Bob Cole Division 1st Round - Belfast Giants vs Toronto Maple Leafs

[TheDevilMadeMe]

Belfast Giants

General Manager: Velociraptor
Home Venue: Odyssey Arena

Head Coach: Fred Shero
Captain: Bobby Clarke
Assistant Captains: Shane Doan, Derian Hatcher

ROSTER

Doug Bentley - Bobby Clarke - Teemu Selanne
Fred "Bun" Cook - Eric Lindros - Ken Hodge
Kirk Muller - Don McKenney - Shane Doan
Gregg Sheppard - Steven Stamkos - Anders Hedberg

Paul Coffey - Art Coulter
Derian Hatcher - Jim Neilson
Zinetula Bilyaletdinov - Andrei Markov

Cecil "Tiny" Thompson
Curtis Joseph

Spares:
Bob Armstrong, D
Neal Broten, C
Pit Martin, C/RW
Alex Tanguay, LW

Powerplay:

PP1: Eric Lindros - Bobby Clarke - Teemu Selanne
Doug Bentley - Paul Coffey

PP2: Bun Cook - Steven Stamkos - Ken Hodge
Andrei Markov - Art Coulter

Penalty Kill:

PK1: Bobby Clarke - Gregg Sheppard
Derian Hatcher - Art Coulter

PK2: Don McKenney - Kirk Muller
Zinetula Bilyaletdinov - Jim Neilson​

VS.

Toronto Maple Leafs

Coach Mike Babcock

Paul Kariya- Phil Esposito (C) - Babe Dye
Dave Andreychuk (A) -Pat Lafontaine -Alexander Mogilny
Dick Duff- Dale Hunter -Ron Ellis
Gaye Stewart- Doug Jarvis - Bill Goldsworthy
John Ferguson -Paul Henderson

Chris Chelios (A) -Guy Lapointe
Sergie Gonchar- Vladimir Konstantinov
Wally Stanowski - Ron Greschner
Dion Phaneuf

Vladislav Tretiak
Vladimir Dzrullia
Andy Moog​

PP Unit 1
Kariya-Esposito Dye
Chelios Gonchar

PP Unit 2
Andreychuk -LaFontaine Mogilny
Lapointe Phaneuf


PK Unit 1
Ellis -Hunter
Chelios Stanowski

Duff Jarvis
Lapointe. Konstantinov
​

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[Velociraptor]

Best of luck, LL. Fairly busy schedule this week, however I will try and add a few thoughts on the matchup.

 

[Leaf Lander]

Me too I work 45 hrs a week

Al the best

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

Moved all the work talk to the chat thread

 

[Velociraptor]

I'd like to make the following change to the lineup:

PP1: Eric Lindros - Bobby Clarke - Teemu Selanne
Doug Bentley - Paul Coffey

PP2: Bun Cook - Steven Stamkos - Ken Hodge
Andrei Markov - Art Coulter

Lindros will move up, Stamkos will man the half-boards on the second unit when Belfast has the puck in the offensive zone.

Coaching/Leadership

Shero is the better coach here, I'd call Babcock a below-average coach at this level however he is my favorite coach in the NHL by a fair margin. I wouldn't say he gives your team an advantage.

Who are your captains?

First Lines

You have some nice pieces but I don't really see how this line works? Kariya and Dye are not guys like Cashman and Hodge that could do the work on the boards and corners to get the puck to Espo. Dye did not seem to be a playmaker, just an elite shooter. Kariya is a playmaker which is probably your saving grace, and he'll be heavily relied upon to setup both Esposito and Dye. An unusual setup for a line built around Esposito, will probably score most of their goals on the rush and not the traditional way Phil got his points.

Bobby Clarke is flanked by Bentley, who is a fast, play-making winger and Teemu Selanne, an elite goal-scorer. The line has defensive conscience and assemble into a unit that can effectively put the puck in the net.

