Coach Willie Desjardins Thread Part IV

[thepuckmonster]

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[vancityluongo]

Honest question for everyone who thinks he is a complete idiot:

With all this lack of knowledge of how to coach hockey, is it just luck that he was won a championship at every level he has coached?

First off, there's a huge difference between coaching 16-18 year olds and 18-40 year old players.

Willie's 1-2-3-4 in the playoffs last season makes perfect sense in junior. After a long grind (where you don't fly, but bus between games), you need to keep everyone fresh at that level. Even the superstar players in the Dub don't have anywhere near the endurance levels that players like the Sedins have.

Similarly, there are definitely times to shorten the bench in the regular season when up a goal or two. That's when it's important to play your Shinkaruk's and Virtanen's big minutes while keeping your Mackenze Stewart's stapled to the bench. Guessing Willie must have did that very well at different levels. Here? Not so much.

We've gone from Torts keeping capable fourth liners like Weise stapled on the bench and riding the Sedins into the ground to a guy who is doing the exact opposite, but also benching the kids. Sure, there are other factors that we don't know about (maybe behind the scenes Henrik is asking to only play 15 minutes a game?) but I imagine this is the gist of what people would expect:

Sedin-Sedin-Vrbata (18-21 minutes)
Burrows-Horvat-Sutter (16-19 minutes)
Baertschi-McCann-Hansen (13-15 minutes)
Prust-Cracknell-Dorsett (10-12 minutes)

Contrast that with the ice-times last night and it's a bit out of the range of expected times for a competent coach. Torts has won a Stanley Cup, so does that automatically make it a good idea to play the Sedins 26 minutes a game?

 

[Jyrki21]

Honest question for everyone who thinks he is a complete idiot:

With all this lack of knowledge of how to coach hockey, is it just luck that he was won a championship at every level he has coached?

Either yes, it is just the roster he's been handed (in junior and in the AHL, the quality of teams varies a lot more than in a capped top-tier league), or else, more probably, his other strengths have been able to make up for his shortcomings to date. In a capped league without an inch to give, screwing up something basic like bench management can torpedo your season (or playoffs, to take last year's example). There is no excuse for handicapping yourself in the NHL. He's probably an adequate "Xs and O's coach" (I wouldn't know), and as I've said before there are things he does that I've really liked, like shooting for empty nets from a distance. But swinging wildly from one error to the next in bench management really makes me question his capability.

 

[VanJack]

Regardless of what happens the rest of the way, seeing more and more evidence the 'Nucks are likely to change coaches after this season....if you're going to embrace a rebuild on the fly with young kids they have to play, even if it costs you games....you can't continue to park them on the bench for third periods and then play the vets until their tongues hang out, and then lose anyway.

 

[PG Canuck]

The sooner WD is gone, the better. Simply put.

 

[WTG]

The sooner WD is gone, the better. Simply put.

Agreed, the guy does not know how to develop players in the NHL.

Canucks need a new coach who can develop the young players and does not have a huge amount of pressure on him to win games.

This canucks core is donezos, time to develop the new one.

 

[The Jesus*]

#teambenchthekids

 

[PG Canuck]

Agreed, the guy does not know how to develop players in the NHL.

Canucks need a new coach who can develop the young players and does not have a huge amount of pressure on him to win games.

This canucks core is donezos, time to develop the new one.

Aquaman needs to bite to bullet and realize this. Once he does, we can can WillieD and get a coach willing to help develop our future.

 

[racerjoe]

The sooner WD is gone, the better. Simply put.

I disagree, I think we are missing the playoffs, and if we miss I would rather miss big. Send the kids back to junior, and let Willie take care of the rest.

 

[Balls Mahoney]

I don't mind Desjardins this season, he's the key to our getting a top ten pick. This squad is better than we all thought they'd be but thankfully Willie is just a terrible coach.

 

[PG Canuck]

I disagree, I think we are missing the playoffs, and if we miss I would rather miss big. Send the kids back to junior, and let Willie take care of the rest.

True. Captain Tanker.

 

[vanuck]

Free Willie. Literally.

 

[CanaFan]

From Ed Willes today:

http://www.theprovince.com/touch/story.html?id=11466060

Yes, it’s early and these issues will resolve themselves in time. But, right now, the four kids represent a third of the Canucks’ forward group along and they’re leaving a hole in the team’s lineup. If you want to learn if McCann, Baertschi and Virtanen can play in the NHL, you’re not going to find out by playing them six to eight minutes a night. The organization has to decide if they’re committed to this program or move on with a largely veteran team.

They can't have it both ways.

Pretty much nails it.

