OT: Could Bobby Orr still dominate in the league today?

[Strange Universe]

Gretzky was amazing but as someone who saw both Wayne and Orr's entire careers- and Gretzky pretty much every game he played in Boston live from the front row thanks to mommy and daddy - not even an argument. Orr was so superior.

But in fairness if I was 40 or younger and never saw Orr as he was playing his career I'd think more along the lines that Gretzky had to be as good or better or maybe Lemieux or even Messier for a time

I have to agree DKH,

There have been some great players over the last 50 years and I have no doubt in my mind that these same players that had all the natural talent, abilities pushed forward in today's game would still be as dominant in their own respective ways as they once were in their era.
Examples, M.Richard, Howe, B.Hull,M.Messier and others that were on a lower echelon of play from the ones stated above.
Bobby Orr, Wayne Gretzky,M.Lemieux,

The ones in bold have been discussed many times which is player is the superior one and as you stated above that having the opportunity to watch them play through the course of their careers(I have also as well), Orr would not be matched.
Orr is the greatest!!

 

[kytem2]

Espo had Orr.

Espo was a great player before Orr was racking up his big point totals:

1967-68
Phil Esposito 35 49 84
Bobby Orr 11 20 31

1968-69
Phil Esposito 49 77 126
Bobby Orr 21 43 64

 

[DKH]

Coffey was 39, in his 21st season when he played with the Bruins.
Phil Esposito was considered old at 33 when he was traded away, just to keep things in perspective.

Coffey is just a step down from Orr as the most offensively talented defenseman ever to play. There is no way that either would be putting up 100 point seasons in this era.

I was at the Bruin / Sen game on Thursday, and saw Karlsson make several astounding plays in the offensive zone, and he got nothing out of it because all they resulted in was a teammate receiving a pass only to be met by "waves" and "layers" of Bruins being ready to attack that player. There was no give and go opportunity available.

Coffey had Gretzky, Orr had Esposito, both Gretzky and Esposito were required in order for these crazy point totals to be put up.

Orr would go for 100 easy

Coffey was not close to Orr- you put Orr on Edmonton and he might have scored 240 points

just a guess but you never saw Orr play

to say Karlsson made an astounding play and say Coffey is a step below Orr might be the most ludicrous post since I been a member here

 

[Strange Universe]

Espo was a great player before Orr was racking up his big point totals:

1967-68
Phil Esposito 35 49 84
Bobby Orr 11 20 31

1968-69
Phil Esposito 49 77 126
Bobby Orr 21 43 64

Certainly Espo was a great player but Orr was the player that helped Espo achieve the crazy numbers that Espo racked up once Orr became the stellar D man he was.
Without Orr, Espo would not have reached the heights he did.
Bobby Orr made everyone around him that much better as stated by his own team mates.

 

[kytem2]

Orr would go for 100 easy

Coffey was not close to Orr- you put Orr on Edmonton and he might have scored 240 points

just a guess but you never saw Orr play

to say Karlsson made an astounding play and say Coffey is a step below Orr might be the most ludicrous post since I been a member here

Orr was great, but he played against vastly inferior competition.

Even looking at the Bruins' playoff runs in 1970 and 1972, they were lucky to run into the St. Louis Blues in both playoff years, winning each series 4-0, going 8-0 with 48 GF 15 GA. Literally every player on that team was an expansion castoff.

 

[RussellmaniaKW]

Paul Coffey was very close to being just as good as Bobby Orr. Just look at the top 10 in this list.

http://www.quanthockey.com/nhl/records/most-points-in-one-season-by-nhl-defensemen.html

lol classic ignorant post from a guy who likely saw neither guy play and is just going off stats he found from a 2 second google search

 

[jgatie]

Orr would go for 100 easy

Coffey was not close to Orr- you put Orr on Edmonton and he might have scored 240 points

just a guess but you never saw Orr play

to say Karlsson made an astounding play and say Coffey is a step below Orr might be the most ludicrous post since I been a member here

Do a search for 'overrated' posted by kytem2 and you will find the single most ludicrous post in the history of hockey discussions. This poster has a history of posting shtick that's only meant to rile up a fan base. His "Orr is overrated" nonsense is the silliest example of this moronic shtick. I agree with other posters that say he's just a bitter Habs fan.

 

[ReggieMoto]

Do a search for 'overrated' posted by kytem2 and you will find the single most ludicrous post in the history of hockey discussions. This poster has a history of posting shtick that's only meant to rile up a fan base. His "Orr is overrated" nonsense is the silliest example of this moronic shtick. I agree with other posters that say he's just a bitter Habs fan.

Not sure why people even feed into his crap. If they stopped he'd go away.

