Proposal: Brayden Schenn To Colorado

[Cousin Eddie]

To Colorado
Brayden Schenn

To St. Louis
Alexander Kerfoot
2019 1st (top 10 protected)
Pavel Francouz (for those unfamiliar he was the best goaltender in the KHL last year and currently leads the AHL in wins and is 5th in SV%)

Click to read more...

 

[Weiss1604]

I would love to discuss the merits & demerits of this offer but right now words fail me . Appreciate you put some thought into this but ...... Also i sense a bit of spin going on here , shame on you lol .
Oh & i think most knowledgeable Blues fans would without doubt say thanks but no thanks .

 

[Spilot23]

I doubt Schenn gets traded in the divison without an overpayment. As an Avs fan the piece that I'm afraid of giving up is Francouz man I would be afraid running a tandem of Grubs and Martin? Unless in this scenario we have Varly signed.

 

[Blueston]

Don't see the appeal here for Blues. Pass.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

Don't see the appeal here for Blues. Pass.

Out of curiosity what would Blues fans look for? I based the value on a previous thread I saw where I saw a Blues fan mention his value is probably around a 1st + B level prospect. Kerfoot alone has as many points as Schenn this year so I thought maybe he’d be a little more desirable than a second tier prospect.

As an Avs fan I’d absolutely love to have Schenn. I could see him as a potential UFA target anyway considering Barrie and Nate are his bff’s and the Avs need for secondary scoring up front.

 

[josra33]

Out of curiosity what would Blues fans look for? I based the value on a previous thread I saw where I saw a Blues fan mention his value is probably around a 1st + B level prospect. Kerfoot alone has as many points as Schenn this year so I thought maybe he’d be a little more desirable than a second tier prospect.

As an Avs fan I’d absolutely love to have Schenn. I could see him as a potential UFA target anyway considering Barrie and Nate are his bff’s and the Avs need for secondary scoring up front.

I think it’s a solid offer for Schenn. Top 6 young center, mid to late 1st and a goalie prospect whose handling AHL really well.

 

[The Abusement Park]

I like that deal. I’d also be willing to make some tweaks here and there to make it happen. Imagine Schenn replacing Captain Contract Year on the PP.

 

[Eltuna]

I like Schenn. I think Varlamov (if the blues would be interested in him) + Colorado 2019 1st would be interesting. If Varly is of no interest to the blues, Something like

Avs: Schenn
Blues: Col 2019 1st, Philly 2019 2nd, Philly 2020 2nd
Flyers: Varlamov

Is fair value I think.

 

[Meeqs]

To Colorado
Brayden Schenn

To St. Louis
Alexander Kerfoot
2019 1st (top 10 protected)
Pavel Francouz (for those unfamiliar he was the best goaltender in the KHL last year and currently leads the AHL in wins and is 5th in SV%)

As an Avs fan I'd pass (and possibly Stl might as well). Schenn has been killing it but I don't think the difference between him and Kerf is a 1st in a really solid draft.

Also until the Avs figure out what is going on with Varly I don't see Franc being available.

Finally deals within the division aren't usually realistic. This deal in particular just doesn't make the Avs that much better for the risk they'd be taking on.

 

[Meeqs]

I like Schenn. I think Varlamov (if the blues would be interested in him) + Colorado 2019 1st would be interesting. If Varly is of no interest to the blues, Something like

Avs: Schenn
Blues: Col 2019 1st, Philly 2019 2nd, Philly 2020 2nd
Flyers: Varlamov

Is fair value I think.

If the Avs were moving Varly and he could get that type of return, you'd half to think they'd just cut the blues out of this deal and take the picks. Although I don't think either of those 2 circumstances are the case.

 

[Eltuna]

If the Avs were moving Varly and he could get that type of return, you'd half to think they'd just cut the blues out of this deal and take the picks. Although I don't think either of those 2 circumstances are the case.

Not necessarily, trading Varly for pure futures sends the same message to the Avalanche players that trading Stastny did to the blues players last year. This way, the Avs get the best of both worlds, the asset management crowd is happy and the go for it crowd is happy. Trading your #1G for picks only as a playoff team is not something The Avs are going to do.

Also, two 2nds doesn’t sound at all like an overpayment for Varlamov, he’s having a great year and has good pedigree.

 

[rumrokh]

We have no indication the Blues are blowing it up. All we've heard is that they're listening, but don't have any intention of trading core players. I consider Schenn to be part of that core unless he won't extend in the off-season. If we get to that point, Kerfoot and a 1st is a pretty good offer, but I wouldn't be surprised if a team outside of the division would at least match that.

