Buffalo Bills–2014: 1-0 – WK2 vs Miami – Pegulas reach agreement to buy team

[joshjull]

What a dude. Makes me want to shout.

He certainly seems like great dude.

 

[MayDay]

I don't know, but if you go by the data posted above, your taxes would go up, apparently. NYC is paying net money into your coffers. Maybe you got nothing to show for it, but that's a separate issue.

Not necessarily. It's true that upstate receives more in spending than it pays in taxes, but it's also true that what it does pay in taxes is as much as it is largely because of state mandates (on Medicaid and other programs) which are set mainly by downstate politicians and suited more to the economy of downstate.

If the state split up, likely state spending and taxes would BOTH decrease a lot in the upstate and western NY regions.

Which would decrease more, and whether that would be a net win for WNY, is unclear and I won't venture a guess. I know people here have different political opinions and it's not the place for a political argument.

 

[joshjull]

Not necessarily. It's true that upstate receives more in spending than it pays in taxes, but it's also true that what it does pay in taxes is as much as it is largely because of state mandates (on Medicaid and other programs) which are set mainly by downstate politicians and suited more to the economy of downstate.

If the state split up, likely state spending and taxes would BOTH decrease a lot in the upstate and western NY regions.

Which would decrease more, and whether that would be a net win for WNY, is unclear and I won't venture a guess. I know people here have different political opinions and it's not the place for a political argument.

Im not sure I agree with this. Proportionally the poverty that drives the mandates is just as present here as it is downstate, maybe more so. There also isn't much wealth upstate like their is downstate proportionally or otherwise.

 

[dugman]

Before the game causes us to get back to our usual game day dissection..
For as long as most of us can remember, many of us Bills fans have felt like the more invested party in a somewhat shaky dating relationship. We have spent lots of time living with the threat (real and imagined) that they will dump us in favor of someone wealthier and better looking. To try to keep them in the relationship, we have done everything we can, buying shiny new stadium upgrades, naming our stadium after them, etc. Desperately, we have even discussed buying them a new home (though we're not sure how we can possibly afford it).
This past week has been so refreshing and secure (for me, at least). To feel that they are staying for the conceivable future, and that they want to be here, changes my perception of the whole situation. We may still end up building the new stadium, but the motivation shifts from a desperation move to keep the team here to more of a long-term positive move to improve life in western New York.

Now, I just have to shake the Buffalo feeling that there has to be a John Rigas moment coming....

Nice to read about Fred Jackson this morning after spending the week hearing about Ray Rice and Adrian Peterson.

 

[MayDay]

Im not sure I agree with this. Proportionally the poverty that drives the mandates is just as present here as it is downstate, maybe more so. There also isn't much wealth upstate like their is downstate proportionally or otherwise.

Things like poverty and wealth and such wouldn't change, but almost certainly state-mandated spending would be less (and therefore, local property taxes and sales taxes etc would be less) due to different political sensibilities. Upstate as a whole is more politically moderate and almost certainly would not go forward with such lavish spending on social welfare programs.

Now, whether the current level of spending on Medicaid and the like is necessary and appropriate given the level of poverty upstate is a matter for political debate which I won't get into. I'm just saying that level of spending would likely drop if the state split up, as a prediction of fact.

 

[haseoke39]

Not necessarily. It's true that upstate receives more in spending than it pays in taxes, but it's also true that what it does pay in taxes is as much as it is largely because of state mandates (on Medicaid and other programs) which are set mainly by downstate politicians and suited more to the economy of downstate.

If the state split up, likely state spending and taxes would BOTH decrease a lot in the upstate and western NY regions.

Which would decrease more, and whether that would be a net win for WNY, is unclear and I won't venture a guess. I know people here have different political opinions and it's not the place for a political argument.

Im not sure I agree with this. Proportionally the poverty that drives the mandates is just as present here as it is downstate, maybe more so. There also isn't much wealth upstate like their is downstate proportionally or otherwise.

I think he's essentially saying if WNY seceded we'd get away from all the pesky downstate liberals and their poverty programs. So WNY would lower its taxes because it would more than proportionally cut its spending, regardless of where the poverty is. True or not, it's no longer in the same field of argument we started in.

 

[joshjull]

Things like poverty and wealth and such wouldn't change, but almost certainly state-mandated spending would be less (and therefore, local property taxes and sales taxes etc would be less) due to different political sensibilities. Upstate as a whole is more politically moderate and almost certainly would not go forward with such lavish spending on social welfare programs.

Now, whether the current level of spending on Medicaid and the like is necessary and appropriate given the level of poverty upstate is a matter for political debate which I won't get into. I'm just saying that level of spending would likely drop if the state split up, as a prediction of fact.

I wouldn't go down at all because of what relies on it. But this is getting WAY off topic.

