Proposal: Chris Kreider

[AIexisLafreniereNYR]

If the Rangers do indeed get eliminated in the first round. I think if the Rangers make any move, it’s to capitalize on Chris Kreider’s trade value. Putting Alexis Lafreniere on the first line is crucial since his game is seriously taking the next step.

Not that he won’t score 50+ again, but 3/4 seasons he would’ve score 30-40 and missed games due to Covid shortened seasons.

Plus the Rangers will have to shred salary very soon.

Would it be wise for the Rangers to let go, and if so, what would his value he?

Click to read more...

 

[Djp]

He won’t score 40 again. he had a severe outlier season on the PP.

He has 5 full years left. I don’t see many takers on this. He has a high bonus starting next year. And then after that he’s below his cap hit…

but it’s 5 yrs. Every team in the league has a plan to be a playoff team in 4 yrs and don’t want dead weight then.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Chris Kreiders NMC becomes a Mod-NTC after another 2 years. You're stuck with him until the last 2 years of his deal.

 

[seabass45]

Feels like a sequel to the Trouba trade threads (also full NMC, not going anywhere).

 

[bernmeister]

If the Rangers do indeed get eliminated in the first round. I think if the Rangers make any move, it’s to capitalize on Chris Kreider’s trade value. Putting Alexis Lafreniere on the first line is crucial since his game is seriously taking the next step.

Not that he won’t score 50+ again, but 3/4 seasons he would’ve score 30-40 and missed games due to Covid shortened seasons.

Plus the Rangers will have to shred salary very soon.

Would it be wise for the Rangers to let go, and if so, what would his value he?

I disagree w/most of this.
CK has earned all of his 6+m incl in this p'o. Even if this is a career year, he ages well and stll brings a beast factor others don't.

As to immediate concerns, Zib + bread delivered in the season, but not now.
Trouba is overpaid by 1.5-2m, these are the 3 we are married to that are gonna suck the roster flexibility life out of the team, not CK.
There is the hope we can bribe Trouba to waive sooner than his 2 seasons hence end of nmc, Panarin we got the best of, should deal if/when he is open to that. (He's special, but irregular cap situation this yr w/Zib + fox new deals not kicking in til next season spoiled us. We can't afford splurge of him + Zib who is not waiving anytime soon.)

Longer term, we need to not only keep what we have but add 1. Vatrano and 2. if possible Copp.
It is given that moving on from Strome, Nemeth, Hajek + Geo + recovery of Hank 1.5 = 11ish m needed to offset Zib + Fox increases.

Lindy for picks = a cap casualty; recovering his 3m + 1m increase in cap = 4m which = Vatrano $.
Blais will have to stay on IR for the moment.
Reaves will have to retire for a year-ish, take a FO job, then unretire as Trouba exits.

Those getting rfa deals will have to take tiny short term bridges, but they do, seeing light at the end of the tunnel.

We will briefly go w/min depth and skin every nickel.

LaF I can see to Montreal.
It won't be for 1OA, but they will have to seriously consider adding him to Wright.

There is reasonable hope, no guarantee, that LaF turns into the hyped 'best 1OA not a generational player since Nate MacKinnon'. The first key is less where he plays/what line, who with, but rather his skating, which has been NHL subpar, but to which there is visible marked improvement = increased production even this season. We estimate he will be skating sufficiently as of mid next season.

So w/need for cap, there is added impetus to consider moving LaF, but that is not a sacrifice situation where we have to give him away.
The middle ground here is a acceptable down payment of picks + considerations, plus CONDITIONAL picks that do not kick in unless/if LaF stars.

