Player Discussion Braden Holtby Appreciation Thread

[g00n]

From my perspective, I'm not sure what's going on but I think it all revolves around problems with lateral movement. It could be mental issues leading to compensations, or it could be a lingering injury forcing adjustments and causing frustration.

If I had to guess I'd say he's got some kind of lower body tweak that's not serious enough to keep him out but is just bad enough to affect his play, particularly when pushing off or stopping.

For most of the year his post-to-post movement has not been quick and coordinated. He's looked sloppy overall, as if he has trouble recovering or stabilizing after his first move. I don't think I've ever seen him slide so far across and out of the crease in his entire career.

When he was getting beaten a lot on the rush under Oates they had him playing deeper to give himself more time to react, and he was cheating off the post to cover the pass. It appears he's doing the same thing now after a few months where he had zero chance on cross-ice passes (including the ASG). Is he doing this on his own, or is he being coached to do it?

This practically screams lower body injury to me. If that's the case then Gruby needs to get some time in net while it heals.

 

[ovikovy817]

1) He's injured and the organization don't want others to know?
2) In the past we had some good success with backups playing in the playoffs, (Varly, Neuvy, Holtby)
3) At this point, I'd be ok to let Gruby be the starter until the end of the regular season (10 games for him, 6 for Holtby) or even 11 and 5. Let him think about other things than hockey, and then put him in the net for R1G1.
Or if Gruby finish the season in those 10-11 games with .950 SV% and 1.5 GAA let him start the playoffs until the first loss.

 

[OV Rocks]

I have been thinking this all season. Holtby has been too focused on his technique and his positioning to make a save. I think that he believes he is so fundamentally strong that he should always be in the right spot to make the save as apposed to doing whatever he can to stop the puck from getting past him.

The easy short version, the shot comes and Holtby thinks he is in the right position to always make the save. What he needs to be doing is going all out to stop the puck no matter what position he is in.



However.......

If I knew anything about hockey I would be in it

 

[sashae]

There've been a couple of articles about Holtby's adjustments to Scott Murray from Mitch Korn, particularly around his tracking of plays for positioning (head trajectory) which is different from Korn's. I'm curious how much that has played a role -- ie, is Holtby overthinking things too much based on the new inputs from Murray?

Holtby keeps adapting with latest Capitals goaltending coach

https://www.washingtonpost.com/spor...2721f8-b81c-11e7-9e58-e6288544af98_story.html

 

[sashae]

Timely:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...a-bit-as-braden-holtby-continues-to-struggle/

 

[g00n]

There've been a couple of articles about Holtby's adjustments to Scott Murray from Mitch Korn, particularly around his tracking of plays for positioning (head trajectory) which is different from Korn's. I'm curious how much that has played a role -- ie, is Holtby overthinking things too much based on the new inputs from Murray?

Holtby keeps adapting with latest Capitals goaltending coach

https://www.washingtonpost.com/spor...2721f8-b81c-11e7-9e58-e6288544af98_story.html

Korn once compared making changes during the season to racing in the Indy 500, saying you can change tires but not the motor, but praised Holtby for being able to make significant style changes in 2014-15. During that season, Holtby worked hard to make sure he didn't get opened up or spread out in his movements and saves, with Korn stressing the importance of keeping his limbs tight without feeling robotic.

This part of his game seems to be gone. If they've been trying new things it could explain some of what's happening. This looks a lot like when Oates was tinkering with his game, before Korn came in.

 

[Ovechkins Wodka]

Bench him

 

[AtNightWeFly]

Timely:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...a-bit-as-braden-holtby-continues-to-struggle/

I'll believe it when I actually see it with my own 2 eyes. He says this but keeps putting Holtby in net game after game and essentially drowning the team.

 

[Bananas]

This is a mental problem 100 percent. Holtby’s been going bonkers for over a year and whoever’s teaching him this season is obviously not the answer. That was obvious a while ago but this team moves extremely deliberately for major decisions - which explains why they’re usually well behind the curve in that regard. I’m sure the goalie coach is someone’s buddy so they don’t want to ruffle his feathers fml...

In Braden's defense, the team rode him extremely hard for several seasons. He might be a little burned out and it’s hard to blame him. I’m still confident in Holtby long term but he’s in dire need of a reset...

 

[artilector]

The dream scenario is to have a veteran suck-core of Holtby, Oshie, and Carlson (once the Caps give him 8m/yr or whatever), heh.

Anyway, at least the Holtby contract is not super-long. This could simplify the eventual transition to Samsonov, and in the meantime I doubt the Caps chances will take a hit with Grubauer, maybe the opposite. As for wasted cap space and tanked trade value, well, these are the Caps.

Pure speculation -- Holtby might just need some time away from hockey. He seems like a guy that's wound extremely tight -- when that's the case, sometimes a significant adjustment requires a reboot.

 

[Bananas]

The dream scenario is to have a veteran suck-core of Holtby, Oshie, and Carlson (once the Caps give him 8m/yr or whatever), heh.

Anyway, at least the Holtby contract is not super-long. This could simplify the eventual transition to Samsonov, and in the meantime I doubt the Caps chances will take a hit with Grubauer, maybe the opposite. As for wasted cap space and tanked trade value, well, these are the Caps.

