Brodeur win record in the regular season or Roy win record in the playoffs?

[slapKing]

Which is the more impressive goalie record?

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[Muffin]

Roy and not close at all. Roy's record might never be broken but many will break Brodeur's record with all these shoot out wins counting, well maybe less so now that teams like to split starts more evenly, you won't see goalies start 70 games that often anymore.

 

[Video Nasty]

I give the nod to Roy's record.

In addition to being a great netminder on a solid team year in and year out, you have to be on a consistently great playoff team and at worst, simply do your job much more often than not to help your team go deep year after year.

Roy had 9 playoff runs of 17+ games played. He played in 10 Conference Finals and 5 Stanley Cup Finals. Even with how great Brodeur and the Devils were, they usually got bounced in the first round in the postseasons they didn't make it to the SCF.

It's not an unbreakable record, but it seems like it will stand for awhile.

If an average-below average goalie like Fleury can end up within striking distance of Brodeur's record, 2nd place, and possibly 600 wins, I can see that one falling much sooner.

 

[Doctor No]

If an average-below average goalie like Fleury

Presuming you're referring to NHL average goaltending, you'd need a very non-standard definition to classify Fleury as "below average". What definition are you using?

 

[Thenameless]

Regular season wins are almost meaningless, as long as you can get into the playoffs - that's when the real season starts as they say. And again, while Vezinas are nice, I prefer Conn Smythes because it almost always means that you were the best player on a Cup winning team in the games that counted.

 

[Wierzbowski426]

Roy and not close at all. Roy's record might never be broken but many will break Brodeur's record with all these shoot out wins counting, well maybe less so now that teams like to split starts more evenly, you won't see goalies start 70 games that often anymore.

This is just not true.

I can see the argument for Roy.... he's got the wins when it matters most but I dont think Brodeur's record will be touched for quite some time. Brodeur started 70+ games on one of the perennial best teams in the nhl for the majority of his career.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Brodeurs is very impressive much like Cy Young, goalies simply don't play that many games anymore, he became a no 1 goalie very young and played pretty much every game for the Devils for like 2 decades thats just insane. Roy was dollar bills in the playoffs for sure and those 3 Conn Smythes are amazing, its hard to decide between the two.

 

[GermanSpitfire]

I don’t see anyone ever being able to beat Brodeurs record, IMO its unbreakable. starting goalies are playing less games in the regular season and because of it, only average around 55 games and probably around 35 wins on a good team, Far from the days of starters playing 70 games.
Your team also needs to be good around you
for a long time which is easier said than done. a guy like John Gibson may have the skill to beat Brodeurs record but circumstances out of his control cause him to not even be able to even sniff it. Add in the fact that most goalies start in the NHL around 23 years old.
Even if you average 30 wins over 20 seasons of play, without injury, you’re still 90 wins away from the record.

 

[Video Nasty]

Presuming you're referring to NHL average goaltending, you'd need a very non-standard definition to classify Fleury as "below average". What definition are you using?

A resume that has no Vezinas, never a finalist, has led the league in a major category (shutouts) just once over 16 seasons.

No All Star nods to speak of. Numerous playoff meltdowns. Some great efforts for sure, but cost his team many more times than he helped.

Average to below average GAA, Save%, and most of the individual geared goalie statistics for a majority of the seasons in his career.

I understand he's a league darling now, but average to below average sums up most of his career.

 

[Doctor No]

A resume that has no Vezinas, never a finalist, has led the league in a major category (shutouts) just once over 16 seasons.

No All Star nods to speak of. Numerous playoff meltdowns. Some great efforts for sure, but cost his team many more times than he helped.

Average to below average GAA, Save%, and most of the individual geared goalie statistics for a majority of the seasons in his career.

I understand he's a league darling now, but average to below average sums up most of his career.

You're looking at this weirdly. His career save percentage is meaningfully above average, and his career GAA is meaningfully below average.

And I'd look again if you think that the "average" NHL goaltender has a Vezina finalist on his resume.

 

[Thenameless]

You're looking at this weirdly. His career save percentage is meaningfully above average, and his career GAA is meaningfully below average.

And I'd look again if you think that the "average" NHL goaltender has a Vezina finalist on his resume.

And an average goaltender doesn't have a 16 year career, mostly as a starter. There are a lot of backups and second backups out there just struggling to make the team. A lot of guys only make the big club for a year or two, or even for just a game or two because of emergencies like the UBC kid for the Canucks or the zamboni driver that beat the Leafs.

Now, if he means average to below average for a supposedly elite goalie, then I can buy into that.

