Don Hay Leaving Giants to coach Blazers

[Hordichuk_24]

An official announcement will be made tomorrow. This isn't surprising at all to me. There has been a real power struggle behind the scenes for several years now. This was inevitable.

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[Rocko604]

Kind of hard to think of the Giants without Hay behind the bench. Hopefully management brings in a competent replacement.

Hey Torts, want a job that will keep you in Point Roberts?

Bellerive coming back kind of makes sense now.

Hords, can you shed more light on the power struggle? I've been out of the loop for a while, only following on social media. This is first I've heard about it.

 

[Hordichuk_24]

Bellerive coming back kind of makes sense now.

A lot more sense. The second I saw that trade I was completely baffled. Even Bellerive's parents told the Giants not to draft his younger brother (if they were in the position to do so) because they wouldn't allow him to play for Hay. Then I heard Bellerive was excited to return to Vancouver and figured that was a load of B.S. Now given the circumstances it makes sense.

Hords, can you shed more light on the power struggle? I've been out of the loop for a while, only following on social media. This is first I've heard about it.

I can't say a whole lot as most of this isn't public knowledge. All I'll say is there has been a conflict of interest the past few seasons on style of play and a certain brand of hockey. Hay is rather stubborn and opposed to change or doing things differently and it made progress much more difficult. That and the fact a lot of parents and players refuse to play for Hay. I think that alone speaks volumes.

Anyway I've always been a Don Hay fan and I appreciate everything he has done for the organization. But change was necessary for both parties, IMO.

 

[Rocko604]

A lot more sense. The second I saw that trade I was completely baffled. Even Bellerive's parents told the Giants not to draft his younger brother (if they were in the position to do so) because they wouldn't allow him to play for Hay. Then I heard Bellerive was excited to return to Vancouver and figured that was a load of B.S. Now given the circumstances it makes sense.



I can't say a whole lot as most of this isn't public knowledge. All I'll say is there has been a conflict of interest the past few seasons on style of play and a certain brand of hockey. Hay is rather stubborn and opposed to change or doing things differently and it made progress much more difficult. That and the fact a lot of parents and players refuse to play for Hay. I think that alone speaks volumes.

Anyway I've always been a Don Hay fan and I appreciate everything he has done for the organization. But change was necessary for both parties, IMO.

The bold blows me away. I didn't know that. Wow.

I've read Steve Ewen's twitter feed and he seems happy with the decision, pending an A1 replacement. Best for everyone, all around. Vancouver will be getting compensation from Kamloops as well. Personally, I can't say I'm upset by it, we have not been rebuilding as fast as I, and I'm sure management, expected.

My vote is for Kevin Dineen. Might be a touch catch, but I have full faith in Ron Toigo and Michael Buble's bank accounts.

 

[Hordichuk_24]

The bold blows me away. I didn't know that. Wow.

You would be amazed by exactly how many players/parents feel this way. I had no idea either until I was informed by someone within the organization. Bellerive is a perfect example of this. It doesn't end there. Several trades the Giants made over the past two or three seasons were because of this. Blake Orban is another. A few more off the top of my head Ast, Kudrna, Tvrdon and Fisenko. There are plenty more.

Hay is a my way or the highway type of coach. There isn't much grey area or leniency in the way he coaches. You either adapt or you don't play. That doesn't rub off very well particularly on the present day hockey player. Sometimes I think that attitude sucks the skill out of certain players. Which is why certain players left the Giants via trade and had success elsewhere.

As far as a new coach the list of candidates will be plentiful. I have a feeling Toigo will hire a big name guy. What that means exactly I don't know. Big name as in NHL experience? Or big name as far as WHL coaching standards? If the latter maybe a guy like recently fired Hitmen coach Mike Williamson? Something tells me it'll be a bigger name guy with pro coaching experience. We will have to wait and see.

 

[Rocko604]

Makes sense. The adapt or you don't play philosophy wasn't a secret but I didn't know he took it to the point guys didn't want to play for him.

Ewen is suggesting they'll get a "rock star" replacement. Unless it's Mike Johnston (which it won't be), I fully expect an ex-NHL head coach to come in.

 

[Hordichuk_24]

Makes sense. The adapt or you don't play philosophy wasn't a secret but I didn't know he took it to the point guys didn't want to play for him.

When you think about it...especially in the context of modern day hockey players it shouldn't be surprising. The game has changed (not for the better, IMO but that is a different topic entirely) and I don't think Hay has been able to adapt to that very well. He is stuck in his ways because they have worked for him over the course of his career. That is understandable but at the same time also a problem, IMO.

Ewen is suggesting they'll get a "rock star" replacement. Unless it's Mike Johnston (which it won't be), I fully expect an ex-NHL head coach to come in.

