Devils 2017-18 team discussion (player news and notes) - Offseason part V

[Classic Devil]

I don't think he is a terrific 4th line LW. He has speed, but other than that he needs to work on a lot of his game. Realistically should be in the AHL next season.

The thing about Wood is he changes the game when he's on the ice. That makes you a good 4th liner.

 

[TheDuke93]

Palmieri was not consistent early on, after that he was on more so than not. And if the power play wasn't garbage the way it was for stretches on end, and Palms wasn't shanking shots or shooting wide and high early on, he would have had at least 30 goals.

Regarding hall, he was not on every night, nor was he even close to being on every night.

BTW, whats the excuse for Palmieri outscoring and outproducing Zajac when they played the same amount of games?

Hall had a .73 ppg pace, Zajac had a .56 ppg pace and Palms had a .66 ppg pace. Hall would have out scored Palms if he was not hurt, and I do think Palms had a good season, just a pretty bad start is all. As for Zajac, we know he is not going to put up points, but he is really good defensively and one of the most important players on this team. This is not a nock on Palms, so much as me saying that we would have finished much worse if Zajac was not consistent every night.

 

[TheDuke93]

He's got the potential to be better than that.

He could become a very good NHL player.

 

[Devilsgrl35]

He's got the potential to be better than that.

I agree, he definitely has more raw talent than Martin. He has the feistiness of that type of player though. I think Wood will be a 3rd liner that sucks to play against.

 

[TheDuke93]

I agree, he definitely has more raw talent than Martin. He has the feistiness of that type of player though. I think Wood will be a 3rd liner that sucks to play against.

He reminds me of a "heavy" grabner if that makes sense haha.

 

[Devilsgrl35]

He reminds me of a "heavy" grabner if that makes sense haha.

I get what you're saying and that's actually a really good comparison.

 

[Triumph]

You can call it magic all you want, the will to compete is paramount in hockey. There are players with sublime skill who float around, and there are players who will take the net off the mooring with their teeth to push the puck into the net. You need all the elements of the game reflected in your roster.

Why? Who says?

I'm not a mindless follower of tradition, but you need a lot of proof to overturn it. I look around the league and I see these kinds of "energy" players utilized by coaches almost uniformly. I don't buy that so many professionals don't know what they're doing. Sports jobs have some of the least security of any professional position. You really think they're not aware of every angle to this stuff, analytics and otherwise? You think they are purposely lowering their chance of keeping their jobs by making sub-optimal roster choices? Again, we're not talking about one coach or one organization here, we're talking about the industry standard.

Hockey is a sport more hewed to tradition than any other. Look at how many sons of former professional players play in the league. Look at how many sons of players or coaches or GMs become coaches or GMs themselves. There's 3 current NHL GMs whose fathers are in the Hockey Hall of Fame as coaches or executives. What are the odds that their kids happened to be the best men for the job? Crazy, right?

The real risk that coaches run is not winning or losing games. It's doing something weird or out-of-the-ordinary. It's going against the immutable Hockey Code. If you go according to the Hockey Code, you eventually get fired - after all, GMs get fired constantly and their biggest trump card is firing a coach - but you will get hired somewhere else. If you get bad luck, you wash out of the league as a coach. If you get good luck and manage to win a Stanley Cup, you will have multiple NHL coaching jobs in your future almost regardless of the results.

I'm not even saying this is a conscious thing, and there are good and bad coaches, but I don't think the difference between them is generally that big - part of that is an unwillingness to experiment. Everyone's just doing 31 variations on the same thing.

Shero made the right statement to the media according to the Hockey Code after the season. His team sucked, so he said the team had to get tougher. That's what almost everyone says. The problem isn't skill, it's toughness. Blackhawks lose? Toughness. Gotta get tougher.

As to Miles Wood in particular, this whole argument is likely moot. His possession numbers showed steady improvement throughout the year. I expect that to continue throughout his development as a player.

No they didn't. Corsica is gone so it's harder to test this, but he started bad and ended bad. The major change was that DSP got hurt for the year so he no longer had to play with him, but his results without DSP didn't really change.

 

[Brooklyndevil]

Wood is a perfect 4th liner. I wish we had two more. He's one of a very few physical players on the Devils. That's why I believe they should have drafted Comtois. It's great to have pretty skaters with skill, but you still need a few bulldogs in lineup like Wood.

 

[Cult of Hynes]

Hall had a .73 ppg pace, Zajac had a .56 ppg pace and Palms had a .66 ppg pace. Hall would have out scored Palms if he was not hurt, and I do think Palms had a good season, just a pretty bad start is all. As for Zajac, we know he is not going to put up points, but he is really good defensively and one of the most important players on this team. This is not a nock on Palms, so much as me saying that we would have finished much worse if Zajac was not consistent every night.

And none of that disproves Palms being one of the most consistent players.

