Speculation: Devils at the Trade Deadline

[Saugus]

My guesses: Vesey is likely gone. Subban could be moved if someone gets desperate.

If Zacha is traded it will likely be at the draft. Fitz might hold off on making a decision on Severson until next season.

 

[Monsieur Verdoux]

TSN's Chris Johnston mentioned on his podcast yesterday that he hadn't heard much about Subban. Just taking a look at the RD for the playoff contenders and I don't see a ton of demand.



It was rumored before the season that Boston/Toronto planned to keep tabs on Subban closer to the deadline. In theory, Subban could be an upgrade over Connor Clifton but it seems like Boston might be better served getting a top 4 LD. Toronto would probably be more interested in a Josh Manson type.

We'll see if there are injuries closer to the deadline. Tyson Barrie just got put on IR but should be back before the trade deadline.

Subban is probably plan C for some team. Maybe Guerin wants to shake their defense, that has leaked lately. Or the Hurricanes want to bring in someone who is defensively a little bit better than Bear. They also have had injury issues, so they might need more defensemen (I don't think they trade Bear). Or maybe the Maple Leafs want to replace Holl, and they don't find better option than Subban. Or what about the Avalanche? Subban is better defenseman than Murray. On the other hand, there are a lot of better ways to use cap space than to trade Subban.

 

[Eggtimer]

Knight might be available.
I make a very aggressive offer if I’m Fitz.
Knight isn’t really being shopped but is available for the right move. Apparently he is part of a package offered for Chychrun.
Can’t see them trading him unless it’s for a piece as valuable as Chychrun would be for a cup run.
Hopefully Chychrun goes somewhere else and Panthers get desperate to add a D (Severson) .
Not to get too greedy but Tippet and Knight would be deadly. I don’t know enough about Tippets overall game though to,know if he is a good fit or not. I just know he was a high pick and a very good prospect at one time.

 

[Blackjack]

coleman was easily the most talented chip the devils had to trade he was absolutely expected to get a first round pick back. the devils were just extremely lucky the bolts had the canucks pick to give them otherwise getting basically a second round pick for him would've been brutal

Link to any article or post here predicting a 1st round pick for Coleman?

 

[JrFischer54]

Link to any article or post here predicting a 1st round pick for Coleman?

i dont care what any "expert" was saying. and go dig up the posts if you want i don't care what people on here posted. I know myself anything less then a 1st would've been bad esp considering foote looks meh.

people think coleman for a first is robbery then turn around and say palms and zajac for a first is good. just weird

 

[Brodeur]

Subban is probably plan C for some team. Maybe Guerin wants to shake their defense, that has leaked lately. Or the Hurricanes want to bring in someone who is defensively a little bit better than Bear. They also have had injury issues, so they might need more defensemen (I don't think they trade Bear). Or maybe the Maple Leafs want to replace Holl, and they don't find better option than Subban. Or what about the Avalanche? Subban is better defenseman than Murray. On the other hand, there are a lot of better ways to use cap space than to trade Subban.

Carolina was rumored to be kicking the tires on John Klingberg if he were to be available. Colorado has limited cap space and a double retained Subban appears like it would eat up most of that, so I don't know if Sakic would want that to be his only deadline move. I think I saw that Bowen Byram is skating again, but there's no timetable for him to return to their lineup.

Minnesota could have a spot, I haven't watched any of their games recently so I don't know how well Calen Addison is doing on their 3rd pair. I figured they'd be focusing on a center upgrade but they might have enough cap space for a couple rentals.

 

[Brodeur]

Knight might be available.
I make a very aggressive offer if I’m Fitz.
Knight isn’t really being shopped but is available for the right move. Apparently he is part of a package offered for Chychrun.
Can’t see them trading him unless it’s for a piece as valuable as Chychrun would be for a cup run.
Hopefully Chychrun goes somewhere else and Panthers get desperate to add a D (Severson) .
Not to get too greedy but Tippet and Knight would be deadly. I don’t know enough about Tippets overall game though to,know if he is a good fit or not. I just know he was a high pick and a very good prospect at one time.

