Brutal trades that later turned out good.

[Analyzer*]

Does anyone know of a trade that was made were one team was ridiculed for making it, but then turned out even, or even in there favour ?

I'm not sure, this is just going on a hunch, but I imagine Ozolinsh for Nolan might have been one of them ?

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[waingr0]

Wendal Clark for Mats Sundin?

 

[Mayor Bee]

[deleted]

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Alexei Zhitnik, Robb Stauber and Charlie Huddy from Los Angeles to Buffalo for Grant Fuhr, Phillipe Boucher and Denis Tsygurov.

At the time of the trade, Fuhr was washed up, Boucher was injury prone and Tsygurov was a bust. Zhitnik was a solid top pairing defenseman and was considered the best player in the trade. It appeared to be lopsided for a few years, until Boucher finally turned his career around. Fuhr also had a resurgence, although it would be with the Blues.

Another significant one from the 90s was the trade that sent Mark Recchi to Montreal in exchange for Eric Desjardins, John LeClair and Gilbert Dionne. It appeared that Montreal got the best player in that trade, but not so long after, LeClair would be one of the top LW's in the NHL and Eric Desjardins was a very good defenseman for the Flyers.

You could also add Chelios for Savard to the list. Savard was one of the most talented players in the NHL, but it didn't take long after that trade was made to find out that Montreal had given up on the better player.

You can read about the Habs trades I mentioned at the following link, http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/hockey/nhl/news/2001/02/20/sayitaintso_canadiens/

 

[Hasbro]

Wendal Clark for Mats Sundin?

From both ends, really. The Avs would have never had the space/money for Sakic Sundin and Forsberg and got Lefevre in addition to Clark, who was flipped for Lemeuix, who was trade for Rolston who was the principal in the Bourque trade.

 

[S.S. Giggy]

For the Ducks, Sergei Fedorov for Tyler Wright and Francois Beauchemin immediately comes to mind.

At the time, the whole trade was basically considered a salary dump by the Ducks who were trying to get rid of Fedorov's $8 million(but was reduced to $6 million due to the 25% cut-back). The Ducks also had exclusive rights to picking Todd Marchant up who was waived at the time due to his $2.25(something like that) million dollar contract.

For the Jackets, Fedorov was decent but was a shell of his former self.

For the Ducks, Marchant was a veteran leader, Wright played well on the 4th line but the big story was the unknown that was Francois Beauchemin.

 

[The Grouch]

Rob Ramage and Rick Wamsley for Brett Hull and Steve Bozek... Ramage was an at his peak #1 defenseman and Wamsley was a very solid goaltender, both would later help Calgary win the Stanley Cup.

Bozek was a solid fringe 2nd/3rd line winger at that point but nothing special. Hull was known as a lousy skating, lazy, selfish player. As we know now Hull would become one of the greatest goal scorers ever and arguably the most important player in St. Louis Blues history.

 

[kmad]

This isn't a blockbuster deal, but it sticks out in my mind:

4th overall pick in 2002 (Joni Pitkanen) for Ruslan Fedotenko and 2 2nd round picks (which turned out to be also-rans in Tobias Stephan and Dan Spang).

Everyone thought Tampa should have kept the 4th overall pick, as Pitkanen was the consensus 4th best player and seen as a potential #1 defenseman, which is what most felt Tampa needed at the time.

But then Fedotenko goes ahead and scores the Stanley Cup-winning goal after a monster 2004 playoff season.

I'd say Feaster knew what he was doing, but to this day I am really not sure. I think that may have been blind luck.

 

[Kyle McMahon]

Howabout the Joe Thornton trade? Brutal that Boston got such miniscule return, but they're better off with the core they have in place now than with one centered around Thornton.

 

[Brodeur]

This isn't a blockbuster deal, but it sticks out in my mind:

4th overall pick in 2002 (Joni Pitkanen) for Ruslan Fedotenko and 2 2nd round picks (which turned out to be also-rans in Tobias Stephan and Dan Spang).

Tampa also spun one of those 2nd rounders later that day to Dallas for Brad Lukowich who gave Tampa some needed depth on the backend.

I remember most of us on HF at the time were completely puzzled that the Flyers landed a top 5 pick for scraps and figured Tampa took yet another step backwards. Much like you, I still kinda question if they got enough "value" out of that deal but I suppose Feaster had a shiny championship ring to console him.

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Don't think it was a brutal trade at the time, but the Devils dealing Jason Arnott/Randy McKay/1st for Joe Nieuwendyk/Jamie Langenbrunner in 2002 basically rendered me catatonic for the rest of that day (I still apologize to my college lab partners about that).

