Does Steve Smith catch too much flack?

[SnowblindNYR]

Looking at the 1986 Flames thread I decided to start my own asking this. First of all, I will admit, I'm not a fan of either team but I cringe every time I see that goal. I'm biased towards dominant teams and it would have been awesome to see 5 straight cups. That said it seems like on HF, and even on this board that seems to have a self selecting group of knowledgeable fans, Steve Smith is the guy that cost the Oilers 5 straight cups. But here are two questions?

1) Why is it on him? The Oilers lost 3 games before that game. The Oilers also got themselves in a 2-0 hole in game 7 (I guess it wasn't as big of a hole back then). The Oilers only scored 2 goals in that game. That's not very impressive in today's NHL, back then it was probably like scoring 1 nowadays. Also the Oilers had 15 minutes to tie up.

2) How do you know the Oilers would win without the goal? I'd understand it if it was 2-1 Oilers at that point and it was the tying goal and then Calgary won in OT. However, it was 2-2 at that point, say no goal is scored and then they go into OT, where's the guarantee that the Oilers win?

I feel like blaming Steve Smith for the missing ring is just a way to romanticize the Oilers dynasty.

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[The Panther]

You are quite correct. The loss was never on Steve Smith, except as stated by fans who should know better.

Immediately after the game, Glen Sather told the media truthfully that his star players and regulars had lost the series for them, not Smith, and this was true.

Before that series, Edmonton had lost something like 3 home playoff games out of the previous 26 games at Northlands. Then, they lost 3 (very nearly 4) at home in that series against Calgary. (They were down 3 games to 2 before Smith suited up.)

And yes, there's no guarantee they'd have won the game and series if Smith hadn't done that. They would have lost, most likely.

 

[BraveCanadian]

It was a flukey accident and yes people make too much of it.

If the Oilers were really a superpower dynasty they should never have slacked off long enough for it to get to 7 games in the first place.

That being said, the late 80s Flames were a very strong team in their own right.

 

[The Panther]

If the Oilers were really a superpower dynasty...

What do you mean "if"...? They were a super-powered dynasty. What, 5 Cups in 7 years (6 Finals in 8) isn't enough to impress you?

they should never have slacked off long enough for it to get to 7 games in the first place.

Maybe, but I don't think they slacked off at all. Badger Bob and the Flames just had a perfect game-plan, which stymied Edmonton just enough for Calgary to get ahead, and they never let up.

That being said, the late 80s Flames were a very strong team in their own right.

Yup.


EDITED TO ADD: I saw Steve Smith buying yogurt in a Safeway in Calgary one time, around 1997.

 

[blogofmike]

Edmonton slacked off. Sather was very frustrated with it at the time. He broke up the line combos in game 6 and he didn't show up to a practice because of that frustration.

The lessons the Oilers learned from beating the Isles were temporarily forgotten and the Oilers got distracted by the goonery of the Flames and they played a less disciplined style overall.

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

hasn't gretzky said that if they don't lose in '86, he's not sure they don't regroup, reload, and refocus to win in '87 and '88?

 

[feffan]

I never blamed Smith for that series. There where many oppurtunities for the Oilers to get there sh**t together. A fluke goal in the last game, even if the direct deciding goal, wasn´t the crucial part off that loss so to say.
That Flames team beat them fair and square. Even if I, as expressed before, think that Flames team is overrated. By 1986 they weren´t what they would become. It sure is impressive to defeat prime Oilers, one of the greatest dynastys ever. But I think mostly to blame are the Oilers themselves. That 1986 playoffs may have been one of the "flukiest" ever. All the favourites out earlie.

Most dynastys and winners has those moments where they barely win or loose. There´s a level of chance every year. Even if you are the best team in the leauge by far you can face a lesser team that doesn´t suite you or are more well prepared. It´s really difficult to change gear in a series when you go in and think it´s gonna be easy because you know you´re the greatest. Even if one would think it´s only to "step up". The Islanders were close to there own Flames series for example...

To quote myself from an earlier thread:

I stand by that the Calgary Flames pre around 87 are quite overrated. Even if they beat the freakin Oilers.

That 86 loss leaves a mark in the Oilers dynasty. The Islanders were close to this kind of dent, but they had the luck on their side against Pittsburgh. A dump in, a "jump" from the puck over Carlyles stick to Tonellis stick. That was as a lucky bounce I´ve seen. And that was probably the Islanders best team. That ain´t gonna make me say that the Penguins of 82 was a great team. They weren´t. Just as I ain´t gonna believe that a good but nothing special Flames team was as great as they would become just because they had the Oilers number that playoffs.
As with the Islanders of 82 the Oilers of 86 seemed to be too cocky. Knowing that your great ain´t always a good thing. The Islanders had luck enough to get over there bump wihtout a loss. The Oilers had to come back next year because they didn´t get that lucky bounce.

 

[Moose Head]

At the end of the day, the most powerful offense in history had almost 20 minutes to score a goal, an didn't. The loss is on them.

 

[Buck Aki Berg]

If anyone is taking too much flack for an own-goal, it's Chris Phillips.