This would be like:
a core of
Mon 2022 2nd + 2023 1st [top 3 protected] + Barron .925 elc + NYR 2022 4th
for
LaF .925 elc + Nemeth (2.5 x 2) + Geo rfa rights

in addition is the part 2 supplemental
if LaF scores min 30 goals in 2023, then NYR 2023 3rd for MON 2024 1st
if LaF scores min 35 goals in 2024, then NYR 2024 3rd for MON 2025 1st
if LaF scores min 40 goals in 2025, then NYR 2025 3rd for MON 2026 1st

none of these ^ apply unless LaF hits those targets.
That's a lot, but for a 1OA with huge upside emerging, it is not unreasonable.

NY can short term play Fox at LD, also Nils L.
Deal Jones. Add Robertson to LD
so short term RD = Trouba, Schneider, Barron; when Trouba goes Fox can slide back or Nils L to 3RD, his natural side.
LD now = Fox, KAM, Robertson/Nils L. Scanlin is the big add in the pipeline.

ny recovers Nemeth cap, Geo a freebie not gonna be here.
Rangers get actual/potential value in picks [again, helps w/cap] commensurate to LaF actual production.

Fair + win win all around

That is more likely, not CK outta here.

 

[Captain Mountain]

I disagree w/most of this.
CK has earned all of his 6+m incl in this p'o. Even if this is a career year, he ages well and stll brings a beast factor others don't.

As to immediate concerns, Zib + bread delivered in the season, but not now.
Trouba is overpaid by 1.5-2m, these are the 3 we are married to that are gonna suck the roster flexibility life out of the team, not CK.
There is the hope we can bribe Trouba to waive sooner than his 2 seasons hence end of nmc, Panarin we got the best of, should deal if/when he is open to that. (He's special, but irregular cap situation this yr w/Zib + fox new deals not kicking in til next season spoiled us. We can't afford splurge of him + Zib who is not waiving anytime soon.)

Longer term, we need to not only keep what we have but add 1. Vatrano and 2. if possible Copp.
It is given that moving on from Strome, Nemeth, Hajek + Geo + recovery of Hank 1.5 = 11ish m needed to offset Zib + Fox increases.

Lindy for picks = a cap casualty; recovering his 3m + 1m increase in cap = 4m which = Vatrano $.
Blais will have to stay on IR for the moment.
Reaves will have to retire for a year-ish, take a FO job, then unretire as Trouba exits.

Those getting rfa deals will have to take tiny short term bridges, but they do, seeing light at the end of the tunnel.

We will briefly go w/min depth and skin every nickel.

LaF I can see to Montreal.
It won't be for 1OA, but they will have to seriously consider adding him to Wright.

There is reasonable hope, no guarantee, that LaF turns into the hyped 'best 1OA not a generational player since Nate MacKinnon'. The first key is less where he plays/what line, who with, but rather his skating, which has been NHL subpar, but to which there is visible marked improvement = increased production even this season. We estimate he will be skating sufficiently as of mid next season.

So w/need for cap, there is added impetus to consider moving LaF, but that is not a sacrifice situation where we have to give him away.
The middle ground here is a acceptable down payment of picks + considerations, plus CONDITIONAL picks that do not kick in unless/if LaF stars.

This would be like:
a core of
Mon 2022 2nd + 2023 1st [top 3 protected] + Barron .925 elc + NYR 2022 4th
for
LaF .925 elc + Nemeth (2.5 x 2) + Geo rfa rights

in addition is the part 2 supplemental
if LaF scores min 30 goals in 2023, then NYR 2023 3rd for MON 2024 1st
if LaF scores min 35 goals in 2024, then NYR 2024 3rd for MON 2025 1st
if LaF scores min 40 goals in 2025, then NYR 2025 3rd for MON 2026 1st

none of these ^ apply unless LaF hits those targets.
That's a lot, but for a 1OA with huge upside emerging, it is not unreasonable.

NY can short term play Fox at LD, also Nils L.
Deal Jones. Add Robertson to LD
so short term RD = Trouba, Schneider, Barron; when Trouba goes Fox can slide back or Nils L to 3RD, his natural side.
LD now = Fox, KAM, Robertson/Nils L. Scanlin is the big add in the pipeline.

ny recovers Nemeth cap, Geo a freebie not gonna be here.
Rangers get actual/potential value in picks [again, helps w/cap] commensurate to LaF actual production.

