Dion Phaneuf: All Phaneuf Discussion Here

[yubbers]

Dion of course deserves his own thread.

Since the last one closed........


And please explain how I lied about penalty minutes ACC

Click to read more...

 

[rdawg1234]

He's clearly a #2D, and I'm not a Dion hater.

He's fine as a stopgap #1 essentially, but would be MUCH better if he were paired with a true #1 exactly like what happened with Jay-Bouw.

Jay-bouw alone couldn't handle the load, as soon as he went to St Louis and Got paired with Pietrangelo his game improved immensely.

who your partner is on defence is huge, you can't do everything yourself, this is a team game, and Gunnarson is a 2nd pairing #3-4 d-man

 

[DD03]

So what you really mean to say is if we get Dion some help defensively, he's a #1? Sounds normal for any player to succeed. Help.

 

[yubbers]

We just need another 7mil dollar man. 14mil of cap space and Dions a gem

 

[Diatomic]

Look at all the #1D's and tell me if he compares with any of them.

Doughty, Karlsson, Subban, Weber, Keith etc.etc.

Phaneuf is no-where near their level, he's much more near the level of #2D's. Think of Seabrook, Yandle, Green, Bouwmeester etc.etc. He may be a bit better or bit worse than them but regardless he's not a #1D.

 

[rdawg1234]

Look at all the #1D's and tell me if he compares with any of them.

Doughty, Karlsson, Subban, Weber, Keith etc.etc.

Phaneuf is no-where near their level, he's much more near the level of #2D's. Think of Seabrook, Yandle, Green, Bouwmeester etc.etc. He may be a bit better or bit worse than them but regardless he's not a #1D.

You're clearly looking at offense.

I dont get how Karlsson who had a horrible year or even Subban who is very questionable DEFENSIVELY(he's a d-man) are that much better than Phaneuf? He's not as flashy obviously which is why people dont like him as much, but youre not gonna win a cup(underdogs make long runs all the time in the nhl) with Subban or Karlsson as your #1 if your #2 isn't extremely strong defensively, same thing goes with Dion.

Essentially I'm saying Dion is like a subban, Karlsson in that they are average/tier 2 #1 D-men, but would flourish with an equal or near equal partner like Keith has or Chara has.

EDIT: and just to clarify my stance, I would prefer to move on from Dion, as I believe he doesn't do well under pressure and he's not very mobile, but I wont ignore or deny that he can be a very strong defencemen most of the time, just has a very weak supporting cast

 

[Schenn]

He's a top end #2 defenseman, and if there was a Dman of equal caliber on this team he would look much better in the yes of fans not having to carry the load all by himself.

 

[Cor]

He's a top pairing defensemen.

We need another top defensemen.

 

[GordieHoweHatTrick]

I don't believe the "he needs a better partner" rhetoric. Gunnarsson isn't a big name but his conservative style of play helps bail Dion out. Let's be real here, Phaneuf isn't all that good defensively; he's McCabe 2.0 and if he's not putting up points he's not worth the price-tag. Glorified 2nd pairing d-man

 

[The Winter Soldier]

A healthy Dion Phaneuf is a #1 pairing D man.

 

[Bomber0104]

You're clearly looking at offense.

I dont get how Karlsson who had a horrible year or even Subban who is very questionable DEFENSIVELY(he's a d-man) are that much better than Phaneuf? He's not as flashy obviously which is why people dont like him as much, but youre not gonna win a cup(underdogs make long runs all the time in the nhl) with Subban or Karlsson as your #1 if your #2 isn't extremely strong defensively, same thing goes with Dion.

Essentially I'm saying Dion is like a subban, Karlsson in that they are average/tier 2 #1 D-men, but would flourish with an equal or near equal partner like Keith has or Chara has.

EDIT: and just to clarify my stance, I would prefer to move on from Dion, as I believe he doesn't do well under pressure and he's not very mobile, but I wont ignore or deny that he can be a very strong defencemen most of the time, just has a very weak supporting cast

If he needs better players than him to be even moderately successful for this franchise, I don't think he can be called a #1 defenceman.

That means 10% of our salary cap shouldn't go towards Phaneuf, but rather towards the players that need to shelter Phaneuf from getting lit up on a regular basis.

 

[EscapeGoat]

Quite easily a #1D. Next thread.

 

[Quares27]

Look at all the #1D's and tell me if he compares with any of them.

Doughty, Karlsson, Subban, Weber, Keith etc.etc.

Phaneuf is no-where near their level, he's much more near the level of #2D's. Think of Seabrook, Yandle, Green, Bouwmeester etc.etc. He may be a bit better or bit worse than them but regardless he's not a #1D.

