overpass
Registered User
- Jun 7, 2007
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HOH has often discussed the historical talent pool of players in terms of countries that produce hockey player production. When discussing the influx of European and American players in the past 5 decades, the Canadian talent pool has been treated as relatively homogenous. That's understandable as a simple assumption, but a historical look at Canadian hockey players makes it clear that production of top level hockey players has often had a strong regional component.
What is more interesting is that no one region has consistently punched above its weight over the whole of hockey history. There have been many regional rises and falls over the years.
To prepare the numbers that follow, I started by looking at the players listed on the HOH Top 70 Pre-merger players of all time. I looked up where they learned to play hockey, which was not necessarily their place of birth, or where they placed their top level junior hockey. Then I did the same for each subsequent era of hockey history, selecting a number of top players as defined by lists of of most games played and of most points scored, making sure to get representative numbers of forwards, defence, and goalies.
Canadian geography
I'll start with a brief description of the different regions of Canada I used, understanding that this site has users from all over the world and not everyone is knowledgeable about Canadian history and geography.
I'll post the population of these regions at certain points through history, so you can get an idea of how many players they might be expected to produce based on population.
Regional Booms
Early Montreal
The first organized hockey leagues started in Montreal, so it's not surprising that many of the first hockey stars were Montrealers. Of the 19 players born in 1880 or earlier, 9 (47%) were from Montreal. All were English-speaking. Among them were Jack Campbell, Mike Grant, Bob MacDougall, Harry Trihey, and Russell Bowie
Montreal was also overrepresented among the 1881-1889 year of birth cohort, with 6 of 24 (25%) players, all English-speaking still. They included Lester and Frank Patrick, Art Ross, and Sprague Cleghorn.
After producing relatively few players for several decades, Montreal had a second boom in the Original Six and the expansion era. This time most of the players were French-speaking, and many of them played for the Montreal Canadiens.
1945-46 to 1955-56: 6 of 53 (11%), including Maurice Richard, Doug Harvey, Bernie Geoffrion, and Butch Bouchard.
1956-57 to 1966-67: 9 of 66 (14%), including Dickie Moore, Henri Richard, Claude Provost, Bobby Rousseau, and Gump Worsley.
1967-68 to 1978-79: 11 of 71 (15%), including Jean Ratelle, Rod Gilbert, Guy Lapointe, Serge Savard, and Jacques Lemaire.
Early Eastern Ontario
Before 1930, Ottawa and the rest of Eastern Ontario punched far above its weight in producing top hockey players. Here's a thread I posted on this topic. The lumber industry and the railway linkages between the towns were possible factors in developing the competitive hockey culture of this region.
Year of birth 1880 and earlier: 5 of 19 (26%) from Eastern Ontario, including Alf Smith and Hod Stuart.
Year of birth 1881-1889: 7 of 24 (29%) from Eastern Ontario, including Frank McGee, Hugh Lehman, and Newsy Lalonde.
Year of birth 1890-1898: 10 of 27 (37%) from Eastern Ontario, including Eddie Gerard, Cy Denneny, and Frank Nighbor.
Seasons 1926-27 to 1933-34: 11 of 44 (25%) from Eastern Ontario, including Bill and Bun Cook, Frank Boucher, Aurel Joliat, and Ebbie Goodfellow.
After Bill Cowley and Syd Howe made the NHL, Eastern Ontario all but dried up as a hockey producing region. One reason may have been that the lumber industry basically died in the late 1920s, taking away a lot of business support for the game, and the civil service in Ottawa couldn't support hockey in the same way that local businesses did. Another reason was that Ottawa didn't have a junior hockey team in the OHA because of the distance from the other Ontario cities, and Ottawa's junior team was used by Montreal to develop their Quebec juniors, so young Ottawa players who wanted a pro career had to travel to play junior hockey.
In the expansion era, several great players came out of Eastern Ontario once again, including Denis Potvin, Larry Robinson, Doug Wilson, Steve Yzerman, Doug Gilmour, and Bobby Smith.
Manitoba
Manitoba hockey had a golden generation of players who dominated Allan Cup play in the 1910s and then went on to star in pro hockey in the 1920s, joining the NHL in 1926 when the western leagues shut down and the American teams bought their players.
Year of birth 1890-1898: 7 of 27 (26%) players from Manitoba, including Herb Gardiner, Dick Irvin, Joe Simpson, and Frank Fredrickson.
And then Manitoba had a second boom after WWII. Between 1945-46 and 1955-56, 11 of 53 (21%) top players were from Manitoba, including Terry Sawchuk, Ken Reardon, Jack Stewart, Tom Johnson and Jimmy Thomson.
