Did politics kill the Habs franchise ?

[Brownies]

We've got what, 3 local players on the team ? I also don't believe that Babcock would not have been welcomed by Bergevin with open arms. I think people are repeating the same exaggerations over and over. I think the Drouin trade is the only time the habs got really hosed for wanting a local french speaking guy. We are where we are because we should have Subban, Mcdonagh, Markov and Sergachev on the back-end... and drafted a #1 C in the last 10 years.

 

[TOGuy14]

Hear me out.

Montreal by far has the most media coverage of any team since they deal in both official languages and anyone who lived here knows french sports media is 24/7 about Habs.

That adds increased pressure for any potential UFAs wanting to play here.

Not to mention higher tax rates.

Also the reputation they have for demanding french representation from their players.

It really started to become apparent during the Koivu captaincy era. He had already been with the team for years and i remember the media started ripping into him because he couldn't speak french despite living in Quebec for years.

Obviously this did get heard about amongst the players community.

Than they rehire the same 2 coaches they fired just becuz they spoke french meanwhile disregarding better english only candidates ( apparently Babcock was interested ).

Than they obviously needed a french speaking GM, not just a GM. Once again limiting your candidates.

And now all the pressure to get a french speaking superstar they traded away a solid bluechip D ( Sergachev ) after they had lost Subban n Markov and were in desperate need of D now for a LW Drouin ( who lets not forget he had drama while in TB playing for one of the best teams in the league and HOF Yzerman ) that they decided was a natural C to please the masses.

Not counting all the forced drafting of french players not panning out ( Leblanc, Latendresse )

Anyone else believe if the Habs focussed on getting the best coaching staff, management and players regardless of language spoken theyd be better off ?

Did the Maple leafs get booted from the league and I missed it or something?

 

[boredmale]

We have other issues, but that's irrelevant. Look at the way the winning teams are managed, and compare it to how the Habs are managed.

I hate to get in on this debate(I am an Islanders fan for argument sake) but I think you can argue Montreal has been more successful in the playoffs then Washington the past 10 years

 

[57special]

What killed the franchise was expansion franchised wised up in the 80s and stop sending them high picks for has beens

Blame Grundman, another example of a failed Francophone GM. I mean, how hard was it? Pick Savard, stupid!

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

I hate to get in on this debate(I am an Islanders fan for argument sake) but I think you can argue Montreal has been more successful in the playoffs then Washington the past 10 years

Oh we certainly have our own issues, at least we don't impede our own success by enforcing stupid internal rules for political reasons.

 

[boredmale]

Blame Grundman, another example of a failed Francophone GM. I mean, how hard was it? Pick Savard, stupid!

You look at 70s drafts and it's sad seeing how Montreal basically went out of it's way to screw over many expansion franchises

 

[OldManGroin]

We may be reeling but news of our demise is greatly exaggerated. We have suck before, we suck now we will suck again in the future. it might take longer to turn the current ship around, but rest assured, the ship will be turned.

Ive been through the suckings of this team in the past.

This sucking has a different feel.

They need a an owner who will be able to seperate history / business.

God id laugh so hard if by some fluke they draft an entire team from the middle east / asia who dont speak a word of either language but can put the puck in the net and win.

My morbid curiosity would wanna see if fans would still find a reason to complain...

 

[OldManGroin]

Did the Maple leafs get booted from the league and I missed it or something?

TSN / SportsNet at least spend few minutes discussing other teams.

RDS / TVA show Habs highlights while reading out of town scores

 

[Captain Mountain]

I don't see a difference but it doesn't matter now anyway. Suppose that the top pick in the 2021 draft is a kid from Trois-Rivières, a generational player like the Habs haven't had since the 70's. In a 32 team league, the chances of landing that player are very low for even the bottom teams. It's just foolish to think that the Habs could be more successful if they focused on getting the top French speaking players and by limiting themselves to French speaking GMs and coaches. The Habs are the only team that regularly re-hire coaches they fired over 10 years ago. Are we going to see a 3rd stint for Michel Therrien in 10 years again?

Getting french players is only a problem depending on the opportunity cost. And that's often on the management. As for the coaching thing, that's just because, like many teams, they stick with the old boys club and most bilingual coaches start in Montreal. Its not like there aren't good up and coming bilingual coaches out there.

 

[Stickpucker]

I would think not being able to speak to French press and hear their criticisms would be a pro.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

Getting french players is only a problem depending on the opportunity cost. And that's often on the management. As for the coaching thing, that's just because, like many teams, they stick with the old boys club and most bilingual coaches start in Montreal. Its not like there aren't good up and coming bilingual coaches out there.

It severely limits the choice, that's my point. Other teams are free to hire whoever they want, the Canadiens limit themselves with a mostly useless requirement.

The Canadiens are kind of like what FC Barcelona would be if they didn't have the best player in the world, didn't care about winning first and didn't respect their fans. Such a shame.

 

[OldManGroin]

Yeah. It's better to try the Capitals way, it appears so much more successful.

Since both teams didnt win the cup in the last decades, id rather be a fan of the more entertaining team.

Guess which one that is ? There pretty gr8 to watch...

 

[Captain Mountain]

It severely limits the choice, that's my point. Other teams are free to hire whoever they want, the Canadiens limit themselves with a mostly useless requirement.

The Canadiens are kind of like what FC Barcelona would be if they didn't have the best player in the world, didn't care about winning first and didn't respect their fans. Such a shame.

My point is that other teams aren't picking from a wide pool either. Its the same group of guys that get hired and rehired over and over again.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

My point is that other teams aren't picking from a wide pool either. Its the same group of guys that get hired and rehired over and over again.