 

[I Hate Blake Coleman]

A resume that has no Vezinas, never a finalist, has led the league in a major category (shutouts) just once over 16 seasons.

No All Star nods to speak of. Numerous playoff meltdowns. Some great efforts for sure, but cost his team many more times than he helped.

Average to below average GAA, Save%, and most of the individual geared goalie statistics for a majority of the seasons in his career.

I understand he's a league darling now, but average to below average sums up most of his career.

>no vezina
>average

Pick one

 

[Video Nasty]

Ugh, Fleury fans.

 

[MadLuke]

Average to below average GAA, Save%, and most of the individual geared goalie statistics for a majority of the seasons in his career.

He is at least average, Fleury career save percentage is .913, the save percentage of the league around Fleury career is about .911, achieving to be average goaltending (something many team would have paid a fortune to have in the playoff) for so long make you in a special group too.

I don’t see anyone ever being able to beat Brodeurs record, IMO its unbreakable. starting goalies are playing less games in the regular season and because of it, only average around 55 games and probably around 35 wins on a good team, Far from the days of starters playing 70 games.

The last 3 season before covids, there is 7 case of a goaltender winning 40 games or more with Vasilevskiy getting close to do it 2 times with a 39 one.

Hellebuyck did got close to the all time record winning 44 games in 67 games on the Jets, 19 times a goaltender achieved 35W, during those 3 season's 8 goaltender won 100 games or more.

Between 95-96 to 97-98, only one goaltender went above 40 Wins in a season Brodeur with 43 one time, seven 35 Ws season during that time frame, 2 goaltender won 100 games or more during that time frame, Brodeur&Roy.

Removing ties is such a big deal to adds win's, that even with goaltender playing 60-65 instead of 65-70, it should be easier than beating Roy.

If you make the playoff 16 times you need 9.5 wins (i.e. winning games in the conference finals) has your average run, in a 30-32 teams salary cap era, that seem really hard.

In the last 10 season the goaltender with the most playoff wins
Crawford: 52
Holtby: 50

You need to triple the best total of the last 10 year's to just match Roy.

Fleury has 318 regular season W during that time frame, that 46% of Brodeur total with no Covids, no partial season and not loosing is #1 title for some season in that time frame, could be above 50%.

 

[BrindamoursNose]

Bernie Parent because he did it when there were ties ::shrug::

But jumping off my soapbox: Roy.

 

[Doctor No]

Ugh, Fleury fans.

Oh, for f***'s sake - read my post history; I'm not a Fleury fan. But God forbid someone counter your claims with actual data.

 

[Video Nasty]

Oh, for f***'s sake - read my post history; I'm not a Fleury fan. But God forbid someone counter your claims with actual data.

He’s clearly an average to below average starter. I don’t care about league averages which have backup numbers factored in.

 

[Bouboumaster]

Look. Love Brodeur, Top 10 Goalie, was a beast, etc.

The shit Roy did on those Habs teams was straight up legendary, like in "clutchiest performances by a goaltender ever". Playoff Roy is the GOAT Goaltender.
Too much cup rings to put in his ears, 3 Conn Smythe (aka more than anyone else, period), he's more untouchable than MC Hammer.

Again, love Brodeur, but only Hasek's name can be spoken in the same sentance as Patrick Roy

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Roy's record easily. Its one thing to be on a perennial playoff team, its another thing to be on a perennial playoff team that gets deep into the post season.

I mean both require help beyond a goalie's control, but if you're just comparing the two of them, Roy was much more instrumental towards building his record (4 cups, 3 MVPS) than Marty was to building his.

 

[billingtons ghost]

So, like the Avalanche fan above, I'll pump my own guy's tires.

Brodeur played behind Mike Motteau and the like for about the same time that he played behind Stevens (94-04), Dano (94-03) and Nieder (94-04). Realize he won 48 games in 06-07 with none of those guys and led the league in wins 9 years and had over 40 wins 8 years. His record will never be broken.

Roy's record will never be broken either. There's no way any goalie will be as lucky as him to even play in half as many playoff games. Even Fleury who has been lucky to play behind great teams his whole career is still 100games behind Roy.

Roy played in 77 playoff games by the time he was 25 playing behind guys like Robinson and Chelios, with the greatest defensive system in front of him. People knock the Devils for using Lemaire's trap, but where exactly did that come from if not Montreal? He played 114 playoff games with those guys before flaming out at the GM, forcing a trade and then playing behind Borque, Blake, Foote etc....

