Speculation: Don Cherry spot on again: Orr or McLaren should have been there right from the start

[senor martinez]

Don Cherry now on HIC. He said it right again. We should have had a guy like Orr or McLaren in from the get go. Get that respect, keep it. Even if we lose and we would have with this horrible team, we would have lost with honor, dignity and getting that respect. It would be tough to play against us when there was all these warriors out there like Orr.

So next season. Get some. Not Orr, but somebody else. Dubinsky, Clutterbuck, Parros, Domi, Tucker, Roberts, Matt Martin, Prust, Downie, Ott... some of these fools who play with all they have. Rinaldo.. etc. Some fools who hit hard and fight tough. Don Cherry knows hockey and its spirit like all real coaches do. We need many other players too, but play with men of honor.

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[Wendelstache]

David Clarkson says hello!

 

[mashedpotato]

Don Cherry now on HIC. He said it right again. We should have had a guy like Orr or McLaren in from the get go. Get that respect, keep it. Even if we lose and we would have with this horrible team, we would have lost with honor, dignity and getting that respect. It would be tough to play against us when there was all these warriors out there like Orr.

So next season. Get some. Not Orr, but somebody else. Dubinsky, Clutterbuck, Parros, Domi, Tucker, Roberts, Matt Martin, Prust, Downie, Ott... some of these fools who play with all they have. Rinaldo.. etc. Some fools who hit hard and fight tough. Don Cherry knows hockey and its spirit like all real coaches do. We need many other players too, but play with men of honor.

You honestly believe players respect toughness over winning? Because I'd rather fill the roster with players that can compete to win. Not compete to fight.

Think more of the Detroit and less whatever era you're stuck in.

 

[DopeyFish]

I agree! We would have been 1st or 2nd overall pick going into the draft.

But alas, hindsight is 20/20.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

Don Cherry now on HIC. He said it right again. We should have had a guy like Orr or McLaren in from the get go. Get that respect, keep it.

The NHL is changing. Guys like Orr will be all but gone in a few more years.
Concussions, etc ... have all but eliminated Orr type players.

http://mapleleafs.nhl.com/club/player.htm?id=8468778

Cherry is off base here.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Leafs were the softest team in the NHL, a team that went down without a lot of fight. In the end it does not equate to wins and losses, but optically it does make a difference. Coming into Toronto was a walkover. The opposing teams never had to wash their jerseys. If you are okay with this then Orr and Mclaren are not for you, For those that like to have pride in the Maple Leaf logo as one you do not walk over, will understand. I am still waiting for an answer what our 4th line did for us this year. At the beginning of the season this was all people talked about.

 

[Jacquestrapless]

One of the pressing issues is that we don't have tough guys in the top six. It's easy to put lower-skilled fist fighters on the fourth line and have em play 10 min against other fourth lines. However, other guys like Prust or Neil, play 10+ minutes, often against lines 2-3. Putting the fourth line out there would be a disaster in the making.

So:
1) we need a tougher top six
2) we need a more skilled bottom line that can take regular shifts and punch faces

 

[senor martinez]

You honestly believe players respect toughness over winning? Because I'd rather fill the roster with players that can compete to win. Not compete to fight.

Think more of the Detroit and less whatever era you're stuck in.

Yeah, we won more with Orr, Mike Brown and Mclaren all in the lineup on the 4th line two years ago than with these dorks. Softies. And even when we lose and lose we shall, nobody wants to **** with us. We give em back with all we have. Nobody going to push us. We had our identity back two years ago and right after we gave it away again... never seen that happen before. We are a legendary organization and we ain'ts to be pushed with. We will have our dirty players back again. It'll happen again. Wait and see. Then we'll win some. And read up my great post: We need other players too. Skilly guys. But we also need players who step on the ice and look at a mutha and then they stepping back. We don't need to fight, we need to be tuckers corsons and roberts and belfour and steve thomas you heard me. What you know about that?

 

[senor martinez]

Leafs were the softest team in the NHL, a team that went down without a lot of fight. In the end it does not equate to wins and losses, but optically it does make a difference. Coming into Toronto was a walkover. The opposing teams never had to wash their jerseys. If you are okay with this then Orr and Mclaren are not for you, For those that like to have pride in the Maple Leaf logo as one you do not walk over, will understand. I am still waiting for an answer what our 4th line did for us this year. At the beginning of the season this was all people talked about.

Exacty. That's a great identity to have.

We had our identity as a tough great organization back two years ago with carlyle. Then we gave it up again. Never seen that happen before. Now get it back again. Respect.

 

[R McD]

Exacty. That's a great identity to have.

We had our identity as a tough great organization back two years ago with carlyle. Then we gave it up again. Never seen that happen before. Now get it back again. Respect.

I forgot about what a great deep playoff push we made that year.

 

[BertCorbeau]

Orr and McLaren were with the Leafs last year from the start and they collapsed epically as well over...

I fail to see how they would have made that much of a difference this year to be honest.

 

[Jyrki Lumme]

Do we need tougher players? yes. Do we need Orr and McLaren? Hell no. Skill should be a necessity to being on an NHL team, toughness is a bonus.

 

[Wafflewhipper]

Don Cherry now on HIC. He said it right again. We should have had a guy like Orr or McLaren in from the get go. Get that respect, keep it. Even if we lose and we would have with this horrible team, we would have lost with honor, dignity and getting that respect. It would be tough to play against us when there was all these warriors out there like Orr.