 

[joshjull]

I think he's essentially saying if WNY seceded we'd get away from all the pesky downstate liberals and their poverty programs. So WNY would lower its taxes because it would more than proportionally cut its spending, regardless of where the poverty is. True or not, it's no longer in the same field of argument we started in.

I understand what he's saying. And Im saying folks don't fully appreciate how much big institutions in this area rely on that money to exist. (like every hospital group). Its like the Southern States that hate big government and government spending but some of those same states rely more than any other states on federal money and don't seem to realize it. But again this is WAY off topic

 

[haseoke39]

Public transportation can't help at all since there is no access for it.

What do you mean by this?

I'm not trying to be negative juts realistic. I also don't really want to see land we are finally developing after decades of stagnation turned into a football stadium and parking lots. I'd rather see more public spaces that can be used year round. There are places near the FNC that would make better sense for a football stadium in the city than the Outer Harbor.

I would certainly be open to considering a wide variety of downtown locations on the water. I must have missed it if we got down to considering just one location in particular, and if the Outer Harbor makes particularly bad sense from a traffic perspective, as well as in the scope of the wider development plan, then I'm sure there are other options.

I just think generally that a waterfront stadium in or within a couple minutes of downtown one way or another would do great things for downtown and the city's image. People think of Buffalo and they don't think of us as having a waterfront at all. 8 nationally televised views of the Lake through the overhead cam pointing through the end zone a year would help change that. I think there has to be a location that could balance traffic impacts with the benefit to our downtown overall.

 

[Beerz]

I understand what he's saying. And Im saying folks don't fully appreciate how much big institutions in this area rely on that money to exist. (like every hospital group). Its like the Southern States that hate big government and government spending but some of those same states rely more than any other states on federal money and don't seem to realize it. But again this is WAY off topic

There is a lot more you have to look at then just the numbers when discussing taxes paid out and tax money taken in.

 

[haseoke39]

I understand what he's saying. And Im saying folks don't fully appreciate how much big institutions in this area rely on that money to exist. (like every hospital group). Its like the Southern States that hate big government and government spending but some of those same states rely more than any other states on federal money and don't seem to realize it. But again this is WAY off topic

I agree. It's a very politically kneejerk argument to say we'd just cut all sorts of spending and it would all get better without considering who that money goes to and who else it indirectly supports. It's like that classic mental disconnect they measure in polling - when you ask people who wants to cut spending, they all say "I do!" But when you ask them who wants to cut any particular program, no one does.

 

[Mike McDermott]

Are the really discussing tax rates and spending on the day of arguably the biggest home opener of the past 15 years?

 

[ZeroPT*]

Are the really discussing tax rates and spending on the day of arguably the biggest home opener of the past 15 years?

Yeah. Move on guys

 

[joshjull]

What do you mean by this?



I would certainly be open to considering a wide variety of downtown locations on the water. I must have missed it if we got down to considering just one location in particular, and if the Outer Harbor makes particularly bad sense from a traffic perspective, as well as in the scope of the wider development plan, then I'm sure there are other options.

I just think generally that a waterfront stadium in or within a couple minutes of downtown one way or another would do great things for downtown and the city's image. People think of Buffalo and they don't think of us as having a waterfront at all. 8 nationally televised views of the Lake through the overhead cam pointing through the end zone a year would help change that. I think there has to be a location that could balance traffic impacts with the benefit to our downtown overall.

I assumed you meant extending the metro line to the Outer Harbor. There are no tracks that go out there or really near it. Nor would there be a way to build them because its cut off by water. Any bridge would need to be a lift or draw bridge because there is still shipping that uses that waterway.

 

[joshjull]

A area that might make some sense for near downtown would be South of FNC and the Casino. But it would require the land the Perry projects are on.

 

[TehDoak]

stream?

 

[Takeo]

Unis are amazing.

 

[misterchainsaw]

Bah. Would have liked to see Miami have to deal with the crowd first. Then Spiller takes it out from 5 yards deep instead of eating it. It NEVER works. Down the damn ball!

 

[joshjull]

Bah. Would have liked to see Miami have to deal with the crowd first. Then Spiller takes it out from 5 yards deep instead of eating it. It NEVER works. Down the damn ball!

I was thinking the same thing

 

[ZeroPT*]

stream?

http://www.vipleague.sx/american-football/245672/1/miami-dolphins-vs-buffalo-bills-live-stream-online.html\

Nice connection for Watkins and Manuel

 

[ZeroPT*]

Oh that was really close

 

[misterchainsaw]

That was a perfect throw. Too bad Watkins couldn't hold on. Nice defensive play by the Fins corner, too. Looked like he might have hurt his ribs again too...

 

[ZeroPT*]

Watkins struggling on the sideline...

 

[Takeo]

He's really struggling with the ribs. It's been a nagging thing for weeks now. Not good.

 

[kirby11]

Not feeling good about sammy and this rib injury