Name all 30 #1Ds

Seabrook, Yandle, Green, Bouwmeester are not #2 defensemen, they are top 30 in the league and therefore #1s. By definition every team would have a #1 and therefore there would be 30 of them, although they're obviously not distributed 1 per team.

 

[Atomos2]

Look at all the #1D's and tell me if he compares with any of them.

Doughty, Karlsson, Subban, Weber, Keith etc.etc.

Phaneuf is no-where near their level, he's much more near the level of #2D's. Think of Seabrook, Yandle, Green, Bouwmeester etc.etc. He may be a bit better or bit worse than them but regardless he's not a #1D.

Let's be realistic in saying most of those dmen you are describing have a very very good partner. Obviously I'm not gonna say Phaneuf is in their league, but he starts off at a huge disadvantage considering the defensive depth and d partners(although Gunnarsson does an admirable job) along with playing the toughest competition out of all of them.

 

[DD03]

If he needs better players than him to be even moderately successful for this franchise, I don't think he can be called a #1 defenceman.

That means 10% of our salary cap shouldn't go towards Phaneuf, but rather towards the players that need to shelter Phaneuf from getting lit up on a regular basis.

What #1 defenseman doesn't need better players around them in order to play better? If Karlsson had some help on the back-end don't you think Ottawa could've made the playoffs? Or Weber and Nashville? They could use some help too.

Takes a lot more then one player to be a successful team.

 

[DaveT83*]

All the skill in the world can't cure the cancer that is Dion Phaneuf in the dressing room, off the ice, on the ice. .

 

[Funk21]

All the skill in the world can't cure the cancer that is Dion Phaneuf in the dressing room, off the ice, on the ice. .

Preach!

 

[Jes5ant]

I think I'll stay out of it this time haha. Unless of course The Apologist wants a round 2? haha

 

[Cor]

All the skill in the world can't cure the cancer that is Dion Phaneuf in the dressing room, off the ice, on the ice. .

 

[rdawg1234]

What #1 defenseman doesn't need better players around them in order to play better? If Karlsson had some help on the back-end don't you think Ottawa could've made the playoffs? Or Weber and Nashville? They could use some help too.

Takes a lot more then one player to be a successful team.

Thank you.

Dion can't do everything.

Does he have character or issues under pressure? I think anyone will admit to that. But when he's on his game(which is usually 90% of the year) he is 100% a top pairing lower tier #1 D-man.

and like I said before, just like Jay bouw, give him a better partner and he will flourish, a worse partner will only make the team and pairing play worse.

 

[MakeTheIronSing]

Next year Dion Phaneuf becomes the 3rd highest paid defeseman in the league. He alone takes up nearly 10% of the Leafs entire cap space. He sits below only Shea Weber and Ryan Suter and 400k above Duncan Keith.

Just thought I would cheer everyone up with that.

 

[Cor]

Next year Dion Phaneuf becomes the 3rd highest paid defeseman in the league. He alone takes up nearly 10% of the Leafs entire cap space. He sits below only Shea Weber and Ryan Suter and 400k above Duncan Keith.

Just thought I would cheer everyone up with that.

Okay, and? Phaneuf, if I remember correctly is the first top end defensemen to sign under the current CBA.

You can't compare contracts signed in previous CBA's to ones signed in this current CBA.

Edit: Forgot about Letang, he has a higher cap hit than Dion, and I'd say he is better then him.

 

[Grant]

Okay, and? Phaneuf, if I remember correctly is the first top end defense men to sign under the current UFA.

You can't compare contracts signed in previous CBA's to ones in this current CBA

If you are to look at the first 7/8 years only of contracts that extend beyond those years:

Name |Adjusted Caphit|Caphit on books|First year of contract|Percentage of cap in first year|Signed as UFA/RFA
Weber|11.5|7.86|2012|16.4%|-RFA-
Suter|10.15|7.54|2012|14.5%|UFA
Letang|7.25|7.25|2014|10.2%|UFA
Keith|7.22|5.54|2010|12.2%|-RFA-
Campbell|7.15|7.15|2008|12.6%|UFA
Doughty|7|7|2011|10.9%|-RFA-
Phaneuf|7|7|2014|9.8%|UFA
Chara|6.9|6.9|2011|10.7%|UFA
Boyle|6.67|6.67|2008|11.8%|UFA
Karlsson|6.5|6.5|2012|9.3%|-RFA-
Pietrangelo|6.5|6.5|2013|10.1%|-RFA-
Green|6.1|6.1|2012|8.7%|-RFA-

 

[Cor]

To me cap % in first year is the thing to look at.

 

[MakeTheIronSing]

Okay, and? Phaneuf, if I remember correctly is the first top end defense men to sign under the current UFA.

You can't compare contracts signed in previous CBA's to ones in this current CBA

What is a current UFA?