Fair + win win all around

That is more likely, not CK outta here.

Not only can you not have production conditions, but that is a terrible trade for Montreal.

Montreal is going to trade the 33rd OA pick, a likely top-5/10 2023 pick and a RD prospect that Montreal really wanted/needed for a former 1st OA pick trending behind basically every 1st OA pick after two seasons since Patrik Stefan, a terrible D-man with a bad contract and goalie they can't even pay right now?

If you spent even an ounce of time over-analyzing your trade proposals for other teams as much as you over-analyze trade proposals for the Rangers, you'd never make a trade proposal again.

 

[TGWL]

Kreider most likely won't reach 50 again. But can he reach 30? If so, Rangers trading a 6.5 million dollar contract to make more room for Laf is such a NYR move to make...

 

[bernmeister]

Not only can you not have production conditions, but that is a terrible trade for Montreal.

Montreal is going to trade the 33rd OA pick, a likely top-5/10 2023 pick and a RD prospect that Montreal really wanted/needed for a former 1st OA pick trending behind basically every 1st OA pick after two seasons since Patrik Stefan, a terrible D-man with a bad contract and goalie they can't even pay right now?

If you spent even an ounce of time over-analyzing your trade proposals for other teams as much as you over-analyze trade proposals for the Rangers, you'd never make a trade proposal again.

This is simple.
If you agree w/hype projections about LaF, you make this deal as MON 10 out of 10.

Now it is totally fair to question the hype, but then ya gotta also be honest as to why he is falling short so far, and to note it is clear, not speculative, that he is solid on everything else other than his skating, and that IS signif improved, and trends to further improvement.

If LaF w/Suzuki + Wright can be a powerhouse line now, and it is for incremental futures, that is something Habs brass should not ignore.

And let's not be hypocritical.
Everyone is proposing w/idea of optimizing their team, less so careful balance.

As to if trades can/can not include clauses based on production, would appreciate independent confirmation either way.

Kreider most likely won't reach 50 again. But can he reach 30? If so, Rangers trading a 6.5 million dollar contract to make more room for Laf is such a NYR move to make...

50 is a career yr but I see 30-35 + depending on chemistry w/linemates as a floor. That plus x factors, phys presence etc, we should not be trading him.

 

[Captain Mountain]

This is simple.
If you agree w/hype projections about LaF, you make this deal as MON 10 out of 10.

Now it is totally fair to question the hype, but then ya gotta also be honest as to why he is falling short so far, and to note it is clear, not speculative, that he is solid on everything else other than his skating, and that IS signif improved, and trends to further improvement.

If LaF w/Suzuki + Wright can be a powerhouse line now, and it is for incremental futures, that is something Habs brass should not ignore.

And let's not be hypocritical.
Everyone is proposing w/idea of optimizing their team, less so careful balance.

As to if trades can/can not include clauses based on production, would appreciate independent confirmation either way.

Montreal isn't going to beleive the hype of Lafreniere. Even before getting into the fact their front office probably knows Lafreniere better than any other team outside of the Rangers, they know how incredibly stupid it is to pay full price for a struggling hyped French Canadian.

Your proposals makes no sense for Montreal from a cap, needs, planning or situation prespective. Its not even close to making sense for Montreal.

 

[Mrfenn92]

Montreal isn't going to beleive the hype of Lafreniere. Even before getting into the fact their front office probably knows Lafreniere better than any other team outside of the Rangers, they know how incredibly stupid it is to pay full price for a struggling hyped French Canadian.

Your proposals makes no sense for Montreal from a cap, needs, planning or situation prespective. Its not even close to making sense for Montreal.

Never makes sense for the other team. Only for his team. His guys worth a lot yours not so much.