I definitely don't see Johnston coming here. If he goes anywhere it'll be to the pros, IMO. I also think it'll be a former NHL coach. Toigo has the money to pay someone good money. Even enough to convince them coach down a level or two.

 

[Hordichuk_24]

Steve Ewen just wrote an article shedding a little more light on what I was saying earlier. He also includes a few more players that had issues with Hay. He even mentions someone like Marc Crawford as a potential replacement. That was a name that didn't cross my mind.

 

[Rocko604]

Steve Ewen just wrote an article shedding a little more light on what I was saying earlier. He also includes a few more players that had issues with Hay. He even mentions someone like Marc Crawford as a potential replacement. That was a name that didn't cross my mind.

I read the article last night, but the link no longer works. Hmm...

 

[Andy Dufresne]

Here's a link to the article:
http://www2.canada.com/theprovince/...l?id=0deb9bf2-9d4d-450a-9ba6-a062d12dd865&p=1

There's no compensation going back to the Giants in this deal.

 

[I am the Liquor]

You would be amazed by exactly how many players/parents feel this way. I had no idea either until I was informed by someone within the organization. Bellerive is a perfect example of this. It doesn't end there. Several trades the Giants made over the past two or three seasons were because of this. Blake Orban is another. A few more off the top of my head Ast, Kudrna, Tvrdon and Fisenko. There are plenty more.

Hay is a my way or the highway type of coach. There isn't much grey area or leniency in the way he coaches. You either adapt or you don't play. That doesn't rub off very well particularly on the present day hockey player. Sometimes I think that attitude sucks the skill out of certain players. Which is why certain players left the Giants via trade and had success elsewhere.

As far as a new coach the list of candidates will be plentiful. I have a feeling Toigo will hire a big name guy. What that means exactly I don't know. Big name as in NHL experience? Or big name as far as WHL coaching standards? If the latter maybe a guy like recently fired Hitmen coach Mike Williamson? Something tells me it'll be a bigger name guy with pro coaching experience. We will have to wait and see.

Marc Crawford?

 

[Rocko604]

Marc Crawford?

Probably one of the names that's on their list. Coming back home to coach and be with his family would be an attraction, but can ownership offer a deal comparable to what he's making tax-free in Switzerland? That remains to be seen.

 

[Hordichuk_24]

Marc Crawford?

Steve Ewen mentioned him in that article he wrote. That was a name that didn't cross my mind previously. I suppose it's possible although I have a hard time picturing that right now. Regardless I do think their next coach will be a recognizable name like that.

Coming back home to coach and be with his family would be an attraction, but can ownership offer a deal comparable to what he's making tax-free in Switzerland? That remains to be seen.

I have no doubt Toigo can and will provide the latter (assuming it's a big name candidate). Hay was already getting paid like an NHL coach as it was.

 

[trellaine201]

You would be amazed by exactly how many players/parents feel this way. I had no idea either until I was informed by someone within the organization. Bellerive is a perfect example of this. It doesn't end there. Several trades the Giants made over the past two or three seasons were because of this. Blake Orban is another. A few more off the top of my head Ast, Kudrna, Tvrdon and Fisenko. There are plenty more.

Hay is a my way or the highway type of coach. There isn't much grey area or leniency in the way he coaches. You either adapt or you don't play. That doesn't rub off very well particularly on the present day hockey player. Sometimes I think that attitude sucks the skill out of certain players. Which is why certain players left the Giants via trade and had success elsewhere.

As far as a new coach the list of candidates will be plentiful. I have a feeling Toigo will hire a big name guy. What that means exactly I don't know. Big name as in NHL experience? Or big name as far as WHL coaching standards? If the latter maybe a guy like recently fired Hitmen coach Mike Williamson? Something tells me it'll be a bigger name guy with pro coaching experience. We will have to wait and see.

Gosh maybe Osipov will actually be given a chance to play regularly next year!! Hay didn't like him much. Since he was a number 1 importer it would be nice to see if he can play.

 

[Hordichuk_24]

Osipov played a little more the second half of the season but to be honest I'm surprised he returned to the Giants after the Christmas break. There were rumblings he was considering staying in Russia. Hay also drove out the Giants other European forward Andreas Eder. He barely gave him a chance. Last I knew they still own his rights but I doubt he'll want to return given how he was treated. Then again maybe the fact Hay is gone will be enough to entice him to come back? Who knows. If the Giants select a player in the euro draft that will clear up that situation one way or another.

