CXLVIII - NHL BOG approves sale and relocation of Coyotes to Ryan Smith, league announces establishment of franchise in Utah

[GKJ]

 

[LadyStanley]

Horse's mouth

 

[bleedblue94]

I don't know if other people caught it, but if you follow Bettman at all then you know that his language is always chosen on purpose.

He may have said that the coyotes were made "inactive" almost a dozen times in this segment just now on Sportsnet. All this speculation that AM would have to pay back the billion dollars in an expansion fee maybe completely out the window. If the franchise is inactive then there isn't going to be an expansion. The franchise exists. The billion dollars that Smith paid the league for the team for all intents and purposes is the expansion fee.

Right now the NHL is 33 teams in it but only 32 that are active. Willing to bet that once the team comes back there's going to be a severely discounted fee involved that will be meant to simply cover logistics of activating team number 33 and hosting a player draft.

He never once said Arizona and expansion. That is such an important thing that most people are going to miss. No way is AM paying that 1b back to the league to reactivate the franchise, no chance.

 

[TheLegend]

Well since I joined this board in 2012 I've had Arizonans tell me how I didn't understand a whole bunch of things and didn't know what I was talking about. Well here we are and the NHL did eventually run out of patience and Muerelo wasn't the savvy magician people made him out to be. It turned out Ryan Smith was working as closely with the NHL as I said he was and not being Jim Balsillie 2.0 and just talking out of school.

So while I recognize the pain of the few Coyotes faithful (which is why I have never gone to the main Coyotes board) I think I'm entitled to a few "I told you sos" here.

Broken clock speaks.

Sorry but you’ve been wrong about a number of things regarding Arizona over the years. Just because you get to take a victory lap doesn’t absolve you of it.

 

[KevFu]

I don't know if other people caught it, but if you follow Bettman at all then you know that his language is always chosen on purpose.

He may have said that the coyotes were made "inactive" almost a dozen times in this segment just now on Sportsnet. All this speculation that AM would have to pay back the billion dollars in an expansion fee maybe completely out the window. If the franchise is inactive then there isn't going to be an expansion. The franchise exists. The billion dollars that Smith paid the league for the team for all intents and purposes is the expansion fee.

Right now the NHL is 33 teams in it but only 32 that are active. Willing to bet that once the team comes back there's going to be a severely discounted fee involved that will be meant to simply cover logistics of activating team number 33 and hosting a player draft.

He never once said Arizona and expansion. That is such an important thing that most people are going to miss. No way is AM paying that 1b back to the league to reactivate the franchise, no chance.

It's not speculation. Meruelo has to pay $1b to reactivate the Coyotes.

 

[PredsHead]

Horse's mouth

Other end of the horse......

 

[bleedblue94]

It's not speculation. Meruelo has to pay $1b to reactivate the Coyotes.

You've seen this contract?

 

[blues10]

I don't know if other people caught it, but if you follow Bettman at all then you know that his language is always chosen on purpose.

He may have said that the coyotes were made "inactive" almost a dozen times in this segment just now on Sportsnet. All this speculation that AM would have to pay back the billion dollars in an expansion fee maybe completely out the window. If the franchise is inactive then there isn't going to be an expansion. The franchise exists. The billion dollars that Smith paid the league for the team for all intents and purposes is the expansion fee.

Right now the NHL is 33 teams in it but only 32 that are active. Willing to bet that once the team comes back there's going to be a severely discounted fee involved that will be meant to simply cover logistics of activating team number 33 and hosting a player draft.

He never once said Arizona and expansion. That is such an important thing that most people are going to miss. No way is AM paying that 1b back to the league to reactivate the franchise, no chance.

Dreger, Lebrun and Reda just had a discussion about the 1 billion in insider trading. It was said that most NHL BOGs don’t ever expect AM to be able to reactivate the franchise. They expect the NHL back in Arizona at some point but not AM as owner.

 

[GKJ]

Meruelo looks like bizarro Elon Musk

 

[mouser]

I think the NHL union is better/stronger than the NBA's. You could argue that in a lot of ways, the NHLPA's gotten more from ownership to benefit the entirety of the players than any other union.

MLB's union is by far the strongest, but they don't have the assurances that the "lower middle class" of the league is taken care of at all. Their last CBA negotiation they were basically whining that the teams/GMs need to go back to being stupid...

And it's a completely different animal in each league, because the NBA's is way more of a lip-service of "give the players these individual tiny demands... but the structure of the league really screws the average player." (You could argue there really AREN'T average players in the NBA, it's set up to pay the stars and the non-stars are expendable/interchangeable, on their own).


But that's really OT. The fight over specific language into the CBA about arena regulations probably just isn't worth it. They all WANT the same thing, it's a matter of what they'll settle for in extreme circumstances. How do I put this: They don't have a rule against playing in a 4,600-seat arena for the same reason the CBA doesn't outlaw players sticking their genitals in the skate sharpeners: because who TF would WANT to do that?!?!?!?

