Clock reset on a Miller move?

[haseoke39]

Two things that I'm pretty damned sure of:

(1) Ryan Miller is not re-signing.
(2) Dealing Ryan Miller will be a lot harder than dealing a forward or defenseman, especially if you wait until the trade deadline, when teams either have a #1 or they aren't buyers at all.

Two things that I strongly suspect:

(1) Darcy Regier has been asking the sun and the moon. A rumor out yesterday pegged the asking price at two firsts and a second. I find this plausible based on what we saw with Vanek: Moulson + 1st was one of the reported offers earlier this summer and Darcy held out for the extra 2nd.
(2) Everyone Darcy could call and explore deals with was probably called over the summer and negotiations exhausted. The lines were probably dead on that front when he was fired. His plan was likely to wait for someone to have an emergency - which may never have happened.

With new blood in the front office, a new set of negotiations might be possible. My first need out of this new regime is to move Miller quickly - preferably within 30 days. That way you can stress improving the team's play with Nolan on board while knowing the tank won't be jeopardized.

Who should Patty be on the phone with? Florida? St. Louis?

Click to read more...

 

[fing0rz]

Miller resigning is a possibility. A much higher one now then yesterday.

 

[enthusiast]

I don't think your sureties are that set in stone at all, honestly.

 

[haseoke39]

Miller resigning is a possibility. A much higher one now then yesterday.

Why?

 

[enthusiast]

Why?

I don't necessarily agree but I could see the argument being made that a true fresh start could wipe away Miller's malaise with the organization and its spiral

 

[haseoke39]

I don't necessarily agree but I could see the argument being made that a true fresh start could wipe away Miller's malaise with the organization and its spiral

Anyone can make an argument. Making a persuasive argument is what counts.

Miller's still a top flight goalie in his late prime in an organization that has all but promised the world it won't be contending for several years. Terry Pegula rung in the new era this morning by going on the radio and announcing they want the #1 pick. Ryan sold his house this summer. He's refused to engage in contract talks heretofore. This is not advanced math. Just because he hasn't come out to the media and said "I'm leaving for UFA" doesn't mean you can just ignore the writing on the wall.

 

[Moskau]

If a deal comes along that is too good to pass up I'm sure they'll take it. But I think in the meantime they will respect Ryan and wait until the Olympics are over before they pursue shopping him more.

 

[haseoke39]

If a deal comes along that is too good to pass up I'm sure they'll take it. But I think in the meantime they will respect Ryan and wait until the Olympics are over before they pursue shopping him more.

What does that have to do with respecting Ryan? Are you assuming he's asked not to be moved until the trade deadline? I see no reason to think that. I would assume, on the contrary, that the sooner you could get him on a playoff team, the happier he'd be.

 

[Moskau]

What does that have to do with respecting Ryan? Are you assuming he's asked not to be moved until the trade deadline? I see no reason to think that. I would assume, on the contrary, that the sooner you could get him on a playoff team, the happier he'd be.

What playoff teams are looking for a goaltender?

By going to him and telling him he wont be traded before the Olympics it takes a load off of him. He mentioned today that the Olympics are his biggest focus right now. That's pretty telling.

 

[haseoke39]

What playoff teams are looking for a goaltender?

By going to him and telling him he wont be traded before the Olympics it takes a load off of him. He mentioned today that the Olympics are his biggest focus right now. That's pretty telling.

Yeah, and Miller would probably be a much stronger candidate for the starting job if he played for a team that could keep the puck out of its own net. That knife cuts both ways. I don't find it persuasive to assume Miller would be consumed by stress if he were being actively shopped. He already knows he's on the block. He's known since the Pominville deal that any time a team called up with an offer, the Sabres would have to entertain it. What does he care whether it's the Sabres being proactive about getting a deal done or just waiting for one to come to them? Either way, he could move any day.

And what exactly is telling about Miller thinking the Olympics are his biggest focus? You know who says that? A player who's mentally checked out on his NHL team. That's the biggest message there. Any other player on a decent team tells you they're focused on making the playoffs.

