Canucks Managerial Thread | 9

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[tantalum]

Reading the provies.

Sbisa, Hamhuis, Bartkowski, Weber, Hutton, and Edler all in the bottom 33 in the league for chances against/60.

Tanev above average.

http://blogs.theprovince.com/2016/01/14/the-provies-the-new-17-trade-discussion-and-sedingate-gets-stamped-case-closed/

 

[mathonwy]

Reading the provies.

Sbisa, Hamhuis, Bartkowski, Weber, Hutton, and Edler all in the bottom 33 in the league for chances against/60.

Tanev above average.

http://blogs.theprovince.com/2016/01/14/the-provies-the-new-17-trade-discussion-and-sedingate-gets-stamped-case-closed/

Did someone from up high tell WD to quit the BS?

 

[ahmon]

Reading the provies.

Sbisa, Hamhuis, Bartkowski, Weber, Hutton, and Edler all in the bottom 33 in the league for chances against/60.

Tanev above average.

http://blogs.theprovince.com/2016/01/14/the-provies-the-new-17-trade-discussion-and-sedingate-gets-stamped-case-closed/

And edler gets paired with tanev. Imagine him paired with a bartkowski/weber/sbisa.

Subpar defensively, no creativity offensively, spoonfed pp minutes and time with twins.

Major tradebait.

 

[VanJack]

And edler gets paired with tanev. Imagine him paired with a bartkowski/weber/sbisa.

Subpar defensively, no creativity offensively, spoonfed pp minutes and time with twins.

Major tradebait.

Yes, Canucks blueline is befitting of a true NHL bottom-feeder....but after watching the 'Canes track meet in the Canucks zone last game, I just can't decide if it's the blueline that's truly atrocious or if it is the failure to win board battles and the ridiculous turnovers at the blueline by the forwards....then you also have to wonder about the coaching....even though Vey scored first last night, it was only time in eight games that 'Nucks didn't surrender the first goal....just don't seem to be prepared lots of nights.

 

[Horse McHindu]

Major tradebait.

No.

The Canucks should NOT move Edler, Hamhuis, or Tanev unless they are getting a veteran D in return (i.e. Hamonic).

The biggest goal for the Canucks right now should be in creating the best possible environment for their prospects/young guys (i.e. Pedan, Biega, Hutton, etc.). The best possible environment for their prospects, is to build them up S-L-O-W-L-Y and play them in roles that they are comfortable in. The moment you start over-exerting your prospects, is the moment you start destroying their confidence (a la Edmonton Oilers).

Edler, Hamhuis, and Tanev need to stick around until guys like Hutton, etc. prove that they are ready for a bigger workload beyond a shadow of a doubt. THEN you move Hamhuis, etc.

Hamhuis should be kept and signed to another 1-2 year deal.

The only players the Canucks should consider moving at the deadline are Radim Vrbata and Brandon Prust (assuming that the Canucks are out of playoff contention at the deadline).

 

[WTG]

Trading Hamhuis just allows you to manage your assets. I mean either you get rid of him and you become a worse for 1 season or he walks and you get nothing.

 

[Horse McHindu]

Trading Hamhuis just allows you to manage your assets. I mean either you get rid of him and you become a worse for 1 season or he walks and you get nothing.

Moving Hamhuis without getting a veteran defenseman in return is very risky. I don't see how it allows one to manage their assets.

All you are doing if you move Hamhuis without replacing him with adequate veteran support, is making a thin defense even thinner. Furthermore - you risk hurting the rebuilding process rather than supporting it. Guys like Hutton, Biega, Pedan, etc., need to be developed slowly. It's no different than guys like Horvat, McCann, Virtanen, Baertschi, and Etem up front.

Vets like Hamhuis, Edler, and Tanev need to be there on D to allow that. Even if guys like Edler and Hamhuis have their warts (and trust me, they do), their presence alone allows for our defensive prospects/young guys to take on roles that they are adequate for.

Same thing up front - guys like Vrbata, Burrows, Sutter, Prust, Dorsett, etc., have their warts, but they are the guys that will help guys like Horvat, McCann, Virtanen, Etem, and Baertschi develop slowly and steadily.

The moment you start throwing away vets, is the moment you start over-exerting your prospects, and is the moment you become the Edmonton Oilers post 2006.

 

[WTG]

We are losing Hamhuis regardless.

Might as well get picks from him in the meanwhile.

 

[Horse McHindu]

We are losing Hamhuis regardless.

Might as well get picks from him in the meanwhile.

Hamhuis is a BC boy and wants to stay in BC from what I understand.

I'm pretty sure a reasonable deal can be worked out between both parties.

But yes - if Hamhuis actually does want to leave, then Benning should trade him (as part of a packaged deal for a defenseman) #Hamonic

 

[WTG]

Hamhuis is a BC boy and wants to stay in BC from what I understand.

I'm pretty sure a reasonable deal can be worked out between both parties.