 

[Hardyvan123]

Osipov played a little more the second half of the season but to be honest I'm surprised he returned to the Giants after the Christmas break. There were rumblings he was considering staying in Russia. Hay also drove out the Giants other European forward Andreas Eder. He barely gave him a chance. Last I knew they still own his rights but I doubt he'll want to return given how he was treated. Then again maybe the fact Hay is gone will be enough to entice him to come back? Who knows. If the Giants select a player in the euro draft that will clear up that situation one way or another.

I liked Hay as the coach as his lunch bucket work hard at all costs mentality can be enduring to many fans but his lack of success with talent from Europe does indicate a lack of flexibility and maybe a change will be a good thing.

 

[Beatle17]

You would be amazed by exactly how many players/parents feel this way. I had no idea either until I was informed by someone within the organization. Bellerive is a perfect example of this. It doesn't end there. Several trades the Giants made over the past two or three seasons were because of this. Blake Orban is another. A few more off the top of my head Ast, Kudrna, Tvrdon and Fisenko. There are plenty more.

Hay is a my way or the highway type of coach. There isn't much grey area or leniency in the way he coaches. You either adapt or you don't play. That doesn't rub off very well particularly on the present day hockey player. Sometimes I think that attitude sucks the skill out of certain players. Which is why certain players left the Giants via trade and had success elsewhere.

As far as a new coach the list of candidates will be plentiful. I have a feeling Toigo will hire a big name guy. What that means exactly I don't know. Big name as in NHL experience? Or big name as far as WHL coaching standards? If the latter maybe a guy like recently fired Hitmen coach Mike Williamson? Something tells me it'll be a bigger name guy with pro coaching experience. We will have to wait and see.

So the first guy is an undersized Junior player who MAY score 40 points and people are excited to lose one of the best Junior coaches in the league. And are any of the other players really that important. Hay seems to have done a hell of a job with the franchise and produced many NHL players. I didn't see many of them leaving and complaining about the coach.

This whole woe is me attitude by the players never ceases to amaze me. Maybe they should all vote before the season, along with their parents, who the coach will be and if they don't like the result they can just stay at home waiting on the competition ribbons and trophies.

 

[I am the Liquor]

So the first guy is an undersized Junior player who MAY score 40 points and people are excited to lose one of the best Junior coaches in the league. And are any of the other players really that important. Hay seems to have done a hell of a job with the franchise and produced many NHL players. I didn't see many of them leaving and complaining about the coach.

This whole woe is me attitude by the players never ceases to amaze me. Maybe they should all vote before the season, along with their parents, who the coach will be and if they don't like the result they can just stay at home waiting on the competition ribbons and trophies.

Or maybe the coach can expand his repertoire to include other forms of motivating his players. Sounds like he's an ******* truth be told.

 

[Hordichuk_24]

So the first guy is an undersized Junior player who MAY score 40 points and people are excited to lose one of the best Junior coaches in the league.

Hay has been one of the best coaches in junior hockey over the course of his career. But most of his success has come in the past. Every coach has a shelf life. The situation in Vancouver turned sour due to a number of different reasons. It was time for both parties to go their separate ways.

I didn't see many of them leaving and complaining about the coach.

Some did, some didn't. Hay is good at teaching a certain type of player. He struggles with pure skill players. Mainly because they typically don't play as hard without the puck. Keep in mind just because you didn't hear players complaining doesn't mean it didn't happen.

This whole woe is me attitude by the players never ceases to amaze me. Maybe they should all vote before the season, along with their parents, who the coach will be and if they don't like the result they can just stay at home waiting on the competition ribbons and trophies.

I understand where you are coming from. I tend to agree to an extent. I just think the game (or society as a whole) is changing and an old school coach like Hay isn't very good with change. It's either his way or the highway. Many players bought in and had success. Some didn't and wanted out. At the end of the day it isn't a good situation if the GM and coach are butting heads. Something had to give.

 

[Slapstick204]

Old School

Don Hay reminds me of Brent Sutter. Both are respected coaches , both coached players to the NHL, both had success in the ....past. Will it be possible for them to look at the top teams in the WHL, look how they move the puck , less dumping and chasing and more skill and speed? Just wondering.

 

[Hordichuk_24]

Don Hay reminds me of Brent Sutter. Both are respected coaches , both coached players to the NHL, both had success in the ....past. Will it be possible for them to look at the top teams in the WHL, look how they move the puck , less dumping and chasing and more skill and speed? Just wondering.

It's a fair question. With Hay personally I think his best days are behind him. The game has changed and unless Don can adapt I don't see him having the same success. That isn't to suggest he won't be a good coach I just don't think you will be seeing him winning championships and Memorial Cups anytime soon. Of course if he's provided with the right mix of players that can fit into his style or mold anything is possible. It was evident that wasn't going to happen in Vancouver.