Pure speculation -- Holtby might just need some time away from hockey. He seems like a guy that's wound extremely tight -- when that's the case, sometimes a significant adjustment requires a reboot.

Well on that note Holtby’s setting up for a rather long summer...

 

[g00n]

Holtby reminded me of Roy when he came up. Similar cerebral player with some seething emotions beneath the surface and a few quirks. I guess we can hope that Holtby mirrors Roy's Stanley Cup years. Roy did not have great or even very good stats during those regular seasons but delivered some of the best performances of his career in the playoffs.

 

[AlexBrovechkin8]

These struggles aren't new. He's been garbage since the end of last season. He's coming up on an entire year's worth of being a liability.

 

[Calicaps]

Holtby reminded me of Roy when he came up. Similar cerebral player with some seething emotions beneath the surface and a few quirks. I guess we can hope that Holtby mirrors Roy's Stanley Cup years. Roy did not have great or even very good stats during those regular seasons but delivered some of the best performances of his career in the playoffs.

From your lips...

 

[twabby]

Hard to disagree. Grubauer, despite perhaps easier matchups of late, has earned a shot at being a starter right now. Holtby has been hung out to dry by the defense but he's also done nothing of late to earn more starts either. I wouldn't expect it to solve any of the team's deeper problems but they still owe it to themselves and the fans to ice the best roster possible and right now Holtby is hurting the team.

It also could help them make a better evaluation this offseason since they are unlikely to keep both Holtby and Grubauer.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

What a dumb point....”hey player is playing great, but beware when he isnt”.....GTFO Japers.

 

[OV Rocks]

What a dumb point....”hey player is playing great, but beware when he isnt”.....GTFO Japers.

There is a place for analytics in the NHL but nothing can measure winning. If you play the guys that give you the best chance to win each night (hot, cold, fast, slow, whoever) it will always trump analytics. Japers and RMNB for that matter are a lot of guys who never played the sport but insist their knowledge is greater based on analytics and just analytics alone.

I have started to tone them both out for that reason

 

[g00n]

Holtby should have a chance to win the job back by the end of the season, but whoever's hot by then needs to be the starter.

I think back to 05-06 and the situation between Gerber and Ward. Gerber played in 60 regular season games for the Canes that year and was considered a top 10 goaltender in the league. But it was the rookie Ward who stepped into the starting role in the first round after Gerber struggled, eventually taking the Canes to the Cup and winning the Smythe for his efforts.

Another example is Antti Niemi in his first year with Chicago. Huet the veteran started more games in the regular season but Niemi was the guy in the Playoffs.

So who knows. Point being, the Caps should not feel limited by money or seniority. Play the guys who give you the best chance to win THAT GAME.

 

[twabby]

What a dumb point....”hey player is playing great, but beware when he isnt”.....GTFO Japers.

It's more that the goaltenders don't have any room for error right now. If the goaltenders don't have a good to great game then the team will lose given the state of the team defense. Contrast that with the past few seasons where the team could often bail out the goaltenders when they had an off night.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

I think we all get that Holtby isn't saving their bacon on the ice like always. To Goon's point, it's about playing the guy who gives you the best chance to win. Right now that's Gruby. I feel like Boudreau struggled with this same decision and went down with the ship instead of making the tough choice. Trotz likely to do the same in the long run unless Gruby can play well in more starts and force it.

 

[Ovechkins Wodka]

Remember when I was called crazy last season when I said Holtby was a system goalie and we should sell high and save his cap space.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

This is a mental problem 100 percent. Holtby’s been going bonkers for over a year and whoever’s teaching him this season is obviously not the answer. That was obvious a while ago but this team moves extremely deliberately for major decisions - which explains why they’re usually well behind the curve in that regard. I’m sure the goalie coach is someone’s buddy so they don’t want to ruffle his feathers fml...

In Braden's defense, the team rode him extremely hard for several seasons. He might be a little burned out and it’s hard to blame him. I’m still confident in Holtby long term but he’s in dire need of a reset...

He played the previous two years on President's Trophy winning teams that defended very well. Holtby had one of the easiest jobs in the league until this season.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

Holtby reminded me of Roy when he came up. Similar cerebral player with some seething emotions beneath the surface and a few quirks. I guess we can hope that Holtby mirrors Roy's Stanley Cup years. Roy did not have great or even very good stats during those regular seasons but delivered some of the best performances of his career in the playoffs.

Roy won the Stanley Cup as a rookie. Murray is a more accurate comparison in this case.

 

[g00n]

Roy won the Stanley Cup as a rookie. Murray is a more accurate comparison in this case.

I think you're mixing up my posts. One compared Holtby to Roy as a player while looking at the possibility of elevating his game in the playoffs like Roy. The other dealt with young/rookie goalies rising to the occasion per a coach's decision as a comparison for Gruby, not Holtby. I purposely left out Murray because he was an injury fill-in.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

I think you're mixing up my posts. One compared Holtby to Roy as a player while looking at the possibility of elevating his game in the playoffs like Roy. The other dealt with young/rookie goalies rising to the occasion per a coach's decision as a comparison for Gruby, not Holtby. I purposely left out Murray because he was an injury fill-in.

Oh ok, my mistake.