The number of times people crow about that like it's some amazing thing (see location to understand why I hear it so much...) is just ridiculous. It was game 5, and they lost by four.

 

[tony d]

I agree, guy actually had a good career, to bad he's remebered for the own goal more than anything else.

 

[Big Phil]

The Oilers were never really in that series. They were down 1-0, 2-1 and 3-2 in the series. They needed overtime in Game 2 to tie the series. This wasn't the normal Oilers type of hockey. They were never in charge. It almost reminds you of the 1993 Pens. A high scoring team, trying to win on talent alone assuming they can.

 

[The Panther]

To draw a distinction, my impression is that Edmonton didn't "slack off", but rather that the players did not play the style the coaching staff ordered them to. As Sather said after the series, "We gave them a game plan. They didn't follow it."

So, the loss is on the players, yes, but it's due to stubbornness, not lack of effort. Just my opinion.

Speaking of bad goals, a Calgary goal that Fuhr allowed in game 2 is far worse than the Steve Smith gaffe. Dan Quinn flipped a soft shot from the red-line, and Fuhr just misplayed it and it went in. Fortunately, for Edmonton, they won the game in OT, but had they lost, we'd have to put game 2 on Fuhr as much as 7 (if they'd got there) on Smith.

 

[jcorb58]

To make it worst it was on his birthday. I never blamed him, the Oilers were beat by a very determined team. I was happy when we beat Calgary the next year.

 

[shazariahl]

Speaking of bad goals, a Calgary goal that Fuhr allowed in game 2 is far worse than the Steve Smith gaffe. Dan Quinn flipped a soft shot from the red-line, and Fuhr just misplayed it and it went in. Fortunately, for Edmonton, they won the game in OT, but had they lost, we'd have to put game 2 on Fuhr as much as 7 (if they'd got there) on Smith.

I remember that goal. He had a couple other weak goals against that series too (though obviously not that bad). I really wanted us to switch to Moog - if nothing else, it would have shaken the team up and maybe woke some people up.

 

[The Panther]

I remember that goal. He had a couple other weak goals against that series too (though obviously not that bad). I really wanted us to switch to Moog - if nothing else, it would have shaken the team up and maybe woke some people up.

Just now I was going to show the goal, but it appears that all of Oiler-Fanatic / RetroTV99's videos have been pulled by YouTube.

 

[Big Phil]

1986 was a bad year for singular players being labelled as goats. Bill Buckner in the 1986 World Series being the other main one. Looking back at the bottom of the 10th inning in 1986 and you can see that Buckner might be 3rd or 4th on the pecking order in that inning alone of poor plays. He was the cherry on top, it was not his fault and there was a string of poor decisions leading up to that. I think Bostonians over time have realized that all three of Calvin Schiraldi, Bob Stanley and manager John McNamara deserve the blame over Buckner. But...........you won't see their mistakes on Sportscenter.

But the same thing happened with Steve Smith. That's all you saw. Never mind the Oilers had a 1-0, 2-1 and 3-2 series deficit and needed overtime in Game 2. They were a cocky bunch who thought talent would help them win. The ironic thing is that statistically speaking the Calgary series was one of the best ones Gretzky ever had. But it reminds me a bit of the 1993 Penguins. A little too comfortable at the top.

And to the poster who said "If the Oilers were such a powerhouse they'd have come back and won". This is true. Now, we know the Oilers came back in 1987 and 1988 but at that time, despite the two Cups in a row the dynasty talk was on hold. Just briefly of course, but no one knew how they'd react after this and they hadn't won their Cups yet. A more disciplined and dominant team in 1986 would have bailed Smith out.

 

[Voight]

No, that goal was all him. It would be different if he passed it toward the net and someone else's stick tipped it in or Fuhr mishandled it.

 

[VMBM]

No, that goal was all him. It would be different if he passed it toward the net and someone else's stick tipped it in or Fuhr mishandled it.

Huh?

Has anyone even tried to claim that the goal wasn't his fault?

 

[Esq]

This photo still kills me. Loved Smith on the Hawks.

 

[Laphroaig]

Steve Smith had an excellent career, the vast majority of it happened after the own goal. He more than redeemed himself for a goal that never cost his team the series in the first place.

 

[Supreme King]

Edmonton slacked off. Sather was very frustrated with it at the time. He broke up the line combos in game 6 and he didn't show up to a practice because of that frustration.

The lessons the Oilers learned from beating the Isles were temporarily forgotten and the Oilers got distracted by the goonery of the Flames and they played a less disciplined style overall.

Slacked Off?


Slacked Off?

How About They Were Simply Outplayed. Calgary Took It To The 2 Time Defending Champs, PlayeD Much More Disclipned Hockey And Pulled Off The Monumental Upset. Enough Excuses For The 1986 Oilers, They Lost Fair And Square.

 

[Tecumseh]

If anyone is taking too much flack for an own-goal, it's Chris Phillips.

The number of times people crow about that like it's some amazing thing (see location to understand why I hear it so much...) is just ridiculous. It was game 5, and they lost by four.

That might have been the series clinching goal but I can't think of any possible scenario where Ottawa ends up winning that game, much less the series.

 

[Mad Brills*]

Same with steve bartman.