At the time, I was mad because the Devils chose not to resign Mogilny because they thought he was too old and wanted too much money. Then they go out and get Nieuwendyk who was even older and made similar money.

The Devils were having trouble scoring and then they trade away Arnott and get back Langenbrunner who was well on pace for a 4th consecutive sub-20 goal year. The Devils had gone to back to back Cup Finals and dealing our #1 in his prime center just seemed like a terrible decision. Then Carolina bounced us out of the first round.

A year later, Langenbrunner is leads our forwards in points en route to the Cup. Although Nieuwendyk missed the last 8 games of that run with a back injury.

Even though they got the Cup in 2003, that trade still never quite sat right with me. Although Lou seemingly wanted to change the culture of the room and thought Nieuwendyk and Langenbrunner (who Lou had scouted for the '98 Olympic team) would bring in needed leadership.

 

[charliolemieux]

Wendal Clark for Mats Sundin?

MAn I remember that one. As much as I loved Clark, I was happy to get Sundin. I found I was alone.

From both ends, really. The Avs would have never had the space/money for Sakic Sundin and Forsberg and got Lefevre in addition to Clark, who was flipped for Lemeuix, who was trade for Rolston who was the principal in the Bourque trade.

Don't forget Nolan.

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Phil Kessel

for

1st '10, 2nd '10, 1st 11.

I hope.....

 

[Zil]

Park and Ratelle for Esposito and Vadnais turned out awful for the Rangers, but Esposito went on to become gm of the Rangers and draft Leetch (arguably the single most important pick in Rangers history).

 

[crobro]

rick green and ryan walter to montreal for dougjarvis,rod langway,brian englom and craig laughlin.


this is the trade................

 

[MS]

This isn't a blockbuster deal, but it sticks out in my mind:

4th overall pick in 2002 (Joni Pitkanen) for Ruslan Fedotenko and 2 2nd round picks (which turned out to be also-rans in Tobias Stephan and Dan Spang).

Everyone thought Tampa should have kept the 4th overall pick, as Pitkanen was the consensus 4th best player and seen as a potential #1 defenseman, which is what most felt Tampa needed at the time.

But then Fedotenko goes ahead and scores the Stanley Cup-winning goal after a monster 2004 playoff season.

I'd say Feaster knew what he was doing, but to this day I am really not sure. I think that may have been blind luck.

This is the one that sticks out for me, too.

And I agree that it was total blind luck.

Dealing a #4 overall pick (in a draft where that was a really valued pick, and Pitkanen was considered a sure-fire frontline NHL defender) for a middling 3rd-liner who can't PK is a terrible deal 999 times out of 1000. Except for the one time the 3rd-liner proceeds to go on a fluke playoff run where he scores 12 goals.

Will also mention the 2002 deal of Adam Oates to Philly at the trading deadline for Maxime Ouellet and 3 draft picks. Clarke was lambasted for the deal at the time (as Ouellet was considered a future franchise netminder) and Oates didn't exactly make a huge difference in Philly, but the 'huge package' of futures he gave up ended up amounting to a big fat nothing.

__________

Most of the deals being listed here were not considered 'awful' at the time they were made.

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

Will also mention the 2002 deal of Adam Oates to Philly at the trading deadline for Maxime Ouellet and 3 draft picks. Clarke was lambasted for the deal at the time (as Ouellet was considered a future franchise netminder) and Oates didn't exactly make a huge difference in Philly, but the 'huge package' of futures he gave up ended up amounting to a big fat nothing.

being that washington traded the 1st rounder they got from philly (martin vagner), along with their own second rounder (trevor daley) to move up and get semin, i'd say they won this trade just like everyone predicted they would.

oates didn't make much of a difference being that the flyers lost in 5 games in the first round, and omelette turned out to be pretty worthless. but the picks were misused, not worthless-- the picks themselves were potentially useful assets.

it was a pretty shallow draft, but philly was a good drafting team. the year before they got patrick sharp and denis seidenberg in the 3rd and 6th rounds, respectively-- great value for the players they would become. the year after they got richards significantly later than he should have gone in hindsight. there were players to be had with those picks (the red wings, several picks after the late 2nd and 3rd round picks that washington got from philly, took fleischmann and filppula), and philly gave that away.

 

[Blades of Glory]

This reminds me about the opposite. What about good trades that turned out brutal? The Savard-Chelios trade immediately comes to mind to me. At the time, it seemed fairly even as both players had durability concerns and were coming off sub-par seasons. Boy, that trade was brutal by 1993. The Habs won the Cup, sure, but imagine if they had Chelios, the way he played that year, instead of Savard, who missed most of the year and played in only 1 Finals game. I always refer to that trade as the beginning of the end for Montreal.