 

[Pie O My]

lol classic ignorant post from a guy who likely saw neither guy play and is just going off stats he found from a 2 second google search

sounds like my wife. "Says here Ray Bourque had twice as many points as Bobby Orr. So he was twice as good....right??"

 

[Fenway]

Orr reinvented the way the game was played and he had a young coach in Sinden that let him loose.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

Orr was great, but he played against vastly inferior competition.

Even looking at the Bruins' playoff runs in 1970 and 1972, they were lucky to run into the St. Louis Blues in both playoff years, winning each series 4-0, going 8-0 with 48 GF 15 GA. Literally every player on that team was an expansion castoff.

And 2 years later another expansion team won back-to-back Cups.

 

[David Thicke]

I was lucky enough to watched him play as well as the other greats like Gretzky, Lemieux, Howe and Hull. What a question!

If Orr played today, he would have better knees due to the operational procedures of today. His career would have spanned at least 18 years and his numbers would be beyond belief. It would be the first time that any sport could say easily one player had such dominance to be considered the greatest of all time. Orr was that great!

For those that never saw him play and see his stats, you have to remember that for most of his short career, Orr played one so-so knee and the other was ruined. This guy changed the game forever, offensively for defensemen but he also was excellent defensively. I can't remember him ever getting beaten one on one and was one of the best ever at puck retrieval. I once watched him at the old forum (Live) kill a 2 minute tripping penalty to Wayne Cashman all by himself. He had the puck from the face-off for the entire penalty. He played keep away from the Habs and they couldn't get it from him. He must have circled his net four or five times with two players chasing him but never getting the puck. He skated up the ice to attack then turned back with puck again. The habs as well as other teams tended to back up quickly when Orr started to rush up ice because he would look like he wasn't moving then he just plain blew past the opposition. The Habs, at the time had one of the best power plays but they looked like a bunch of five year olds chasing their dad around after the puck. Orr completely dominated them and again all on one knee.

So even as a Habs fan with all of our great defensemen and players, when ask who I think is the greatest ever to play the game between Gretzky, Howe, Lemieux and Orr, without any hesitation my answer without a doubt the great Babby Orr. He is the only one who should be mentioned as a great in my opinion!

Good Luck in the playoffs as I know you guys are going to make it! I am amazed at how well the Bruins have done despite all the injuries this season. Any other team (Columbus) would have been long out of the race. I never doubted the Bruins would come, just too proud of a franchise to quit. Other teams in the east should fear the Bruins as the playoffs means a whole new season from scratch and the Bruins will be completely healthy and pretty rest as well. The NHL playoffs are only the best when the Bruins and Habs meet but hopeful only in the later rounds. The NHL playoffs are so boring for me after a Bruins vs Habs series. The passion is all gone and the other series seem to pale in comparison to ours.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

I was lucky enough to watched him play as well as the other greats like Gretzky, Lemieux, Howe and Hull. What a question!

If Orr played today, he would have better knees due to the operational procedures of today. His career would have spanned at least 18 years and his numbers would be beyond belief. It would be the first time that any sport could say easily one player had such dominance to be considered the greatest of all time. Orr was that great!

For those that never saw him play and see his stats, you have to remember that for most of his short career, Orr played one so-so knee and the other was ruined. This guy changed the game forever, offensively for defensemen but he also was excellent defensively. I can't remember him ever getting beaten one on one and was one of the best ever at puck retrieval. I once watched him at the old forum (Live) kill a 2 minute tripping penalty to Wayne Cashman all by himself. He had the puck from the face-off for the entire penalty. He played keep away from the Habs and they couldn't get it from him. He must have circled his net four or five times with two players chasing him but never getting the puck. He skated up the ice to attack then turned back with puck again. The habs as well as other teams tended to back up quickly when Orr started to rush up ice because he would look like he wasn't moving then he just plain blew past the opposition. The Habs, at the time had one of the best power plays but they looked like a bunch of five year olds chasing their dad around after the puck. Orr completely dominated them and again all on one knee.

So even as a Habs fan with all of our great defensemen and players, when ask who I think is the greatest ever to play the game between Gretzky, Howe, Lemieux and Orr, without any hesitation my answer without a doubt the great Babby Orr. He is the only one who should be mentioned as a great in my opinion!

Good Luck in the playoffs as I know you guys are going to make it! I am amazed at how well the Bruins have done despite all the injuries this season. Any other team (Columbus) would have been long out of the race. I never doubted the Bruins would come, just too proud of a franchise to quit. Other teams in the east should fear the Bruins as the playoffs means a whole new season from scratch and the Bruins will be completely healthy and pretty rest as well. The NHL playoffs are only the best when the Bruins and Habs meet but hopeful only in the later rounds. The NHL playoffs are so boring for me after a Bruins vs Habs series. The passion is all gone and the other series seem to pale in comparison to ours.

Thanks for this post!