I think I read that Arizona asked for Knight in a Chychrun package but were turned down. Sounded like they'd rather deal Tippett or Denisenko. Florida has decent enough depth at RD (Ekblad/Gudas/Montour) and they have a righty playing on the left in Weegar. I don't see them going for another RD.

 

[Captain3rdLine]

What do they need Rico for?

For old times sake?

 

[JrFischer54]

Knight might be available.
I make a very aggressive offer if I’m Fitz.
Knight isn’t really being shopped but is available for the right move. Apparently he is part of a package offered for Chychrun.
Can’t see them trading him unless it’s for a piece as valuable as Chychrun would be for a cup run.
Hopefully Chychrun goes somewhere else and Panthers get desperate to add a D (Severson) .
Not to get too greedy but Tippet and Knight would be deadly. I don’t know enough about Tippets overall game though to,know if he is a good fit or not. I just know he was a high pick and a very good prospect at one time.

knight would be great

 

[njdevils1982]

saw this tour in boston on 9/19/99 in an old worn out theatre…..a week later i found an excellent quality audience recording of the same show on napster and burned a double disc of it…still works

 

[My3Sons]

saw this tour in boston on 9/19/99 in an old worn out theatre…..a week later i found an excellent quality audience recording of the same show on napster and burned a double disc of it…still works

I didn’t know the Joker played music.

 

[nugg]

If the deals were right, Id move all of those names minus Severson - Id even add Ty Smith

Id take picks for Vesey and Subban and package Zacha and Ty for a Boeser type move

Selling Ty would be a selling low deal. I'd like to think it's just a sophomore slump.

 

[Captain3rdLine]

Selling Ty would be a selling low deal. I'd like to think it's just a sophomore slump.

This all depends on whether you think he’s gonna bounce back and eventually be better than he was in his rookie season.

If he doesn’t get much better than he is now his value is gonna keep going down the further away he gets from his rookie season and junior career until he’s worth pretty much nothing.

I think that’s what some people are worried about.

 

[Triumph]

Link to any article or post here predicting a 1st round pick for Coleman?

Devils 2019-20 Team Discussion (news and notes) -part IX

 

[Emperoreddy]

It's going to be quiet. They will maybe trade Vesey or PK for spare parts but by and large they really shouldn't be doing massive fire sales anymore.

 

[Triumph]

My man, I literally wrote a pretty detailed post citing the facts of Tom Fitzgerald's trade history combined with the facts of NHL trade deadline history and then illustrated them with my own speculations of what might happen with the Devils trade deadline, which I specifically stated were my own speculations.

I would've just let the post sit there if you hadn't attributed people's claim that Zacha does not have high trade value to analytics. It has NOTHING to do with analytics, you can just look at goals and assists and look at the history of trades in the NHL and come to that conclusion; a player of Zacha's history has just never been traded for a 1st round pick, not in the cap era.

You replied with yet another argumentative post essentially dismissing me on the basis of my speculations not being as good as your speculations in your opinion.

Yes, because I'm taking into account what a player is paid, a player's contract status and a player's age - all things almost all NHL teams do look at before they make trades.

I don't know what to say here to make it just stop. Um, you win?

I don't win because I responded to this again. You can make it stop by not just inventing reasons for things.

 

[Captain3rdLine]

I would've just let the post sit there if you hadn't attributed people's claim that Zacha does not have high trade value to analytics. It has NOTHING to do with analytics, you can just look at goals and assists and look at the history of trades in the NHL and come to that conclusion; a player of Zacha's history has just never been traded for a 1st round pick, not in the cap era.



Yes, because I'm taking into account what a player is paid, a player's contract status and a player's age - all things almost all NHL teams do look at before they make trades.



I don't win because I responded to this again. You can make it stop by not just inventing reasons for things.

Were you the one that I argued with about this before and you gave the Bennett example as a comparable player even though Bennett was at a similar stage in his career and didn’t have close to Zacha’s level of production when he was traded for 2 2nds?

 

[Triumph]

Were you the one that I argued with about this before and you gave the Bennett example as a comparable player even though Bennett was at a similar stage in his career and didn’t have close to Zacha’s level of production when he was traded for 2 2nds?

How about you try to use the search function to figure that out instead of just asking me? f*** if I know, I make a lot of posts and you changed your name.