 

[Yatzhee]

I agree with haseoke39.
Miller isn't re-signing in Buffalo. The writing is on the wall here, it will take 2 to 3 years to get a competitive playoff product again, and that's at the minimum time frame. I don't see Miller sticking around either, get what can be had for him and move along with the rebuilding process.

EDIT: Oh, and by the way, Miller hasn't purchased a new home in Buffalo since selling his last one. That should be one of many indicators he's not sticking around.

 

[enthusiast]

Anyone can make an argument. Making a persuasive argument is what counts.

there's no need to be pedantic mate, assume the people you're talking with are at least as smart as you are and your discussions will become a magical adventure

 

[dire wolf]

My fear is that, barring injury, there may be no market at all for Miller.

 

[gallagt01]

My fear is that, barring injury, there may be no market at all for Miller.

That's a very possible scenario, and in my opinion, the likeliest one.

If Miller isn't moved because the market is bare, fine. There's no doubt that July 1, 2007 left management (and fans) skeptical of not trading UFAs-to-be. Buffalo has moved every major UFA in trade since Drury and Briere split. But it's going to happen from time to time.

 

[jBuds]

Patty should be on the phone with candidates. Not other GMs

 

[Sabre Dance]

I think his value is almost dead.

I dont want the Sabres to sign Miller to a long-term deal. Maybe 2-3 years if he is willing.

 

[Djp]

Miller does have value.....he is a proven NHL starting goalie who would be a difference maker if teams were trying to make the playoffs or advance farther in the playoffs.

Darcy talked trades in the summer but said he was going to wait until early season (roughly December to then make trades)

The quote by Kyprios made last night on TV said roughly "the asking price for Miller wasas high as 2 1sts and a 2nd"

Was that really what was asked for ---probably not...but it likely had conditions attached to it such as:

Miller for a 2nd/B prospect + 2nd (that turned in to a 1st based on playoff making/advancement) + conditional 2nd/1st on resigning (compensation tied to contract length)

For example a playoff team like St Louis offers a 2nd but if they advance to the conference finals(thus pick is 27-30) then its a 1st.If they sign him to a 3 yr extension its a 2nd but a 4 yr or longer it becomes a 1st.

St Louis, colorado, Washington, Tampa Bay, Dallas, Anaheim, Nashville, Edmonton, and Winnipeg are all teams that could trade for him.

 

[Sabre Dance]

Miller does have value.....he is a proven NHL starting goalie who would be a difference maker if teams were trying to make the playoffs or advance farther in the playoffs.

Darcy talked trades in the summer but said he was going to wait until early season (roughly December to then make trades)

The quote by Kyprios made last night on TV said roughly "the asking price for Miller wasas high as 2 1sts and a 2nd"

Was that really what was asked for ---probably not...but it likely had conditions attached to it such as:

Miller for a 2nd/B prospect + 2nd (that turned in to a 1st based on playoff making/advancement) + conditional 2nd/1st on resigning (compensation tied to contract length)

For example a playoff team like St Louis offers a 2nd but if they advance to the conference finals(thus pick is 27-30) then its a 1st.If they sign him to a 3 yr extension its a 2nd but a 4 yr or longer it becomes a 1st.

St Louis, colorado, Washington, Tampa Bay, Dallas, Anaheim, Nashville, Edmonton, and Winnipeg are all teams that could trade for him.

I want Darcy to sell my house. Anyone know his number?

 

[dire wolf]

St Louis, colorado, Washington, Tampa Bay, Dallas, Anaheim, Nashville, Edmonton, and Winnipeg are all teams that could trade for him.

Really? I'm not sure why you picked a bunch of teams that have the hottest goalies right now.

St. Louis has Halak (9-2-2, 2.25GAA, .909SVS)
Colorado has Varlamov (9-2-2, 2.01, .936 - unless you think he's going to jail)
Washington has Holtby (.920 SVS)
Tampa has Bishop (12-2-0, 2.02, .930)
Dallas has Lehtonen (2.18, .928)
Anaheim has Hiller and, even better recently Anderson (6-1-0, 1.66, .943)
Nashville has Pekka Rinne (2.31, .917)


That leaves only Edmonton and Winnipeg as viable on your list. I'd add NYI.