 

[MadLuke]

Brodeur played a lot of is career when the league peaked in tie game, had many forced break because of lock-outs, that does not feel a Orr/Gretzky never be broken record outside a new massive change in the league that we can affirm for certain that in the next 120 season it will never be broken (even if they continue to play around 75-90 games a season) type of situation at all.

Maybe stem cells shakes and hyberbar bubble in the train between game will make playing 75 games a year again somewhat common and just a normal goaltender achieving to play a lot of games 20 year's in a row would be in a very good position to break the record in a league with no tie, does not need the team to be good at all and he just need to good enough to keep a #1 title for a very long time, nothing more.

The league went in a direction that make accumulating regular season win's way way easier for goaltender and in a total opposite for playoff wins.

Regardless that a different question that the one asked by the op.

 

[Voodoo Child]

Roy and not close at all. Roy's record might never be broken but many will break Brodeur's record with all these shoot out wins counting, well maybe less so now that teams like to split starts more evenly, you won't see goalies start 70 games that often anymore.

No one is ever going to win almost 700 games.

Vasilevskiy is the best 'young' (26) goalie in the game, and if he won 40 year in and out for ten years, he's still about 140 wins short.

Not a slight to him or Carter Hart or John Gibson or whoever, but it's a change in era; Brodeur was a 75-game a year money goalie in a money goalie era, now starters play 55-65 in a platoon rotation.

151 career playoff wins is pretty nasty though.

 

[Voight]

You want carrying a team on your back? Patrick Roy in 1993.

Anyhow for the poll - Roy easily. As others have said, you gotta be consistent and on your game year in and year out, Nevermind the fatigue from so many deep runs. Heck, from 1996-2002 he played 17 or more games every single spring except one.

Roy also faced all of the best teams of his era in the latter half of his career.

 

[Fataldogg]

This is just not true.

I can see the argument for Roy.... he's got the wins when it matters most but I dont think Brodeur's record will be touched for quite some time. Brodeur started 70+ games on one of the perennial best teams in the nhl for the majority of his career.

I agree. Starters today are playing 50+ games a season. Brodeur was winning 40+ games a season in his prime.

No goaltenders are going to break his record if the top starters only start about 50 games a season.

 

[MadLuke]

I agree. Starters today are playing 50+ games a season. Brodeur was winning 40+ games a season in his prime.

No goaltenders are going to break his record if the top starters only start about 50 games a season.

Last time we had a full season 8 goaltender played over 60 games, 6 had 35 wins or more that, 6 the year before has well with 12 goaltenders playing 60 games or more.

numbers of goaltender with 35 wins or more during Brodeur career


93-94: 4
94-95: 0, lock-out
95-96: 2
96-97: 3
97-98: 2
98-99: 3
99-00: 4
00-01: 9
01-02: 4
02-03: 4
03-04: 2
04-05: 0, lock-0ut
05-06: 7
06-07: 10
07-08: 8
08-09: 7
09-10: 11
end of Brodeur prime

Yes for a while the league had no tie and goaltender playing over 70 games more frequent that had Brodeur playing in a higher win's environment for starting goaltender, but that about 5 season of is prime, for the rest of is prime, specially if we take into account that many nhl break an argument can easily be made that it was has rare if not rarer to win 35 games than in last 2 full season, what he was doing was far from normal.

Vasilevskiy is the best 'young' (26) goalie in the game, and if he won 40 year in and out for ten years, he's still about 140 wins short.

If would to do that, win 40 game the next 10 season he would have 559 wins versus Brodeur 557W after the end of is 36 year's old season, so he would be on "pace" to be able to beat him. That do show the high of the challenge, not only you need a ridiculous prime but brodeur won 45 games when he was 37 and added 89 win's after is prime playing until he was 42, you also ridiculous longevity.

But that also show it is a mortal record (unbeatable scenario after you run the need to x for 10 year's are still out or reach you are not ahead of those you did set them usually), it is not like Glenn Hall record of playing 502 consecutive games has a goaltender, that is unlikely to ever be broken outside some medical breakthrough that change everything. Brodeur wins record could be beat in the next 200 season without a significant rules change, style change nor a medical advancement change.

Vasilevskiy needed only 64 games to win 44 games in 2017-2018, Hellebuyck won 44 playing 67 on the jets (very solid team, but nothing all time special nor 1 in the west that year).

In the top 20 most win in a season of all time we have Price in 2014/15, Vasilevskiy in 17/18, Hellebuyck in 17/18, except from Brodeur we only have Barrasso on the all time great Pens of 92-93 (84 games season) from the 90s, not from Roy not from Hasek, way less than from the 10s.