deals, over-valued veterans, and, hopefully, a large middle tier of "just right" deals. Sure, too many over-value deals and a team would be in serious trouble. But the way HF talks about these guys, you'd think these deals were cancerous, and not fairly typical of what it costs to buy UFA years from above-replacement-level veterans.

 

[Kaen]

Hell, you regret it in the short term too. I remember Nonis said he was only worried about year one with David Clarkson but he sucked years 1 and 2.

Eriksson, Lucic etc etc are regrettable as soon as the ink is dried.

I highly doubt the Oilers regret Lucic even now, never mind when they first signed him. If you actually take a look, last year he scored 50 pts, which is average to just a few below for him and is on track for similar this year. It will likely become a bad contract before it's finished (barring LTIR), but comparing it to Clarkson who put up 11 and 15 pts through his first two years before being waived or Eriksson who has put up about half the numbers Lucic has is a huge over exaggeration .

 

[DarkHorse2]

Was PA hurt during that contract? 76 points in 103 games for a $4M cap hit player is a bargain.

He had a great short season after the lockout, but fell off the following year and had a few bouts with injuries before being traded with a pick for a soon-to-be retired Danny Briere.

 

[DarkHorse2]

But every team will be a mix of players on severely under-value rookie deals, over-valued veterans, and, hopefully, a large middle tier of "just right" deals.

Well...except for Detroit.

 

[MatthewBarnabysTears]

Well...except for Detroit.

Fair. Any good team.Look at how free the coyotes are from longterm gross overpayments!

 

[belair]

What it does show is tha Garth is smarter than he's given credit for

He's one of those GMs who seemingly 'wins' trades and makes 'shrewd' roster moves but his team ultimately shits the bed every year.

 

[72hockey guy]

He's one of those GMs who seemingly 'wins' trades and makes 'shrewd' roster moves but his team ultimately ****s the bed every year.

like the leafs you mean for the last 50 years?

I look at Snow fully understanding the dynamic of working under Wang,with all the limitations that presented

I expect more under Ledecky and Malkin but its only been 2 years of that. We only just got a modern practice facility, We've yet to get an arena, most NHL TEAMS HAVE AT LEAST THAT TO BEGIN WITH

its a matter of understanding that expectations must match available resources unlike Toronto Snow didnt have unlimited resources or a state of the art building

Toronto did, and they went 50 years doing squat all. you want to talk shitting the bed.....look at the leafs or even the Oilers.....its one thing when you have no concessions revenue and no real scouting staff Like Snow had to deal with for nearly his entire term here, its another having unlimited resources like Edmonton and Toronto have had and doing nothing.

Neil Smith a proven professional Stanley Cup winning GM, who was Snow's predecessor, got one look at how Wang ran things and got out of dodge..... after less than 6 weeks. no GM does that unless the infrastructure and ownership is termite and disease infected, which sadly was what Snow inherited

 

[WTFMAN99]

I highly doubt the Oilers regret Lucic even now, never mind when they first signed him. If you actually take a look, last year he scored 50 pts, which is average to just a few below for him and is on track for similar this year. It will likely become a bad contract before it's finished (barring LTIR), but comparing it to Clarkson who put up 11 and 15 pts through his first two years before being waived or Eriksson who has put up about half the numbers Lucic has is a huge over exaggeration .

Fair enough for comparisons purposes. Not Clarkson level. I don't think teams will be in a rush to take a Lucic deal on though. Definitely see people coming to the Oilers asking for RNH and not Lucic and Edmonton will likely need to make the best deal they can with RNH because they are tight on cap with new extensions.

Russel, Lucic and even the Pouliot buyout has made things tighter then they should be. Not to mention that Chia is looking for goal scoring wingers and to upgrade defense but has shipped out Hall and Eberle for these purposes but didn't properly fix the issues at hand.

 

[jrgtml67]

From what we heard on HNIC, it looks like Tavares will be the latest casualty. I would assume if the arena deal and so forth all of a sudden happened in a month, like Elliot said a contract would be ironed out quickly. But the problem is that deal is no where close to fruition, and I doubt it will be come about by July. So for that reason I think Tavares is gone, and to be honest, the Isles have a huge decision, if they dont see that arena issue resolved before he goes UFA I think you have to trade him at the deadline for a high price to get something, or he walks.