That's also what I remember best about Orr, his instant acceleration. He used it not only to blow by defenders, but also to burst to the puck defensively. No one I ever saw play the game stood out as "above the rest" as Orr did.

 

[David Thicke]

Orr was great, but he played against vastly inferior competition.

Even looking at the Bruins' playoff runs in 1970 and 1972, they were lucky to run into the St. Louis Blues in both playoff years, winning each series 4-0, going 8-0 with 48 GF 15 GA. Literally every player on that team was an expansion castoff.

Gretzky, Lemieux and Coffey played in an even bigger watered down expansion era with inferior defensive play. It was the open ice, run and gun all out attack offensively and has the highest goal production in the history of the NHL.

 

[Fenway]

The players Orr played against talk about him

 

[DKH]

I was lucky enough to watched him play as well as the other greats like Gretzky, Lemieux, Howe and Hull. What a question!

If Orr played today, he would have better knees due to the operational procedures of today. His career would have spanned at least 18 years and his numbers would be beyond belief. It would be the first time that any sport could say easily one player had such dominance to be considered the greatest of all time. Orr was that great!

For those that never saw him play and see his stats, you have to remember that for most of his short career, Orr played one so-so knee and the other was ruined. This guy changed the game forever, offensively for defensemen but he also was excellent defensively. I can't remember him ever getting beaten one on one and was one of the best ever at puck retrieval. I once watched him at the old forum (Live) kill a 2 minute tripping penalty to Wayne Cashman all by himself. He had the puck from the face-off for the entire penalty. He played keep away from the Habs and they couldn't get it from him. He must have circled his net four or five times with two players chasing him but never getting the puck. He skated up the ice to attack then turned back with puck again. The habs as well as other teams tended to back up quickly when Orr started to rush up ice because he would look like he wasn't moving then he just plain blew past the opposition. The Habs, at the time had one of the best power plays but they looked like a bunch of five year olds chasing their dad around after the puck. Orr completely dominated them and again all on one knee.

So even as a Habs fan with all of our great defensemen and players, when ask who I think is the greatest ever to play the game between Gretzky, Howe, Lemieux and Orr, without any hesitation my answer without a doubt the great Babby Orr. He is the only one who should be mentioned as a great in my opinion!

Good Luck in the playoffs as I know you guys are going to make it! I am amazed at how well the Bruins have done despite all the injuries this season. Any other team (Columbus) would have been long out of the race. I never doubted the Bruins would come, just too proud of a franchise to quit. Other teams in the east should fear the Bruins as the playoffs means a whole new season from scratch and the Bruins will be completely healthy and pretty rest as well. The NHL playoffs are only the best when the Bruins and Habs meet but hopeful only in the later rounds. The NHL playoffs are so boring for me after a Bruins vs Habs series. The passion is all gone and the other series seem to pale in comparison to ours.

Outstanding post

My favorite story was Fred Shero telling his Broad Street Bullies not to get caught up watching Orr that if you want to watch him buy a ticket'

 

[Fenway]

I will never forget the day the pinball arcade under the old Garden brought in this machine and it was destroyed by fans in less than 12 hours.

In 1992 Bob Lobel conducted his most famous interview and the respect that Ted Williams and Larry Bird showed Orr was obvious.

 

[BobbyAwe]

Orr was great, but he played against vastly inferior competition.

Even looking at the Bruins' playoff runs in 1970 and 1972, they were lucky to run into the St. Louis Blues in both playoff years, winning each series 4-0, going 8-0 with 48 GF 15 GA. Literally every player on that team was an expansion castoff.

And in that playoff run (1969-70) they first beat the Rangers 4 games to 2, and swept the Blackhawks - the Blackhawks with Tony Esposito, Stan Mikita, Bobby and Dennis Hull, Jim Pappin, Doug Mohns, Pit Martin, et al. It wasn't the Bruins fault that there was nothing but expansion teams in the other division for the final.

 

[bobbyorr04]

The players Orr played against talk about him

Thanks for posting this video.

I've seen it before, but it was nice to see it again.

A must see video!

 

[DominicT]

Orr reinvented the way the game was played and he had a young coach in Sinden that let him loose.

Have to respectfully disagree with this. The younger generations doesn't really know this, but for those that were around to witness it:

Doug Harvey reinvented the way defensemen play the game. Really was the first dominant offensive d-man.

Bobby Orr just perfected it.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

Have to respectfully disagree with this. The younger generations doesn't really know this, but for those that were around to witness it:

Doug Harvey reinvented the way defensemen play the game. Really was the first dominant offensive d-man.

Bobby Orr just perfected it.

And Red Kelly, who actually started a little earlier than Harvey.

Also, when Orr broke in as an 18 year-old he wasn't flying all over the ice like we see now in the videos. He learned to play in his own end first.