 

[haseoke39]

St Louis, colorado, Washington, Tampa Bay, Dallas, Anaheim, Nashville, Edmonton, and Winnipeg are all teams that could trade for him.

Of those teams, I think all but St. Louis, Washington and Edmonton are very unlikely.

Washington only because Holtby isn't a world beater and the franchise may feel pressure to really put on a run to get the monkey off their back.

St. Louis has been talked about all summer and not much has changed there. I think that's where he ends up going, but Darcy probably had far too high of a request on the table.

Edmonton is the most obvious destination, but I suspect Miller has vetoed the move.

Conceivably, there could be a lot of pressure in the Winnipeg front office to make a run, and then they'd be interested, but I doubt it. Some of the other teams you listed are getting great goaltending, and Nashville has no business even considering a trade to tide them over a month or so.

 

[haseoke39]

Really? I'm not sure why you picked a bunch of teams that have the hottest goalies right now.

St. Louis has Halak (9-2-2, 2.25GAA, .909SVS)
Colorado has Varlamov (9-2-2, 2.01, .936 - unless you think he's going to jail)
Washington has Holtby (.920 SVS)
Tampa has Bishop (12-2-0, 2.02, .930)
Dallas has Lehtonen (2.18, .928)
Anaheim has Hiller and, even better recently Anderson (6-1-0, 1.66, .943)
Nashville has Pekka Rinne (2.31, .917)


That leaves only Edmonton and Winnipeg as viable on your list. I'd add NYI.

Halak is doing fine through 13 games, but you just have to look back over his last few years to understand the rumors that St. Louis isn't comfortable riding him all the way. St. Louis' defense inflates his stats, too.

I could see the Caps sitting pat with Holtby, but I could also see them biting the bullet and trying to strengthen their goaltending for a run. It's plausible.

I'd say NYI is on the list, but what do they have left that we'd want? And would Snow even consider coming back for a second fleecing? If there was an offer for Miller from NYI and Darcy turned it down, that would be the real shame, because anyone would take Vanek. Gutting your best potential destination for Miller to get a little sweetener on Vanek would have been shortsighted.

 

[sabresEH]

Really? I'm not sure why you picked a bunch of teams that have the hottest goalies right now.

St. Louis has Halak (9-2-2, 2.25GAA, .909SVS)
Colorado has Varlamov (9-2-2, 2.01, .936 - unless you think he's going to jail)
Washington has Holtby (.920 SVS)
Tampa has Bishop (12-2-0, 2.02, .930)
Dallas has Lehtonen (2.18, .928)
Anaheim has Hiller and, even better recently Anderson (6-1-0, 1.66, .943)
Nashville has Pekka Rinne (2.31, .917)


That leaves only Edmonton and Winnipeg as viable on your list. I'd add NYI.

St.Louis also knows that Halak has never really played a full season(57 games in 2010-11) and is fragile(won't say injury prone, as sometimes its just fatigue). St.Louis will definitely be interested in Miller at the deadline(for the right price) for insurance but if Halak is injured than Buffalo can ask for more.

 

[BuiltTagonTough]

I don't know if I buy Miller now wanting to stay. But if he is I'd sign him to a short deal. Give him a bit of time to see if the rebuild takes shape, and we can still trade him if need be.

 

[haseoke39]

Ottawa could be plausible if Anderson continues to struggle. They might be comfortable leaning on 22 year old Lehner, they might not. That's one of those things that might open up in another month. Or it might not, and you might run the risk that St. Louis gets more comfortable with Halak. If there's a reasonable offer out there, I think you've got to take it now. Birds in the hand, you know.

Really, I would take a late first from St. Louis if it's available and call it a day.

 

[Jim Bob]

Who should Patty be on the phone with? Florida? St. Louis?

Florida has so many goalies that they sent Markstrom to the AHL.

Elliott & Halak have been OK this season and it would surprise me if the Blues wanted to make a big move at that spot.

I think the only way there is a market for Miller is if Quick's LBI or Rinne's health issues drive a team to make a patch move in goal.