 

[Meeqs]

Not necessarily, trading Varly for pure futures sends the same message to the Avalanche players that trading Stastny did to the blues players last year. This way, the Avs get the best of both worlds, the asset management crowd is happy and the go for it crowd is happy. Trading your #1G for picks only as a playoff team is not something The Avs are going to do.

Also, two 2nds doesn’t sound at all like an overpayment for Varlamov, he’s having a great year and has good pedigree.

Most of this is why I noted I don't expect it to happen. With Varly being the clear #1 and the Avs in a solid playoff spot as of today the most likely option is they let it reach UFA and figure it out there.

With that said IF they were going to move him, 2 2nds for a goalie rental would be an absurdly high price. Goalies just don't return anything in trades unless it is a long term thing. The Avs are still a young building team with a long term focus so 2 additional 2nds would be huge.

 

[Meeqs]

We have no indication the Blues are blowing it up. All we've heard is that they're listening, but don't have any intention of trading core players. I consider Schenn to be part of that core unless he won't extend in the off-season. If we get to that point, Kerfoot and a 1st is a pretty good offer, but I wouldn't be surprised if a team outside of the division would at least match that.

Imo the last 3 years the Blues have run out of answers and have no idea what to do. They just have been falling short of the mark for 6+ years now and they have tried pretty much everything with no results. They seem at a serious loss and likely don't know what they will do themselves.

 

[Blueston]

Out of curiosity what would Blues fans look for? I based the value on a previous thread I saw where I saw a Blues fan mention his value is probably around a 1st + B level prospect. Kerfoot alone has as many points as Schenn this year so I thought maybe he’d be a little more desirable than a second tier prospect.

As an Avs fan I’d absolutely love to have Schenn. I could see him as a potential UFA target anyway considering Barrie and Nate are his bff’s and the Avs need for secondary scoring up front.

Whoever said 1st and B prospect is seriously selling him short. That might be an okay offer if he were UFA after this year, but he's not. No need to deal him unless really made sense for us. Would need a top asset to deal him to division rival, something like Makar or Sens 1st. Don't see how a late 1st, 3rd line center, and 28 year old goalie "prospect" moves the needle for us.

 

[rumrokh]

Imo the last 3 years the Blues have run out of answers and have no idea what to do. They just have been falling short of the mark for 6+ years now and they have tried pretty much everything with no results. They seem at a serious loss and likely don't know what they will do themselves.

First part of that time period, they lacked an impact center. Stastny was an okay bandaid, but he was injured all the time and never meshed with anybody. They finally got Schenn last year, O'Reilly this year, and Thomas coming along, so the center issue is gone; but their goaltending, overall speed, and defensive depth has not improved (mostly due to Bouwmeester and Gunnarsson fading). Factor in some untimely injuries and some questionable coaching and here we are.

Their core is still fairly young (younger than most people realize, it seems) and they have some great talent coming along. They just need that talent to arrive with a bang fairly quickly or they need to retool and bolster that next wave of talent.

They've done a solid job of building around Pietrangelo, but he was their only high impact addition by drafting high. The teams that have climbed past them lately are built around several high-end players acquired by drafting high repeatedly. As good as those later draft picks have been for the Blues, they aren't quite up to the same impact level. They needed to be worse for a little longer several years ago or they need at least one of those later-round steals to become elite. Parayko is good but not there. Fabbri's injuries really carved away that chance. Dunn is a work in progress. Husso is still unknown. Thomas, Kyrou, and a couple other guys have serious skill, but need more time. It's a rough place to be as a GM. The rebuild roadmap wasn't quite as clear as it is now, but maybe Armstrong should have seen it coming and tanked harder a long time ago, dunno.

 

[Meeqs]

Whoever said 1st and B prospect is seriously selling him short. That might be an okay offer if he were UFA after this year, but he's not. No need to deal him unless really made sense for us. Would need a top asset to deal him to division rival, something like Makar or Sens 1st. Don't see how a late 1st, 3rd line center, and 28 year old goalie "prospect" moves the needle for us.

While I completely agree with and understand the point you're getting across, in that it would take something very enticing to have STL trade Schenn, it is also equally silly to demand assets that STL doesn't have the pieces to ever acquire. Countering an honest trade proposal that likely wouldn't be enough with an absurd counter proposal in the other direction isn't going to lead anywhere productive. Its still important to keep realistic conversations realistic

 

[Meeqs]

First part of that time period, they lacked an impact center. Stastny was an okay bandaid, but he was injured all the time and never meshed with anybody. They finally got Schenn last year, O'Reilly this year, and Thomas coming along, so the center issue is gone; but their goaltending, overall speed, and defensive depth has not improved (mostly due to Bouwmeester and Gunnarsson fading). Factor in some untimely injuries and some questionable coaching and here we are.