I can agree with your take. I was focusing more on the NBAPA union leadership having more power to negotiate their terms with the Owners than the NHLPA has shown. Agree the NHLPA may have done a better job of increasing paychecks for the middle and lower tiers of players where the NBAPA has favored the top tier of union members.

 

[KevFu]

You've seen this contract?

Ugh.

Yes, I'm Gary Bettman.

 

[blues10]

From TSN
“He can reactivate that franchise if he can build that rink within the next five years. And the price tag to reactivate the Coyotes within that time frame will be $1 billion. The money that you just got for selling so that's the deal that they've agreed to. I will tell you that, you know, I think both between Dregs and I, in talking to governors around the league, there's not that many that have confidence that Alex Meruelo will be able to pull this off. Does the NHL want to go back to Arizona? Yes, absolutely. I'm not sure it's going to be with Alex Meruelo as the owner.“
I don’t know how to link the full article. Sorry

 

[TheLegend]

I don't know if other people caught it, but if you follow Bettman at all then you know that his language is always chosen on purpose.

He may have said that the coyotes were made "inactive" almost a dozen times in this segment just now on Sportsnet. All this speculation that AM would have to pay back the billion dollars in an expansion fee maybe completely out the window. If the franchise is inactive then there isn't going to be an expansion. The franchise exists. The billion dollars that Smith paid the league for the team for all intents and purposes is the expansion fee.

Right now the NHL is 33 teams in it but only 32 that are active. Willing to bet that once the team comes back there's going to be a severely discounted fee involved that will be meant to simply cover logistics of activating team number 33 and hosting a player draft.

He never once said Arizona and expansion. That is such an important thing that most people are going to miss. No way is AM paying that 1b back to the league to reactivate the franchise, no chance.

I believe I said something similar a while but based on the notion Meruelo would have to pay the billion back to reactivate the team.

But Jeff Marek was on the PHNX podcast the other day and felt Meruelo had a lot more leverage here than people want to believe. Depending on the language of their agreement, Meruelo could come out of this with massive value.

That is if he pulls off the auction and builds the arena/ED he plans to with then timeline.

 

[TheLegend]

From Kachina to Ka-ching.

Post of the year.

 

[AtlantaWhaler]

Atlanta failed twice. The Nords lasted longer in QC than either the Flames or Thrashers did in Atlanta, in fact longer than those two combined.

Plus there is already an arena in QC.

The Flames was almost 50 years ago.

Atlanta is 8X the size, way more corporate money, and getting a brand new arena. Oh...and they have the most important part...at least one (there are multiple) potential owner willing to pay the expansion fee. Quebec already had one that backed out once the price tag reached at least half as much as it is today.

 

[jkrdevil]

I don't know if other people caught it, but if you follow Bettman at all then you know that his language is always chosen on purpose.

He may have said that the coyotes were made "inactive" almost a dozen times in this segment just now on Sportsnet. All this speculation that AM would have to pay back the billion dollars in an expansion fee maybe completely out the window. If the franchise is inactive then there isn't going to be an expansion. The franchise exists. The billion dollars that Smith paid the league for the team for all intents and purposes is the expansion fee.

Right now the NHL is 33 teams in it but only 32 that are active. Willing to bet that once the team comes back there's going to be a severely discounted fee involved that will be meant to simply cover logistics of activating team number 33 and hosting a player draft.

He never once said Arizona and expansion. That is such an important thing that most people are going to miss. No way is AM paying that 1b back to the league to reactivate the franchise, no chance.

He’s going to pay back the $1 billion he got because as you said that is the bill of the expansion fee that Smith paid to the league. Of the team restarts then that money needs to go back into the shared pot between the 32 owners like an expansion fee would.

Now that price to get back in will be locked into the amount he gets from that sale because he already paid into the league when he bought the Coyotes. The money he gets is basically an interest free loan in exchange for the hockey ops until the Phoenix arena situation gets solved. Of course if it doesn’t then it basically translations to being a straight team sale and the league can move forward with an expansion fee for someone else.

 

[GKJ]

Atlanta failed twice. The Nords lasted longer in QC than either the Flames or Thrashers did in Atlanta, in fact longer than those two combined.

Plus there is already an arena in QC.

Who is the owner?

 

[KevFu]

I can agree with your take. I was focusing more on the NBAPA union leadership having more power to negotiate their terms with the Owners than the NHLPA has shown. Agree the NHLPA may have done a better job of increasing paychecks for the middle and lower tiers of players where the NBAPA has favored the top tier of union members.

It's definitely an apples/oranges situation. I think the NBA union focuses more on "what we, the stars, get" like short-term conveniences, while I think the MLB/NHL unions focus more on "better structure for all players going forward." (And the MLB is between the NHL and NBA on that).