Southern Ontario
Southern Ontario was relatively late to producing top pro hockey players in proportion to its large population. In the post-1926 merger NHL, a new generation of Southern Ontario players starred, and the region has consistently produced top players ever since.
1926-27 through 1933-34: 18 of 44 (41%) of top players were from this region, led by Toronto players Lionel Conacher, Nels Stewart, and Hooley Smith, as well as Howie Morenz, Dit Clapper, and others.
1934-35 - 1941-42: 16 of 41 (39%) of top Canadians were from this region. Earl Seibert, Milt Schmidt, Woody Dumart, and Bobby Bauer all came out of Kitchener alone.
1979-80 - 1991-92: 24 of 63 (38%) of top Canadians came from this region, including Wayne Gretzky, Paul Coffey, Dale Hawerchuk, Bernie Nicholls, Scott Stevens, and Larry Murphy.
Southern Ontario has always had about 30% of the Canadian population and has produced NHL players in rough proportion ever since. But in the last few years, Southern Ontario players as a percentage of Canadian players have really taken a leap. From 2015-16 to 2023-24, as Americans and Europeans have advanced relative to Canadians, 29 of 65 (46%) of top Canadian players have come out of Southern Ontario, led by Connor McDavid, Steven Stamkos, John Tavares, Mitch Marner, and Alex Pietrangelo.
Is this because Southern Ontario is booming? Or is the rest of Canada regressing?
Saskatchewan
Saskatchewan became a substantial source of top talent in the 1930s through 1950s.
1934-35 - 1941-42: 8 of 41 (20%) of top Canadian players were from Saskatchewan, including Bryan Hextall, Johnny Gottselig, and Clint Smith.
1945-46 - 1955-56: 13 of 53 (25%) of top players were from Saskatchewan, including Gordie Howe, Max and Doug Bentley, Sid Abel, and Elmer Lach.
Oddly, the Prairie province numbers were way down in 1967-68 through 1978-79, with only 8 of 71 top Canadians coming from Manitoba, Saskatchewan, and Alberta combined. Bobby Clarke was the only real Western star. Maybe the creation of the WHL wasn't good for development?
Northern Ontario
Northern Ontario, despite its small population, became a major source of NHL talent between WWII and 1980. The Toronto Maple Leafs had a regular pipeline going from the mining towns down to St Mike's for junior hockey.
1945-46 to 1955-56: 9 of 53 (17%), including Ted Lindsay, Allan Stanley, Gus Mortson, Don Raleigh, and Edgar Laprade. 5 of the 9 of this group were from Northwestern Ontario.
1956-57 to 1966-67: 13 of 66 (20%), including Frank Mahovlich, Tim Horton, George Armstrong, Dick Duff, and Ralph Backstrom.
1967-68 to 1979-80: 14 of 71 top Canadians (17%), including Phil and Tony Esposito, Bill Barber, Walt Tkaczuk, and Ed Giacomin.
Alberta
Alberta has been a consistent producer of top players since the 1926 merger, without any huge spikes. Top generations include:
1926-27 to 1933-34: 5 of 44 (11%) when the province had 7% of Canada's population. Eddie Shore, Tiny Thompson and Paul Thompson
1934-35 to 1941-42: 5 of 41 (12%) when the province had 7% of Canada's population. Sweeney Schriner, Neil Colville, Tommy "Cowboy" Anderson
1956-57 to 1966-67: 8 of 66 (12%) when the province had 6% of Canada's population. Johnny Bucyk, Norm Ullman, Vic Stasiuk, Doug Barkley
2005-06 to 2014-15: 10 of 63 top Canadians (16%) with 11% of Canada's population. Jarome Iginla, Dany Heatley, Dion Phaneuf, Shane Doan, Jay Bouwmeester
Rest of Quebec
Quebec outside of Montreal has basically always been underepresented in the NHL, relative to population. Joe Malone and Georges Vezina were two early stars from Quebec City and Chicoutimi, respectively, but before 1955 there were almost no NHL stars from Quebec outside of Montreal. The following two eras are high points for the region -- while they still weren't overrepresented relative to the population, they produced some of the biggest stars of the era.
1956-57 to 1966-67: 11 of 66 (17%), including Jean Beliveau, Jacques Plante, Dave Keon, J.C. Tremblay, Jacques Laperriere, and Pierre Pilote.
1967-68 to 1978-79: 10 of 71 (14%), including Guy Lafleur, Marcel Dionne, Gilbert Perreault, and Yvan Cournoyer.