But yes - if Hamhuis actually does want to leave, then Benning should trade him (as part of a packaged deal for a defenseman) #Hamonic

We aren't getting Hamonic with Hamhuis +.

 

[Horse McHindu]

We aren't getting Hamonic with Hamhuis +.

If that's the case, then see what other veteran D's are out there being shopped.

If no one's available, then the Canucks should commit to re-signing Hammer. Trading Hammer for pick(s) would do this team more damage than good.

Having said that, I absolutely would move Vrbata. I'm not sure what the Canucks intend to do with Prust, but I get the feeling that the Canucks will try and re-sign Prust if they are unsuccessful in reeling in Lucic in the off-season.

Hopefully, Brendan Gaunce gets into the line-up as a regular at some point. I think he is ready.

 

[WTG]

Our LHD is too crowded and we can afford getting rid of Hammer IMO.

It's our RHD that is incredibly thin.

 

[Jimson Hogarth*]

If the Isles were going to get what the wanted for Hamonic that trade would have already happened.

I would attempt to re-sign Hamhuis and trade Edler, but that's just me.

 

[Win One Before I Die]

If the Isles were going to get what the wanted for Hamonic that trade would have already happened.

I would attempt to re-sign Hamhuis and trade Edler, but that's just me.

I wouldn't ever trade Edler. Swedes tend to get better the older they get. Edler is going to be in his prime the next 3 years. Hamhuis is a pylon.

 

[Trelane]

If Hammer is skating and teams are inquiring at the deadline you trade him. Otherwise you're courting a Bieksa situation and the value can only go down. No doubt he'd be willing to renew for reasonable dough but this is business. Hanging on to aging vets is an age old management failing in team sports and Nucks have been as guilty as anyone. Same goes for Vrby.

There is money to spend on FAs.

Hoping JB has the green light.

 

[Horse McHindu]

If Hammer is skating and teams are inquiring at the deadline you trade him. Otherwise you're courting a Bieksa situation and the value can only go down. No doubt he'd be willing to renew for reasonable dough but this is business. Hanging on to aging vets is an age old management failing in team sports and Nucks have been as guilty as anyone. Same goes for Vrby.

There is money to spend on FAs.

Hoping JB has the green light.

Comparing Hamhuis and Bieksa is apples and oranges. Bieksa was no longer a Top 4 calibre defenseman and losing him wouldn't place any up-coming defensemen into roles that they would be too green for.

Hamhuis is still a Top 4 guy and losing him WOULD mean that you'd be putting guys like Sbisa, Hutton, Biega, etc., into roles that they aren't quite ready for. Since injuries are inevitable, this becomes an even bigger issue.

Don't get me wrong - I am all for replacing aging vets with up-and-comers, but the up-and-comers have to be ready and worthy. You can't just replace for the sake of replacing.

As far as trading Hammer goes and taking a *gamble* in the UFA market, that's just it...........it's a gamble. The only guarantees in life are death and taxes. You trade Hammer and then aren't successful in signing a veteran Top 4 d-man, you've not only weakened an already thin blue-line, but now you risk putting guys like Hutton, Sbisa, Biega, etc., into roles that they aren't ready for and risk destroying their development and confidence. With a weakened D, you now make Markstrom's job in net tougher and possibly hinder his confidence and development.

Do not move Dan Hamhuis, Alex Edler, or Chris Tanev. DO move Radim Vrbata and Brandon Prust up front if the price is right or if the Canucks are out of playoff contention.

 

[BROCK HUGHES]

Hanging on to aging vets is an age old management failing--And it might happen again.As our GM thinks we are still in a position for the play-offs..with this team.Scary thought is trading Hamhuis and it opens the door for Benning to sign Bartkowski to a extension.

 

[Trelane]

Comparing Hamhuis and Bieksa is apples and oranges. Bieksa was no longer a Top 4 calibre defenseman and losing him wouldn't place any up-coming defensemen into roles that they would be too green for...

Ehhh... I'm gone have to say no. Bieksa was a top 4 for us and still IS for the Ducks (top 3 TOI among their D). Based on last viewings Hammer seems to be fading and I'd rather another club reaped that harvest. Ducks haven't done much with their Juice though they fancied themselves a contender at the time. Save for cloning it doesn't get more orange to orange as comparisons go.

Yeah, our D would suck but no more than it does now and combined with goaltending the performance is not as bad as forwards. I'll take my chances with a half-way prudent FA signing. I also want to see an opening for one of the big Russians.

 

[Paulinvancouver]

I love it when these threads are short like this!! That way I can read, and even participate in them! Awesome, thank you!!

JB has come out and said they aren't tanking because they have too much pride in this team.

I thought January would be a hard month for us but I've been proven wrong thus far.

We lack any sort of impact player on this team. We've been dying in mediocrity with mostly middle of the pack or late draft picks this past 10 years. We've been horrible at drafting even for our position in the past but now we have the super scout as gm so this is the time when you should want high draft picks.