 

[TheDuke93]

And none of that disproves Palms being one of the most consistent players.

He was horrible to start that year, Hall and Zajac were steady, am I missing something?

 

[Oneiro]

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to say we need more skill. A GM falling back on the "toughness" mantra is not a misdiagnosis - it's a deflection. You're not directly indicting your players when you say things like that. It's a lot easier to say that your guys don't have the right attitude, as opposed to saying they don't have enough talent.

Frankly, I think it's both. The team is soft in positioning, boardplay and overall physicality. And they're not skilled enough.

The toughness viewpoint becomes a problem when you draft Chathams and Thomsens, and when you overpay Andrew Shaws and Matt Martins. Which Shero has not done. Yet.

 

[Cult of Hynes]

He was horrible to start that year, Hall and Zajac were steady, am I missing something?

Yea, the rest of the season after Palms started horrible where he started to score and produce offense and lead the team in goals and was tied for the most points. A bad start doesn't change that.

 

[TheDuke93]

Yea, the rest of the season after Palms started horrible where he started to score and produce offense and lead the team in goals and was tied for the most points. A bad start doesn't change that.

So he was inconsistent for 1/4 of the season...

 

[Bleedred]

I feel like he's going to be a Matt Martin type of player and you need those guys on your team.

I really hope not. That wouldn't be a good thing at all.

Matt Martin is a bad hockey player, who gets overvalued by cavemen hockey people because he can fight and chip in a whopping 12 or 14 points and close to 20 in a fluke good year.

Players like Matt Martin are worthless in 2017, and that dumb contract Lou and company gave him is pretty hilarious.

 

[Cult of Hynes]

So he was inconsistent for 1/4 of the season...

And Zajac is inconsistent offensively and Hall wasn't healthy and missed 2 and a half weeks worth of games.

So how does any of that change the fact that they were the 3 most consistent players on the team? Oh wait, it doesn't.

Oh, and were any of them point per game players? No? I guess they weren't the most consistent players on the Devils then. Oh wait, that doesn't mean they weren't.

 

[TheDuke93]

And Zajac is inconsistent offensively and Hall wasn't healthy and missed 2 and a half weeks worth of games.

So how does any of that change the fact that they were the 3 most consistent players on the team? Oh wait, it doesn't.

Zajac is what he has been his whole career a shut down possession center. Hall drove play all season. Lets agree to disagree though and move on.

 

[Devilsgrl35]

I really hope not. That wouldn't be a good thing at all.

Matt Martin is a bad hockey player, who gets overvalued by cavemen hockey people because he can fight and chip in a whopping 12 or 14 points and close to 20 in a fluke good year.

Players like Matt Martin are worthless in 2017, and that dumb contract Lou and company gave him is pretty hilarious.

I know a lot of Islander fans who miss Martin like hell and think it was a mistake letting him go.

 

[Bleedred]

I know a lot of Islander fans who miss Martin like hell and think it was a mistake letting him go.

It was not a mistake letting him go, did you see how much the Leafs signed him for? It's a terrible contract for a guy that averages 12 or 14 points per year. If that's worth well over $2 million per year and at 4 years term, the league minimum wage should be boosted to $2.5 million per year.

The only mistake made was when Garth turned around and gave Clutterbuck to an equally hideous contract.

I think Wood is already quite a bit better at offense than Martin and he's only topped Wood's point total from last year one time in his career and it was only two points more and over 20 more games. Wood has a lot of deficiencies though.

 

[Cult of Hynes]

Zajac is what he has been his whole career a shut down possession center. Hall drove play all season. Lets agree to disagree though and move on.

Nah, I won't agree to disagree over facts. Yes, Zajac is good defensively, but inconsistent offensively. I have no clue why you excuse zajacs inconstencies and over look Halls and harp on Palms while ignoring how he was one I of most consistent player for the team this season. He only missed two games and he was the second most consistent offensive player when going by PPG.

 

[goonybird]

I dno bout you guys but I just got home from a long day of trapping and watched some Scott Stevens tribute vids on youtube and it was inspiring.

It really makes you want to be the 'scott stevens' of your workplace. like if you could deck someone from procurement

 

[Devilsgrl35]

It was not a mistake letting him go, did you see how much the Leafs signed him for? It's a terrible contract for a guy that averages 12 or 14 points per year. If that's worth well over $2 million per year and at 4 years term, the league minimum wage should be boosted to $2.5 million per year.

The only mistake made was when Garth turned around and gave Clutterbuck to an equally hideous contract.

I think Wood is already quite a bit better at offense than Martin and has only topped Wood's point total from last year one time in his career and it was only two points more and over 20 more games. Wood has a lot of deficiencies though.

I don't disagree he got a big contract. It's the Cizikas contract they don't like and would've rather have spent it on and then some on Martin.

If Wood becomes some type of Martin/Grabner hybrid is that so bad? I don't think so.