Yes but it's not limited to French speaking coaches anywhere else.

 

[Captain Mountain]

Yes but it's not limited to French speaking coaches anywhere else.

You make it sound as if all the bilingual coaches suck. Julien won a cup. Queneville won 3 cups. Vigneault and Therrien went to cup finals. Outside of the old-boys club, Ducharme is one of the best coaches in Juniors.

The variance in coaching quality isn't as big as people make it sound sometimes and its not like bilingual candidates are all terrible.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

You make it sound as if all the bilingual coaches suck. Julien won a cup. Queneville won 3 cups. Vigneault and Therrien went to cup finals. Outside of the old-boys club, Ducharme is one of the best coaches in Juniors.

The variance in coaching quality isn't as big as people make it sound sometimes and its not like bilingual candidates are all terrible.

Therrien is awful. Julien is good but his system isn't suitable for a team like the Habs. Coach Q doesn't speak French. Vigneault is good but he had his chance in Montreal too.

I never said that bilingual candidates are terrible, but I find it stupid that the Habs management would turn down Laviolette or Babcock or Sullivan because they don't speak French.

 

[OldManGroin]

You make it sound as if all the bilingual coaches suck. Julien won a cup. Queneville won 3 cups. Vigneault and Therrien went to cup finals. Outside of the old-boys club, Ducharme is one of the best coaches in Juniors.

The variance in coaching quality isn't as big as people make it sound sometimes and its not like bilingual candidates are all terrible.

And how many non bilingual coaches have won cups ?

Nobody is saying being bilingual is terrible.

The point is if you only hire bilingual coaches, your not choosing from the best candidates possible since your excluding all the unilingual candidates.

 

[sandysan]

We've got what, 3 local players on the team ? I also don't believe that Babcock would not have been welcomed by Bergevin with open arms. I think people are repeating the same exaggerations over and over. I think the Drouin trade is the only time the habs got really hosed for wanting a local french speaking guy. We are where we are because we should have Subban, Mcdonagh, Markov and Sergachev on the back-end... and drafted a #1 C in the last 10 years.

you forgetting randy cunneyworth who was publically thrown under the bus by the owner after getting fired ? What about DD being a #1C for YEARS ? We had lots on non francophone guys who could have been groomed for that role ( cough cough galchenyuk) but it appears that they lack the one essential skill, parlez vous centre ? FCS out choice to play center was a freing exploitation winger who had not played that position since junior.

how'd that work out for us ?
'

 

[TheMoreYouKnow]

It's a French-speaking place..seems normal to me that they prefer to work with people who speak French. If a Spanish football club hires a manager, they will prefer candidates that speak Spanish and if they by chance hire one who can't speak Spanish, they'll get him a teacher and ask him to learn it. It's pretty normal.

 

[Empoleon8771]

That's overly simplistic I think. There are a lot of reasons that the Habs are now bad, you can write a novel about it. Bad trades, bad drafting, bad signings, bad coaching, bad development...the list goes on. I think the biggest reason they are bad is because they can't draft, though. I think that's the overwhelming issue here. Sure, it doesn't help that they traded Subban and Sergachev, but Drouin and Weber aren't bad players. They're getting borderline nothing from their prospect pool, and anyone they get is being hurt by their bad development of players.

Since 2008, the Habs have yielded only a handful of NHL regulars from the draft. They are Gallagher, Beaulieu (not on Montreal anymore), Galchenyuk, Hudon, Andrighetto (not on Montreal anymore), De La Rose, Lehkonen, Sergachev (not on Montreal anymore) and Mete. That's straight up awful drafting, especially when you consider guys like De La Rose, Hudon and Andrighetto aren't hard to draft and aren't special.

 

[sandysan]

Discriminatory and bias hiring practices have made the Habs irrelevant...they are just living off of legacy now.

and that legacy is deep enough to get us through these dark times.

the arizona coyotes, we are not.

 

[LeafFever]

It's a French-speaking place..seems normal to me that they prefer to work with people who speak French. If a Spanish football club hires a manager, they will prefer candidates that speak Spanish and if they by chance hire one who can't speak Spanish, they'll get him a teacher and ask him to learn it. It's pretty normal.

It puts the organization at a disadvantage. No team faces that in Euro football.

 

[OldManGroin]

It's a French-speaking place..seems normal to me that they prefer to work with people who speak French. If a Spanish football club hires a manager, they will prefer candidates that speak Spanish and if they by chance hire one who can't speak Spanish, they'll get him a teacher and ask him to learn it. It's pretty normal.

Lets say your american.

Toronto and Montreal both have the same skill level team.

They both offer you the same contract.

TO says they will hire a french translator for you when dealing with french media.

MTL says its mandatory for you to learn french to get the job.

Which offer are you going to take ?

The one that works around you or the one that forces you into the mold ?

 

[LeafFever]

My point is that other teams aren't picking from a wide pool either. Its the same group of guys that get hired and rehired over and over again.

Yes they are. 30 other teams can hire anyone that is a fit. The Habs are the only team which cannot.
The only organization hiring the same guys is..The Habs. Last 2 coaches are guys they previously fired. Not happening elsewhere is it? It's because they have so few to choose from. Time for Alain Vigneault to replace Julien next.

 

[nowhereman]

As far as I know, the NHL does not operate in French, it does not transact trades in French, and organizations do not communicate in French.

So, if that's the case, why would an NHL franchise limit itself to French-speaking management? So that he can communicate with a fanbase that should and most likely does speak English?

Seems kind of backwards to me.