Bennett wasn't traded for 2 2nds, either, you guys have to get these things right. He was traded for a 2nd and a guy taken in the 2nd round. That is not '2 2nds'.

 

[StevenToddIves]

Were you the one that I argued with about this before and you gave the Bennett example as a comparable player even though Bennett was at a similar stage in his career and didn’t have close to Zacha’s level of production when he was traded for 2 2nds?

I appreciate his enthusiasm and love for the Devils, but he reminds me of an uncle who loves to argue for the sake of arguing without really paying attention if his third point directly contradicts his second point which kind of contradicted his first point.

 

[Captain3rdLine]

How about you try to use the search function to figure that out instead of just asking me? f*** if I know, I make a lot of posts and you changed your name.

Bennett wasn't traded for 2 2nds, either, you guys have to get these things right. He was traded for a 2nd and a guy taken in the 2nd round. That is not '2 2nds'.

Lol relax pal. And sorry you’re right it wasn’t two seconds but a second and a player who had just been taken in the top half of the second round. So that’s pretty much 2 2nds.

 

[Triumph]

Lol relax pal. And sorry you’re right it wasn’t two seconds but a second and a player who had just been taken in the top half of the second round. So that’s pretty much 2 2nds.

It is not 2 2nds. Stop saying it is. Things change massively after the draft, Heineman was having an okay season so he is probably worth around a '2nd round pick' value-wise, but there've been plenty of 2nd round picks who were worth significantly less than a 2nd round pick a year after their draft, and others worth significantly more.

 

[Captain3rdLine]

It is not 2 2nds. Stop saying it is. Things change massively after the draft, Heineman was having an okay season so he is probably worth around a '2nd round pick' value-wise, but there've been plenty of 2nd round picks who were worth significantly less than a 2nd round pick a year after their draft, and others worth significantly more.

As you said his value was probably around a ‘2nd round pick’. He was a 43rd overall pick who had an okay season and who’s value probably hadn’t drastically changed.

 

[Triumph]

As you said his value was probably around a ‘2nd round pick’. He was a 43rd overall pick who had an okay season and who’s value probably hadn’t drastically changed.

But still, there's the fact that Florida was willing to move him. Prospects that get traded do not have a good track record - the team that has them is following them closer than teams that don't. Every so often a Filip Forsberg thing happens where a team just misses on a guy they had, but if you look at the track record of guys that Tampa traded versus guys they kept, for example, it doesn't look great.

That said, that's the kind of return I'd expect for Zacha. Bennett plays a more physical game and he'd had a big playoffs for Calgary, I've still never really seen a player's game change that much that quickly after being dealt. He went from being a 3rd/4th liner to immediately being one of the top goal scorers in the NHL.

 

[Captain3rdLine]

But still, there's the fact that Florida was willing to move him. Prospects that get traded do not have a good track record - the team that has them is following them closer than teams that don't. Every so often a Filip Forsberg thing happens where a team just misses on a guy they had, but if you look at the track record of guys that Tampa traded versus guys they kept, for example, it doesn't look great.

That said, that's the kind of return I'd expect for Zacha. Bennett plays a more physical game and he'd had a big playoffs for Calgary, I've still never really seen a player's game change that much that quickly after being dealt. He went from being a 3rd/4th liner to immediately being one of the top goal scorers in the NHL.

I think an argument for Zacha possibly getting more than that can easily be made. His production has been much better than Bennett’s was leading into the trade. The string playoff performance offsets it a bit but not that much.

 

[Triumph]

I think an argument for Zacha possibly getting more than that can easily be made. His production has been much better than Bennett’s was leading into the trade. The string playoff performance offsets it a bit but not that much.

No, this is what STI was doing where he was looking at one trade in a vacuum and making a declaration. If you look at the history of these sorts of players being dealt, it just isn't for a lot and the return usually looks like this. Yes, Zacha has a few more points, he plays with Nico Hischier and got some PP1 time both years. If a team scouts him at all they will see the warts we see - turnovers at his own blueline, failure to win enough puck battles, etc.

Bennett looked like a big overpay at the time given his history but somehow he immediately became a 40 goal scorer, who knew