 

[arsmaster*]

He's running his bench like torts did.

 

[Fat Tony]

I recommend he not charge the opposing team's locker room until his hip is 100%.

 

[Jack Tripper]

I don't mind Desjardins this season, he's the key to our getting a top ten pick. This squad is better than we all thought they'd be but thankfully Willie is just a terrible coach.

he's not, though

he's a good coach for a team with aging veterans if the goal is to merely challenge for a playoff spot, because he won't overplay the top players and will distribute minutes equally to grinders and scrubs to keep everybody "fresh" (as long as they either played in medicine hat or have a few years of nhl experience to "fall back on", as he says)

the problem is that most canuck fans don't want to be the calgary flames circa 2011, and linden and benning didn't sell canucks fans on a season of giving the sedins one last chance of fighting for a playoff spot...they sold it as a 'rebuild on the fly' experience with guys like virtanen and mccann symbolizing this renewal

virtanen and mccann are just a distraction at this point because it's 100% obvious the coach had no input on their inclusion on the team, and he's shown he's stubborn enough not to change his mind on their limited minutes deployment

 

[Jyrki21]

Free Willie. Literally.

 

[Frostage]

Willie D makes me appreciate Carl Robinson all the more.

 

[WTG]

Let's talk about the deployment of Ben Hutton and how it's stupid.

Why are we giving our OFD 37.3 % ozone starts

Ben Hutton gets the most defensive zone starts out of any defenseman on the team. WTF is up with that.

 

[mathonwy]

he's not, though

he's a good coach for a team with aging veterans if the goal is to merely challenge for a playoff spot, because he won't overplay the top players and will distribute minutes equally to grinders and scrubs to keep everybody "fresh" (as long as they either played in medicine hat or have a few years of nhl experience to "fall back on", as he says)

the problem is that most canuck fans don't want to be the calgary flames circa 2011, and linden and benning didn't sell canucks fans on a season of giving the sedins one last chance of fighting for a playoff spot...they sold it as a 'rebuild on the fly' experience with guys like virtanen and mccann symbolizing this renewal

virtanen and mccann are just a distraction at this point because it's 100% obvious the coach had no input on their inclusion on the team, and he's shown he's stubborn enough not to change his mind on their limited minutes deployment

What's really effed about it all is that we have zero cap room to do anything about it.

There is equal culpability on all sides. WD should have grown a pair of balls in the off season and JB... well... JB is Francesco's fault.

The buck stops with Francesco and if Francesco had been a bit more hockey savvy, he would have realized how outdated the Boston model was (and how full of crap JB was).

C'est la vie.

 

[corona]

Let's talk about the deployment of Ben Hutton and how it's stupid.

Why are we giving our OFD 37.3 % ozone starts

Ben Hutton gets the most defensive zone starts out of any defenseman on the team. WTF is up with that.

Going to play Devil's advocate here and say maybe it's 'cause he plays primarily with Sbisa (one of our "defensive" d-men) and because Hutton is very good at breaking out of our own zone? Dunno.

Desjardins to me is clearly in over his head. On a game by game basis he is out coached by his peers too frequently for my liking. But, he did show more faith in McCann last game. He deployed Jared for 5ish shifts in the 3rd period (up from zero in the game prior), and this was with McCann giving the puck away badly at least twice without getting benched afterwards. That to me shows some progress.

 

[geebaan]

Going to play Devil's advocate here and say maybe it's 'cause he plays primarily with Sbisa (one of our "defensive" d-men) and because Hutton is very good at breaking out of our own zone? Dunno.

Desjardins to me is clearly in over his head. On a game by game basis he is out coached by his peers too frequently for my liking. But, he did show more faith in McCann last game. He deployed Jared for 5ish shifts in the 3rd period (up from zero in the game prior), and this was with McCann giving the puck away badly at least twice without getting benched afterwards. That to me shows some progress.

Saying sbisa is one of our best defensive d man is one hell of a stretch, and further shows his ineptitude

 

[Hyzer]

at this point i would love to trade minor assets and players like hamhuis and vrbata for former medicine hat tigers that can grind it out but lack skill so we can have 4 fourth lines..

easiest way to austin matthews i can think of. get it done benning

 

[racerjoe]

He's running his bench like torts did.

At least there was a method to Torts madness. He would leaning heavy on the twins, Kesler and who ever else was going. Willie just seems to lean heavy on who ever is older that 25.

 

[Havre]

I had us second to last in the West - I might have been too optimistic.

As others have pointed out it might be a blessing in disguise. With someone like Matthews our prospect pool would all of a sudden look extremely strong (at least among forwards).