Like the NBA union easily gets player amenities like the kind of thing we're talking about here: Locker room minimums, hotels with weight rooms, allow pot... and the NBA owners gladly will like "make our arenas voting places for social rights reasons? SURE! Just don't come after our revenue!"


The NHLPA "lost" their way into a guaranteed percentage of revenue from the owners. That should automatically put the NHLPA near the top of the union rankings. While MLB fights like hell to avoid a salary cap, there's A LOT MORE teams like OAK, CIN, BAL, TB, CLE than there are LAD, NYY and NYM. If you put the NHL's CBA on baseball teams, like a $240m cap and $120m floor... the players would get a lot more money.

 

[mouser]

I don't expect the next CBA to be win/loss. The perception they lost the CBA battles are fine, but the fact they did is part of why the PA isn't the same PA it was even 2 years ago. It has been reported as well that Walsh did a lot behind scenes to get involved in this and push the move.

Regardless it is shortsighted to look at the players of today and suggest that they do not want more of a voice in things. All of them are trying to figure out how to monetarily maximize their careers more than ever before and at younger ages. Any option to do that will be something they will be more active in and people (agents) around them will push for them to be more active in for the betterment of their financial future.

The extreme apathy and willingness to follow shit leadership that resulted in those "losses" you referenced seems to have changed after the harsh impacts of escrow the last few years. Nothing seems to make people stand up and pay more attention than their paycheck...

I fully agree the players would like to have a say in these issues, as well as many other topics. My view is when the PA assembles their CBA negotiation priority list for 2026 that things like arena size or ways to “pressure” the NHL to increase HRR will either be:

(a) Far enough down the PA’s priority list to not be worth dying on that hill, and/or

(b) A hard No from the NHL or requests for concessions in return which aren’t worth the tradeoff for the PA.

 

[KevFu]

Markets aren't competing for teams. If you have a lot of people, an arena plan, and a billionaire offering the league a cheque with enough zeroes, the NHL will gladly sell a franchise to Atlanta, Quebec, Phoenix, Houston, San Diego, Portland, Oklahoma City, etc.

If you don't have a team, you lack at least one of those three.

 

[GuelphStormer]

I hear this is where the party's at. Hi everyone.

 

[rojac]

Atlanta failed twice. The Nords lasted longer in QC than either the Flames or Thrashers did in Atlanta, in fact longer than those two combined.

Plus there is already an arena in QC.

Atlanta Flames - 8 years (1972-1980)
Atlanta Thrashers - 12 years (1999-2011)
Total: 20 years

Quebec Athletic Club - 1 year (1919-1920)
Quebec Nordiques - 16 years (1979-1995)
Total: 17 years

I see no reason to count Quebec's seven years in the WHA when asking about NHL franchises.

 

[Voight]

If the history of the team is staying behind, NHL should do the right thing and transfer to pre 96 history to the current Jets.

 

[BKIslandersFan]

If the history of the team is staying behind, NHL should do the right thing and transfer to pre 96 history to the current Jets.

Agree.

If Meruelos does what he promises to do, this ultimately might have been the best for Yotes fans.

If not it is going to take longer, but I think they will eventually get a team back.

 

[LT]

Alex Meruelo: Coyotes’ failure in Arizona ‘starts from the beginning’

To quote:

"Meruelo clarified several times in his exclusive interview with Burns & Gambo that he still owns the team. The Coyotes are “inactive” and per the league agreement, he will have five years to reactivate the Coyotes if he is able to get an arena up and running within that window.

Meruelo states he never had any intentions to sell the team. He had a meeting with the NHL on March 6 and reiterated the lack of desire to sell before the league asked Meruelo if he can tell his players he knows when he can expect to have an arena built.

“I looked at them and stared and said, ‘No,'” Meruelo said.

“Look, I would say it really starts from the beginning,” Meruelo said. “There’s not one mistake. It starts from the beginning. They come here and play in Phoenix arena and there were so many obstructed views of seats that they had to relocate to Glendale.

Meruelo then admitted in arena negotiations he thought the other side was bluffing.

“I was kicked out of the (Glendale) arena,” he said. “They asked me to sign for 20 years and I said I wouldn’t do that and when I said no they said they would kick me out. I didn’t think they would do it and they did. They thought for sure I would never have enough time to relocate it to another city.”

As far as the permanent Tempe arena vote not passing, Meruelo offered his perspective on why that did not work.

“When the public does not understand and they believe all you gotta say it’s a billionaire tax, help or giving free money to a billionaire, they don’t go for it,” Meruelo said. “And even though it’s not true, I’m not asking for anything, I wasn’t asking for any tax abatements or help from the public — for whatever reason they didn’t understand that and didn’t accept it.”"

Source (Article/Audio): arizonasports.com/story/3546267/alex-meruelo-coyotes-failure-in-arizona-starts-from-the-beginning/

Yea this guy was never cut out to be an NHL owner

Nor will he ever be