Nolan for Ozolinsh for Nolan was far from a brutal trade. It was a very good trade, both at the time it was made and in hindsight. Ozolinsh was one year removed from scoring 26 goals and 68 points on a third-year expansion team that shocked the world in the playoffs. Nolan had always been a dependable forward but had never quite reached the heights that franchise expected him to get to. With Valeri Kamensky and Claude Lemieux already taking up the top six RW spots, and with no defenseman remotely resembling a puck-mover, Nolan was expendable. The Sharks had a huge need for talented forwards at the time. Ozolinsh was an outstanding player in Colorado and without him, the Avs don't win the 96 Cup. Nolan was the leader of several Sharks teams who vastly outplayed their talent in the playoffs. Even deal. In 1995 and today.

 

[Bevel*]

The most obvious example that comes to mind is when the Pens traded the first overall for Ron Meighan and Anders Hakansson. Brutal. Then they traded Anders Hakansson for Kevin Stevens. Great.

 

[Sanderson]

Howabout the Joe Thornton trade? Brutal that Boston got such miniscule return, but they're better off with the core they have in place now than with one centered around Thornton.

That's not a good deal. The current roster is not a direct consequence of the Thornton-trade.

Else you could say that the Jagr to Washington deal was good for Pittsburgh because they have Crosby, Malkin and Staal now, or the Jagr to New York deal was good because the Capitals have Ovechkin, Bäckström and Green now.

Those deals weren't good at all. That the GM (or a new one) managed to rebuild the roster a few years later, isn't really build on these trades.

 

[Mantha Poodoo]

I'd argue for the Bert + Allen for Luongo one. Considering the Cats were going nowhere with Lu, he wanted out, and they're still getting nowhere...

Allen has been a solid d-man for them

Bert was traded for Matthias, who is so far looking decent for them.

Trading Lu also necessitated getting a goalie, and they used a pick they got for the Bert trade (Detroit 2nd) as part of the trade to get Vokoun (who I feel is a better goalie)

So value wise, it may not have looked very good at the time or even a year or two after, but now, it actually looks like it worked out fairly well for the Cats.

 

[Chey77]

I remember Leafs fans on these boards insisting that they had fleeced the Blues when Carlo Colaiacovo and Alex Steen were dealt for Lee Stempniak.

 

[jkrx]

That's not a good deal. The current roster is not a direct consequence of the Thornton-trade.

Else you could say that the Jagr to Washington deal was good for Pittsburgh because they have Crosby, Malkin and Staal now, or the Jagr to New York deal was good because the Capitals have Ovechkin, Bäckström and Green now.

Those deals weren't good at all. That the GM (or a new one) managed to rebuild the roster a few years later, isn't really build on these trades.

I think he's talking about that Boston played better after the trade. Sturm and Stuart are a core part of the team.

 

[thinkinfeller]

Toronto sends a 1st round pick to New Jersey for Tom Kurvers.... not a bad deal for a team looking for defensive help right?

New Jersey uses the pick to draft Scott Niedermayer.

 

[RECsGuy*]

I'd argue for the Bert + Allen for Luongo one. Considering the Cats were going nowhere with Lu, he wanted out, and they're still getting nowhere...

Allen has been a solid d-man for them

Bert was traded for Matthias, who is so far looking decent for them.

Trading Lu also necessitated getting a goalie, and they used a pick they got for the Bert trade (Detroit 2nd) as part of the trade to get Vokoun (who I feel is a better goalie)

So value wise, it may not have looked very good at the time or even a year or two after, but now, it actually looks like it worked out fairly well for the Cats.

Don't tell Canucks fans that. They still swear it's Stojanov-Naslund 2.0

 

[Briere Up There*]

I think he's talking about that Boston played better after the trade. Sturm and Stuart are a core part of the team.

Stuart was gone the next season and Sturm is a reliable 25 goal scorer when healthy. The Bruins are leaning on keen drafting (Lucic, Krejci, etc) and more importantly free agents (Chara and Savard.)

Getting the return they did on Thornton was horrendous, and the deal is the classic case of an old man (Sinden) scapegoating his team's problems through a 25/26 year old player.

 

[brianscot]

Getting the return they did on Thornton was horrendous, and the deal is the classic case of an old man (Sinden) scapegoating his team's problems through a 25/26 year old player.[/QUOTE]

Sinden didn't make that trade. Mike O'Connell did.

By that time Sinden was sitting on the beach in Florida collecting his pay for being the senior advisor for a franchise that hasn't won since 1972.

Jumbo became O'Connell's scapegoat for his horrendous post lockout team building. (Alex Zhamnov and Brad Isbister, anyone?)

Marco Sturm is a legitimate second line forward, but other than a potential 25 goal scorer, not much else positive came from it.