So next season. Get some. Not Orr, but somebody else. Dubinsky, Clutterbuck, Parros, Domi, Tucker, Roberts, Matt Martin, Prust, Downie, Ott... some of these fools who play with all they have. Rinaldo.. etc. Some fools who hit hard and fight tough. Don Cherry knows hockey and its spirit like all real coaches do. We need many other players too, but play with men of honor.

Adam McQuaid is a UFA defenseman that's tough and good on defense. That's a start. I could see that happening actually if he was even slightly interested in playing in the NHL kitchen.

 

[Beleafer4]

I agree! We would have been 1st or 2nd overall pick going into the draft.

But alas, hindsight is 20/20.

LOL

 

[The Winter Soldier]

I think the poster and Cherry are saying is the 4th line this year was a non factor. If this is the case, and we are going to be bad anyway. Why not make opposing teams pay a price coming into the ACC. It's not like Kozun, Smith, Lindstrom or Sill… brought anything to the table.

 

[Wafflewhipper]

I agree! We would have been 1st or 2nd overall pick going into the draft.

But alas, hindsight is 20/20.

Our fourth line were soft and crappie. Wouldn't have been any difference. Other that the morons taking liberties with our team wouldn't have. That happened lots too.

 

[Wafflewhipper]

Leafs were the softest team in the NHL, a team that went down without a lot of fight. In the end it does not equate to wins and losses, but optically it does make a difference. Coming into Toronto was a walkover. The opposing teams never had to wash their jerseys. If you are okay with this then Orr and Mclaren are not for you, For those that like to have pride in the Maple Leaf logo as one you do not walk over, will understand. I am still waiting for an answer what our 4th line did for us this year. At the beginning of the season this was all people talked about.

Perfectly put.

 

[BraveCanadian]

I don't know if there is really a place for players that are strictly goons very often any longer.. with the group of players this year it obviously couldn't have made things any worse, though.

I do know that one of the Leafs biggest problems is that their players that are tough and gritty aren't really their talented players.

The top 6 is ridiculously soft. Terrible defensively and lazy. Talented.. but you can't win giving those guys big minutes. Kessel is #1 in the league in avoiding contact of any form.

You can't win when your best players aren't willing to pay any sort of price to get the job done.

Not saying they all have to be Wendel Clark and burn their bodies out by 30 but there is a happy medium there somewhere.

 

[Your Boy Troy]

Nothing worse than having a below average hockey team that plays soft. At least the Sabres had players (e.g. Cody McCormick, Patrick Kaleta, Nicolas Deslauriers, and Marcus Foligno) who brought entertainment and passion with their hits and fights. The Leafs have what; Sill, Carrick, and Komarov?

If the Leafs had Orr and/or McLaren; I would have watched a lot more Leaf games this season. And, many others would share that opinion as well.

Does anyone remember how loud the crowd was when Sill destroyed Ott in a fight? It was great, wasn't it?

With this team not going to compete in the upcoming years; it is time for Jamie Devane among others who bring toughness and energy to the table.

 

[Al14]

Orr and McLaren were with the Leafs last year from the start and they collapsed epically as well over...

I fail to see how they would have made that much of a difference this year to be honest.

Exactly, they didn't help much last season, so, how would they have helped this season?

 

[Highlander23]

Dear Op,

I have 3 advices for you:

Enjoy life,
Take care of your family &
Stop listening to that clown

Thanks

 

[Metal God]

I now that they are hard to get, but we need Shanahan, Owen Nolan (in his prime), Lindros, and Lucic type players.

 

[egd27]

I forgot about what a great deep playoff push we made that year.

As opposed to the other years since the first lockout?

Not sure if I completely agree with Cherry, but that's one bad argument you've made.

 

[Marmoset]

Leafs were the softest team in the NHL, a team that went down without a lot of fight. In the end it does not equate to wins and losses, but optically it does make a difference. Coming into Toronto was a walkover. The opposing teams never had to wash their jerseys. If you are okay with this then Orr and Mclaren are not for you, For those that like to have pride in the Maple Leaf logo as one you do not walk over, will understand. I am still waiting for an answer what our 4th line did for us this year. At the beginning of the season this was all people talked about.

I don't think you'll find many people that would argue against the idea that the Leafs were a very soft team this season. They were.

Where many people disagree is that Orr and McLaren would have made any significant difference. How much difference can two guys make that can't score, can't defend, and play about 4 minutes per game? Not many teams have guys like that on their roster playing with any regularity.

The Leafs don't need Orr and McLaren, they need Tucker and Roberts (to take a couple of names from the OP's list), or even Domi and Chris Neil. Domi and Neil are known for the fighting but both of them could score a bit, play a regular shift and not hurt the team when they were on the ice. Those are the types of guys the Leafs need. Unfortunately they're not always easy to find.

Today's NHL has no place for the Orrs and McLarens, and I think that is a good thing. Fighters can go try MMA or boxing. Hockey is for hockey players. If the hockey players can fight, that's a bonus, but the fighters MUST be able to play hockey.

 

[senor martinez]

I think the poster and Cherry are saying is the 4th line this year was a non factor. If this is the case, and we are going to be bad anyway. Why not make opposing teams pay a price coming into the ACC. It's not like Kozun, Smith, Lindstrom or Sill… brought anything to the table.

Yes, exactly.

Our softies on the 4th line were awful and did NOTHING SPECIAL for us. No goals, no hits, no hard work. nothing special to remember. If we lose, we still have to make them pay the price. We didn't do that. Our identity is lost and its because of us having awful, non character players with us. We do not make any teams pay anything. We just lose.