Maritimes
While the region has a long hockey history, including Allan Cup winning teams from Nova Scotia in the 1930s, very few top NHL players came out of here. The most recent generations are probably the strongest, including stars Sidney Crosby, Nathan MacKinnon, Brad Marchand, and Brad Richards.
British Columbia
BC produced very few top players before 1960, but has recently caught up in terms of producing top talent.
1992-93 to 2003-04: 9 of 63 top Canadians (14%), with 13% of the population, including Joe Sakic, Brett Hull, Scott Niedermayer, Paul Kariya, and Mark Recchi.
2015-16 to 2023-24: 9 of 63 top Canadians (14%), with 14% of the population, including Jamie Benn, Shea Theodore, Sam Reinhart, and Ryan Nugent-Hopkins.
What is more interesting is that no one region has consistently punched above its weight over the whole of hockey history. There have been many regional rises and falls over the years.
To prepare the numbers that follow, I started by looking at the players listed on the HOH Top 70 Pre-merger players of all time. I looked up where they learned to play hockey, which was not necessarily their place of birth, or where they placed their top level junior hockey. Then I did the same for each subsequent era of hockey history, selecting a number of top players as defined by lists of of most games played and of most points scored, making sure to get representative numbers of forwards, defence, and goalies.
Canadian geography
I'll start with a brief description of the different regions of Canada I used, understanding that this site has users from all over the world and not everyone is knowledgeable about Canadian history and geography.
Newfoundland and Labrador
Unlike the other regions here, Newfoundland did not become part of Canada until 1949. For various reasons, including geographic isolation and relative poverty, Newfoundland has never produced any significant number of top hockey players. No teams from Newfoundland played for the Allan Cup, awarded to the senior amateur champion of Canada, until 1967.
Maritimes
This includes Nova Scotia, Prince Edward Island, and New Brunswick. These provinces do have a history of playing hockey, and although they are geographically small, they were relatively populous compared to the rest of Canada early in Canadian history. Even so, they did not produce any significant number of top hockey players until recently. Aspiring professional players from these provinces have had to go to Ontario or Quebec to play junior hockey going back to the 1920s.
Greater Montreal
Montreal was the first city of Canada for much of its history with both English and French speaking populations and lots of money. More recently it has been surpassed by Toronto in population, economically, and in financial influence.
Rest of Quebec
Quebec has always been a large and populous province, with most of the population living outside of Montreal in smaller cities, including Quebec City, or in rural areas. Most of this population is French-speaking.
Eastern Ontario
Eastern Ontario includes Ottawa and the surrounding regions, such as the various towns in the Ottawa river valley, as well as Kingston and towns along the St Lawrence. The lumber industry was very prominent in this region in the early days of hockey history, but the lumber boom ended in the 1920s. Ottawa has been a government town ever since, without as much industry as comparably sized cities. Most of the population in Eastern Ontario is geographically separated from the major population centres of Southern Ontario, and is closer to Montreal than Toronto.
Southern Ontario
Southern Ontario has always been the most populated region of Canada, and one of the wealthiest, with a strong mixed economy including manufacturing and finance. Toronto is the largest city, and there are many smaller cities. The climate is warmer than many other regions of Canada, so artificial ice has been particularly important in this region. I'm including what some might call southwestern Ontario, the Niagara region, and central Ontario here as well, as those regions have all more or less developed together with Southern Ontario under the Ontario Hockey Association.
Northern Ontario
Northern Ontario is large and sparsely populated. At the beginning of hockey history it was barely populated at all, and it was settled more or less at the same time as the Prairie provinces. The economy is largely primary industries, especially mining, which boomed from about 1950 to 1980. Northwestern Ontario, i.e. the Thunder Bay and Kenora area, is included here as well, although it is geographically closer to Manitoba than the other population centres of Northern Ontario, and teams from this region have competed against Manitoba teams.
Manitoba
Manitoba was the frontier at the beginning of hockey history, and was undergoing white settlement. Manitoba teams challenged from the Stanley Cup right from the beginning. The climate in Manitoba is cold and allows for a long outdoor hockey season.
All of the western provinces had substantial First Nations populations, especially in the early days of hockey when European settlement was in progress, and regrettably those populations were underrepresented or even all but excluded from top level hockey for much of history.
Saskatchewan
Saskatchewan and Alberta were largely unsettled by Europeans at the beginning of hockey history. They became provinces in 1905, and a settlement boom through the 1920s made them substantial population centres. Like Manitoba, the climate is cold and outdoor hockey is possible for several months.
Alberta
After similar beginnings from territory status to agricultural settlement, the oil industry in Alberta has allowed the province to far outstrip Saskatchewan in population and wealth since the Second World War.