I disagree w/most of this.
CK has earned all of his 6+m incl in this p'o. Even if this is a career year, he ages well and stll brings a beast factor others don't.

As to immediate concerns, Zib + bread delivered in the season, but not now.
Trouba is overpaid by 1.5-2m, these are the 3 we are married to that are gonna suck the roster flexibility life out of the team, not CK.
There is the hope we can bribe Trouba to waive sooner than his 2 seasons hence end of nmc, Panarin we got the best of, should deal if/when he is open to that. (He's special, but irregular cap situation this yr w/Zib + fox new deals not kicking in til next season spoiled us. We can't afford splurge of him + Zib who is not waiving anytime soon.)

Longer term, we need to not only keep what we have but add 1. Vatrano and 2. if possible Copp.
It is given that moving on from Strome, Nemeth, Hajek + Geo + recovery of Hank 1.5 = 11ish m needed to offset Zib + Fox increases.

Lindy for picks = a cap casualty; recovering his 3m + 1m increase in cap = 4m which = Vatrano $.
Blais will have to stay on IR for the moment.
Reaves will have to retire for a year-ish, take a FO job, then unretire as Trouba exits.

Those getting rfa deals will have to take tiny short term bridges, but they do, seeing light at the end of the tunnel.

We will briefly go w/min depth and skin every nickel.

LaF I can see to Montreal.
It won't be for 1OA, but they will have to seriously consider adding him to Wright.

There is reasonable hope, no guarantee, that LaF turns into the hyped 'best 1OA not a generational player since Nate MacKinnon'. The first key is less where he plays/what line, who with, but rather his skating, which has been NHL subpar, but to which there is visible marked improvement = increased production even this season. We estimate he will be skating sufficiently as of mid next season.

So w/need for cap, there is added impetus to consider moving LaF, but that is not a sacrifice situation where we have to give him away.
The middle ground here is a acceptable down payment of picks + considerations, plus CONDITIONAL picks that do not kick in unless/if LaF stars.

This would be like:
a core of
Mon 2022 2nd + 2023 1st [top 3 protected] + Barron .925 elc + NYR 2022 4th
for
LaF .925 elc + Nemeth (2.5 x 2) + Geo rfa rights

in addition is the part 2 supplemental
if LaF scores min 30 goals in 2023, then NYR 2023 3rd for MON 2024 1st
if LaF scores min 35 goals in 2024, then NYR 2024 3rd for MON 2025 1st
if LaF scores min 40 goals in 2025, then NYR 2025 3rd for MON 2026 1st

none of these ^ apply unless LaF hits those targets.
That's a lot, but for a 1OA with huge upside emerging, it is not unreasonable.

NY can short term play Fox at LD, also Nils L.
Deal Jones. Add Robertson to LD
so short term RD = Trouba, Schneider, Barron; when Trouba goes Fox can slide back or Nils L to 3RD, his natural side.
LD now = Fox, KAM, Robertson/Nils L. Scanlin is the big add in the pipeline.

ny recovers Nemeth cap, Geo a freebie not gonna be here.
Rangers get actual/potential value in picks [again, helps w/cap] commensurate to LaF actual production.

Fair + win win all around

That is more likely, not CK outta here.

Habs say no. Nemeth does nothing for them, same as geo. To much of a overpay for Lafreniere

 

[bernmeister]

Montreal isn't going to beleive the hype of Lafreniere. Even before getting into the fact their front office probably knows Lafreniere better than any other team outside of the Rangers, they know how incredibly stupid it is to pay full price for a struggling hyped French Canadian.

Your proposals makes no sense for Montreal from a cap, needs, planning or situation prespective. Its not even close to making sense for Montreal.

It is not a matter of "believing the hype", taking it on faith.
It is a simple matter of yes or no, do you think w/continued improved skating he approaches that level of potential. If no, fine, do not bid. If yes a signif offer is required, and NY is only considering this b'c of cap situation.