I think Virtanwn is going to mostly bust. However I think the owners put pressure on JB to draft a local boy. I also think the owners are meddling too much because they want revenue dollars now rather than see the long term view.

The draft this year isn't very deep outside the top ten. I'm in favor of the tank to get a strong pick but I really don't think it will happen. In fact I see JB being a small buyer in terms of making a hockey trade that will help us this year but I think we'll miss the opportunity to deal some UFAs. Heck, Hammer could b traded at the deadline and even resigned on July 1 just because he's a Bc boy. If JB doesn't see that, the guys blind. Clearly our best opportunity to trade from a position of strength but of course his injury isn't helping us drive up the value of him.

I'd like to see everyone who's a UFA moved this year. I'd like to see a package deal that would somehow give us an extra first. I'd like to see JB stop moving later picks in order to make meh trades. (Although I like what I've seen of Etem thus far, I don't think the trade will make much of an impact for us)

We've got a lot of recent picks that are on the verge of being the next Nick Jensen. Let's bring them up to the bigs so we can see what they've got! Let's move out a few pieces as needed to do that! I don't want to see all those Burrows fans in that restaurant simultaneously cry, but it's time to move him as well. Vrbata should be dealt too but his value is crap this year because he's not playing well. (At least his results aren't showing up on the scoresheet and this is a results based business)

I really hope Benning and Linden wake up. Get out of the Aquilini shadow and see this team for what it is.

I however, don't think it will happen.

 

[Horse McHindu]

Hanging on to aging vets is an age old management failing--And it might happen again.As our GM thinks we are still in a position for the play-offs..with this team.Scary thought is trading Hamhuis and it opens the door for Benning to sign Bartkowski to a extension.

No.

In this case, hanging onto an aging vet (Hamhuis) is NOT a sign that of our GM thinking that this core has a shot of making noise in the playoffs. The purpose in keeping a vet like Hamhuis, is so that guys like Sbisa, Hutton, Biega, and Pedan can play in roles that they are comfortable in playing while developing slowly, gradually, and steadily. Period.

Once guys like Hutton, Biega, Pedan, etc., take that big next step, THEN you move out your Edler's and your Hamhuis' and what have you. If you move a vet too quickly, you over-exert your kids and put them into roles that they aren't ready for.

 

[Win One Before I Die]

I'd keep Hamhuis around as a bottom pairing guy if he signs for under 3 mil. but you know thats a mistake when WD will give him top pairing minutes. He needs to be traded to protect WD from WD.

 

[bossram]

No.

The Canucks should NOT move Edler, Hamhuis, or Tanev unless they are getting a veteran D in return (i.e. Hamonic).

The biggest goal for the Canucks right now should be in creating the best possible environment for their prospects/young guys (i.e. Pedan, Biega, Hutton, etc.). The best possible environment for their prospects, is to build them up S-L-O-W-L-Y and play them in roles that they are comfortable in. The moment you start over-exerting your prospects, is the moment you start destroying their confidence (a la Edmonton Oilers).

Edler, Hamhuis, and Tanev need to stick around until guys like Hutton, etc. prove that they are ready for a bigger workload beyond a shadow of a doubt. THEN you move Hamhuis, etc.

Hamhuis should be kept and signed to another 1-2 year deal.

The only players the Canucks should consider moving at the deadline are Radim Vrbata and Brandon Prust (assuming that the Canucks are out of playoff contention at the deadline).

The biggest goal for the Canucks right now should be to rebuild and collect as many premium youth assets as possible. Edler can bring back a decent haul. This team is going nowhere with or without him. I personally like him, but its time to move him.

The only way you're argument is correct is if it is the case that it is impossible for prospects to develop without heavy sheltering. Horvat was thrown to the wolves and seems to be coming out pretty well. If anything, guys like McCann and Hutton deserve bigger roles. And BTW, Biega is not young. He is an AHL journeyman. And I don't think calling up guys like Pedan to sit them in the press box is helping their development.

You're Edmonton example doesn't really make sense either. All of Hall, RNH. Eberle, Draisaitl, Nurse, Davidson, Klefbom seem to have developed pretty well. I mean they're pretty good players in their own right. The bigger problem is Edmonton is lack of any competent team building from management. They've needed a goalie and quality defensemen for years and never addressed it. Schultz isn't great, but that's probably because he is the worst situationally aware defensemen in the NHL. I don't know how much you can fix that.

 

[Ho Borvat]

I wouldn't ever trade Edler. Swedes tend to get better the older they get. Edler is going to be in his prime the next 3 years. Hamhuis is a pylon.

Is this something to do with getting a good night sleep in their Ikea beds, or is this just kind of baseless speculation?

 

[y2kcanucks]

Is this something to do with getting a good night sleep in their Ikea beds, or is this just kind of baseless speculation?

Completely baseless