British Columbia
Much of the population of the province lives in a more temperate climate, where artificial ice is a necessity. Although the Patrick family brought hockey to BC over 100 years ago, the province produced no top level players who weren't members of the Patrick family until after 1960.
Territories
The territories of Canada have very low populations and have not produced top hockey players.
I'll post the population of these regions at certain points through history, so you can get an idea of how many players they might be expected to produce based on population.
Regional Booms
Early Montreal
The first organized hockey leagues started in Montreal, so it's not surprising that many of the first hockey stars were Montrealers. Of the 19 players born in 1880 or earlier, 9 (47%) were from Montreal. All were English-speaking. Among them were Jack Campbell, Mike Grant, Bob MacDougall, Harry Trihey, and Russell Bowie
Montreal was also overrepresented among the 1881-1889 year of birth cohort, with 6 of 24 (25%) players, all English-speaking still. They included Lester and Frank Patrick, Art Ross, and Sprague Cleghorn.
After producing relatively few players for several decades, Montreal had a second boom in the Original Six and the expansion era. This time most of the players were French-speaking, and many of them played for the Montreal Canadiens.
1945-46 to 1955-56: 6 of 53 (11%), including Maurice Richard, Doug Harvey, Bernie Geoffrion, and Butch Bouchard.
1956-57 to 1966-67: 9 of 66 (14%), including Dickie Moore, Henri Richard, Claude Provost, Bobby Rousseau, and Gump Worsley.
1967-68 to 1978-79: 11 of 71 (15%), including Jean Ratelle, Rod Gilbert, Guy Lapointe, Serge Savard, and Jacques Lemaire.
Early Eastern Ontario
Before 1930, Ottawa and the rest of Eastern Ontario punched far above its weight in producing top hockey players. Here's a thread I posted on this topic. The lumber industry and the railway linkages between the towns were possible factors in developing the competitive hockey culture of this region.
Year of birth 1880 and earlier: 5 of 19 (26%) from Eastern Ontario, including Alf Smith and Hod Stuart.
Year of birth 1881-1889: 7 of 24 (29%) from Eastern Ontario, including Frank McGee, Hugh Lehman, and Newsy Lalonde.
Year of birth 1890-1898: 10 of 27 (37%) from Eastern Ontario, including Eddie Gerard, Cy Denneny, and Frank Nighbor.
Seasons 1926-27 to 1933-34: 11 of 44 (25%) from Eastern Ontario, including Bill and Bun Cook, Frank Boucher, Aurel Joliat, and Ebbie Goodfellow.
After Bill Cowley and Syd Howe made the NHL, Eastern Ontario all but dried up as a hockey producing region. One reason may have been that the lumber industry basically died in the late 1920s, taking away a lot of business support for the game, and the civil service in Ottawa couldn't support hockey in the same way that local businesses did. Another reason was that Ottawa didn't have a junior hockey team in the OHA because of the distance from the other Ontario cities, and Ottawa's junior team was used by Montreal to develop their Quebec juniors, so young Ottawa players who wanted a pro career had to travel to play junior hockey.
In the expansion era, several great players came out of Eastern Ontario once again, including Denis Potvin, Larry Robinson, Doug Wilson, Steve Yzerman, Doug Gilmour, and Bobby Smith.
Manitoba
Manitoba hockey had a golden generation of players who dominated Allan Cup play in the 1910s and then went on to star in pro hockey in the 1920s, joining the NHL in 1926 when the western leagues shut down and the American teams bought their players.
Year of birth 1890-1898: 7 of 27 (26%) players from Manitoba, including Herb Gardiner, Dick Irvin, Joe Simpson, and Frank Fredrickson.
And then Manitoba had a second boom after WWII. Between 1945-46 and 1955-56, 11 of 53 (21%) top players were from Manitoba, including Terry Sawchuk, Ken Reardon, Jack Stewart, Tom Johnson and Jimmy Thomson.
Southern Ontario
Southern Ontario was relatively late to producing top pro hockey players in proportion to its large population. In the post-1926 merger NHL, a new generation of Southern Ontario players starred, and the region has consistently produced top players ever since.
1926-27 through 1933-34: 18 of 44 (41%) of top players were from this region, led by Toronto players Lionel Conacher, Nels Stewart, and Hooley Smith, as well as Howie Morenz, Dit Clapper, and others.
1934-35 - 1941-42: 16 of 41 (39%) of top Canadians were from this region. Earl Seibert, Milt Schmidt, Woody Dumart, and Bobby Bauer all came out of Kitchener alone.