Their core is still fairly young (younger than most people realize, it seems) and they have some great talent coming along. They just need that talent to arrive with a bang fairly quickly or they need to retool and bolster that next wave of talent.

They've done a solid job of building around Pietrangelo, but he was their only high impact addition by drafting high. The teams that have climbed past them lately are built around several high-end players acquired by drafting high repeatedly. As good as those later draft picks have been for the Blues, they aren't quite up to the same impact level. They needed to be worse for a little longer several years ago or they need at least one of those later-round steals to become elite. Parayko is good but not there. Fabbri's injuries really carved away that chance. Dunn is a work in progress. Husso is still unknown. Thomas, Kyrou, and a couple other guys have serious skill, but need more time. It's a rough place to be as a GM. The rebuild roadmap wasn't quite as clear as it is now, but maybe Armstrong should have seen it coming and tanked harder a long time ago, dunno.

They certainly have always had talented players and assets but they never had a long term plan or proper vision to have a core that could compete and as the current players keep getting better and moves upon moves leave them in the same place it seems as though the task is likely too great for the current management to overcome imo and they seriously seem to have this idea be setting in as well. They are trying their hardest but they really seem to be lacking a good macro approach, too many players are at the age where a large pivot would be possible and the style they're built for just isn't successful in the current NHL.

 

[Eltuna]

Most of this is why I noted I don't expect it to happen. With Varly being the clear #1 and the Avs in a solid playoff spot as of today the most likely option is they let it reach UFA and figure it out there.

With that said IF they were going to move him, 2 2nds for a goalie rental would be an absurdly high price. Goalies just don't return anything in trades unless it is a long term thing. The Avs are still a young building team with a long term focus so 2 additional 2nds would be huge.

Pure rental goalie trades for goalies of Varlamov’s caliber are few and far between so it’s difficult to find comparables but Miller returned a large return. Not UFA’s to be, but Grubauer and Talbot (close to UFA) both returned a 2nd rounder plus and were much less proven than Varlamov. Would a 2nd + 3rd be more reasonable? Maybe, but calling two 2nds for Varlamov as absurd is most definitely incorrect. If traded he could get a decent return.

 

[Meeqs]

Pure rental goalie trades for goalies of Varlamov’s caliber are few and far between so it’s difficult to find comparables but Miller returned a large return. Not UFA’s to be, but Grubauer and Talbot (close to UFA) both returned a 2nd rounder plus and were much less proven than Varlamov. Would a 2nd + 3rd be more reasonable? Maybe, but calling two 2nds for Varlamov as absurd is most definitely incorrect. If traded he could get a decent return.

Age/RFAvsUFA played a big factor in those deals, as well as would Varlys injury history. Look at what Bishop got, was pretty much nothing.

The main thing I am getting at is that 2 2nds (that would be pretty high) would be a great return for him and I don't see anyway that the Avs would get a return much better than that. For a team that is very soon going to be right up against the Cap similar to where Tor is headed, high end picks and prospects will likely be the most intriguing assets to the Avs for the next few years, giving them ELCs for flexibility and pieces that can be used for rentals should they feel it appropriate.

 

[Patagonia]

I like the deal which seems fair, but can't see the AVs agreeing if Schenn becomes a UFA after next season. Unless they have some commitment on extending or chasing the Cup there is unlikely a deal to be made.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Not enough to the Blues IMO. Francouz could be an interesting piece for a team like the Blues. But Kerfoot as the centerpiece doesn't get the job done I don't think.

 

[Weiss1604]

I like Schenn. I think Varlamov (if the blues would be interested in him) + Colorado 2019 1st would be interesting. If Varly is of no interest to the blues, Something like

Avs: Schenn
Blues: Col 2019 1st, Philly 2019 2nd, Philly 2020 2nd
Flyers: Varlamov

Is fair value I think.

With all due respect this would not suit the Blues needs in anyway , shape or form . We are not rebuilding .

 

[Dominicr]

To Colorado
Brayden Schenn

To St. Louis
Alexander Kerfoot
2019 1st (top 10 protected)
Pavel Francouz (for those unfamiliar he was the best goaltender in the KHL last year and currently leads the AHL in wins and is 5th in SV%)

If the first is Ottawa’s first (you can have top 3 protected but not 10) I’d say yes.

 

[The Abusement Park]

If the first is Ottawa’s first (you can have top 3 protected but not 10) I’d say yes.

A top 10 pick plus a top 6 player for Schenn is a huge overpay.