A pick heavy offer intended to help w/cap w/conditional component is not unreasonable

 

[Lays]

This is going to sound crazy but I think we should explore a Panarin trade

 

[bernmeister]

Never makes sense for the other team. Only for his team. His guys worth a lot yours not so much.


Habs say no. Nemeth does nothing for them, same as geo. To much of a overpay for Lafreniere

To courtesy answer, Obv the Nemeth for Barron component is to address part of what Habs would have to cough up for an emerging 1oA w/huge upside.

gonna stop here before this spins off topic.
Kreider will not be moved.
Some deal, possibly for LaF if there is signif return is way more likely.

 

[Captain Mountain]

It is not a matter of "believing the hype", taking it on faith.
It is a simple matter of yes or no, do you think w/continued improved skating he approaches that level of potential. If no, fine, do not bid. If yes a signif offer is required, and NY is only considering this b'c of cap situation.

A pick heavy offer intended to help w/cap w/conditional component is not unreasonable

For that price, its an unequivocal no. From any team in the NHL.

 

[cwede]

Kreider not going anywhere. Nor Trouba,
None of Bread, Zib, Fox, Shesty either.
Through the next 3 seasons at least, that's the core, and the core Cap allocation,

but fantasy is fun, enjoy away

 

[TGWL]

This is going to sound crazy but I think we should explore a Panarin trade

The cap is too high for it to be worth it. Rangers aren't in a position to eat half. Any team trading for Panarin is most likely sending cap space back. We have prospects that aren't quite there yet. 1st round picks are great but we're not a team that needs to stock up on 1st round picks right now. I can't see trading Panarin being worth it when you factor in what we would get back doesn't immediately help us. Rangers trading
Panarin would require a good 2c(with term) and a + coming back. Signing Copp for the contract he potentially wants could back fire if Panarin is gone.

 

[pld459666]

This is going to sound crazy but I think we should explore a Panarin trade

I just mentioned this same possibility this morning when talking with a co-worker.

Not that I believe it could/would happen.

 

[pld459666]

I would entertain trading CK, but I doubt Montreal is interested. Additionally, I'd prefer to send him out west.

 

[seabass45]

This is going to sound crazy but I think we should explore a Panarin trade

Full NMC for the entire contract. Only way he goes is if he wants out.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

This is going to sound crazy but I think we should explore a Panarin trade

Sure and about 98% of the league can't afford his cap hit, Which basically means he's not moving. He sure isn't waiving for bottom feeders. Which are the only ones that can afford to take on his enormous cap hit.

 

[Deen]

This is going to sound crazy but I think we should explore a Panarin trade

Panarin for Tkachuk?

 

[TGWL]

Panarin for Tkachuk?

I don't think this works for either team. Flames have skill and need the style of Tkachuk more than Panarin. (Not that Tkachuk doesn't bring skill), and Rangers don't have a lot of creativeness and talent like Panarin's to lose him and replace with Tkachuk.

Tkachuk is going to cash in so I don't know how much money is really saved.

 

[Pure Slaughter Value]

I don't understand why a team in its contention mode would trade arguably the best winger in the league and eliminate the contention window completely

 

[Leonardo87]

I don't understand why a team in its contention mode would trade arguably the best winger in the league and eliminate the contention window completely

Most of these threads make no sense to me. It's pretty interesting some fans want to push a 30 yo player who just had a career season out the window for unproven youth. Will he hit 50 goals again? Maybe not, but 30-40 goals with 60-70 points is very realistic, and he has been ideal on the PK. So again, don't get it.

 

[Savant]

I don't understand why a team in its contention mode would trade arguably the best winger in the league and eliminate the contention window completely

They wouldn’t. Rangers need to cut cap from somewhere but all their big contracts are on NMC so it’ll be interesting to see what happens. Rangers have too many LW, Kreider makes a lot of money, maybe some fans want to sell high, but it’s not realistic