1979-80 - 1991-92: 24 of 63 (38%) of top Canadians came from this region, including Wayne Gretzky, Paul Coffey, Dale Hawerchuk, Bernie Nicholls, Scott Stevens, and Larry Murphy.
Southern Ontario has always had about 30% of the Canadian population and has produced NHL players in rough proportion ever since. But in the last few years, Southern Ontario players as a percentage of Canadian players have really taken a leap. From 2015-16 to 2023-24, as Americans and Europeans have advanced relative to Canadians, 29 of 65 (46%) of top Canadian players have come out of Southern Ontario, led by Connor McDavid, Steven Stamkos, John Tavares, Mitch Marner, and Alex Pietrangelo.
Is this because Southern Ontario is booming? Or is the rest of Canada regressing?
Saskatchewan
Saskatchewan became a substantial source of top talent in the 1930s through 1950s.
1934-35 - 1941-42: 8 of 41 (20%) of top Canadian players were from Saskatchewan, including Bryan Hextall, Johnny Gottselig, and Clint Smith.
1945-46 - 1955-56: 13 of 53 (25%) of top players were from Saskatchewan, including Gordie Howe, Max and Doug Bentley, Sid Abel, and Elmer Lach.
Oddly, the Prairie province numbers were way down in 1967-68 through 1978-79, with only 8 of 71 top Canadians coming from Manitoba, Saskatchewan, and Alberta combined. Bobby Clarke was the only real Western star. Maybe the creation of the WHL wasn't good for development?
Northern Ontario
Northern Ontario, despite its small population, became a major source of NHL talent between WWII and 1980. The Toronto Maple Leafs had a regular pipeline going from the mining towns down to St Mike's for junior hockey.
1945-46 to 1955-56: 9 of 53 (17%), including Ted Lindsay, Allan Stanley, Gus Mortson, Don Raleigh, and Edgar Laprade. 5 of the 9 of this group were from Northwestern Ontario.
1956-57 to 1966-67: 13 of 66 (20%), including Frank Mahovlich, Tim Horton, George Armstrong, Dick Duff, and Ralph Backstrom.
1967-68 to 1979-80: 14 of 71 top Canadians (17%), including Phil and Tony Esposito, Bill Barber, Walt Tkaczuk, and Ed Giacomin.
Alberta
Alberta has been a consistent producer of top players since the 1926 merger, without any huge spikes. Top generations include:
1926-27 to 1933-34: 5 of 44 (11%) when the province had 7% of Canada's population. Eddie Shore, Tiny Thompson and Paul Thompson
1934-35 to 1941-42: 5 of 41 (12%) when the province had 7% of Canada's population. Sweeney Schriner, Neil Colville, Tommy "Cowboy" Anderson
1956-57 to 1966-67: 8 of 66 (12%) when the province had 6% of Canada's population. Johnny Bucyk, Norm Ullman, Vic Stasiuk, Doug Barkley
2005-06 to 2014-15: 10 of 63 top Canadians (16%) with 11% of Canada's population. Jarome Iginla, Dany Heatley, Dion Phaneuf, Shane Doan, Jay Bouwmeester
Rest of Quebec
Quebec outside of Montreal has basically always been underepresented in the NHL, relative to population. Joe Malone and Georges Vezina were two early stars from Quebec City and Chicoutimi, respectively, but before 1955 there were almost no NHL stars from Quebec outside of Montreal. The following two eras are high points for the region -- while they still weren't overrepresented relative to the population, they produced some of the biggest stars of the era.
1956-57 to 1966-67: 11 of 66 (17%), including Jean Beliveau, Jacques Plante, Dave Keon, J.C. Tremblay, Jacques Laperriere, and Pierre Pilote.
1967-68 to 1978-79: 10 of 71 (14%), including Guy Lafleur, Marcel Dionne, Gilbert Perreault, and Yvan Cournoyer.
Maritimes
While the region has a long hockey history, including Allan Cup winning teams from Nova Scotia in the 1930s, very few top NHL players came out of here. The most recent generations are probably the strongest, including stars Sidney Crosby, Nathan MacKinnon, Brad Marchand, and Brad Richards.
British Columbia
BC produced very few top players before 1960, but has recently caught up in terms of producing top talent.
1992-93 to 2003-04: 9 of 63 top Canadians (14%), with 13% of the population, including Joe Sakic, Brett Hull, Scott Niedermayer, Paul Kariya, and Mark Recchi.
2015-16 to 2023-24: 9 of 63 top Canadians (14%), with 14% of the population, including Jamie Benn, Shea Theodore, Sam Reinhart, and Ryan Nugent-Hopkins.
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