Advantage: Belfast

Second Lines

Lafontaine-Mogilny have proven chemistry, although it was one really spectacular year. Andreychuk's only real attractive attribute at the ATD level is his PP ability. His ES is weak among second liners, overall not a top-end second line that has zero defensive backbone.

Cook, albeit not an overly strong offensive producer has a Vs7 in the same neighbourhood as Mogilny/Lafontaine.

103 | Pat LaFontaine | 78.8
104 | Hooley Smith | 78.8
105 | Doug Weight | 78.6
106 | Cecil Dillon | 78.4
107 | Eric Staal | 78.4
108 | Brad Richards | 78.4
109 | Alexander Mogilny | 78.1
110 | Phil Watson | 78.1
111 | Alexei Yashin | 77.6
112 | Daniel Sedin | 77.3
113 | Bernie Federko | 77.3
114 | Vincent Lecavalier | 77.2
115 | Henrik Zetterberg | 76.7
116 | Bun Cook | 76.6

Lindros is an elite second liner and an imposing physical threat, Ken Hodge had the luxury of playing with good linemates (Orr, Espo and Cashman), but was the second best offensive player of his line by a sizeable margin having much better offensive finishes than Cashman and was used in a similar role. This is also a very physical line that can produce offense and not be bullied by checking lines.

Advantage: Belfast

Third Lines

Good unit for the Leafs, rough line with some offensive ability. This I imagine will be the Leafs' primary checking line, thankfully I believe both my first and second line have what it takes to neutralize the effectiveness of checking lines such as these. Clarke is extremely physical, and the quickness and elusiveness of Selanne and Bentley will give some checking units fits. As mentioned above, our second line is built to matchup with checking lines.

We roll a third line of McKenney, an adept two-way forward who excelled at both ends of the ice. Kirk Muller, a physical forward who could play an offensive game as well and Shane Doan, a strong two-way, physical player. In terms of shutdown ability it is not on the same level as the Leafs' unit, however it is more potent offensively and is at least its equal defensively.

Advantage: Belfast

Fourth Lines

Decent fourth line, Gaye Stewart is a decent offensive fourth liner and I'd say Doug Jarvis is an elite fourth line centre. Goldsworthy is probably better suited as a spare in a 28-team league but he is a favorite of mine and a strong goal-scorer who was good in his own zone.

Belfast's fourth line is the sum of special teams players, and does not make up a solid defensive unit. Sheppard was a decent defensive player at ES, but was known as an elite penalty killer. Stamkos led the league in goals twice and is a PP fixture. Hedberg is a playmaker who can also score and play responsibly in his own zone. This line will not see too much time at ES but could be an offensive threat in limited minutes.

Advantage: Toronto

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

I edited Belfast's new PP units into the OP.

If anyone else has any roster changes, post them and I'll edit the OP accordingly. If I haven't edited the OP after a day or two, PM me.

 

[Leaf Lander]

I'd like to make the following change to the lineup:

PP1: Eric Lindros - Bobby Clarke - Teemu Selanne
Doug Bentley - Paul Coffey

PP2: Bun Cook - Steven Stamkos - Ken Hodge
Andrei Markov - Art Coulter

Lindros will move up, Stamkos will man the half-boards on the second unit when Belfast has the puck in the offensive zone.

Coaching/Leadership

Shero is the better coach here, I'd call Babcock a below-average coach at this level however he is my favorite coach in the NHL by a fair margin. I wouldn't say he gives your team an advantage.


Babcock has won more games as a. Coach and has won everything at every coach level except jack adams. Babcock plays a puck possession game that will best fit my team. He is the perfect coach. Imo!

First Lines

You have some nice pieces but I don't really see how this line works? Kariya and Dye are not guys that could do the work on the boards and corners to get the puck to Espo. Dye did not seem to be a playmaker, just an elite shooter. Kariya is a playmaker which is probably your saving grace, and he'll be heavily relied upon to setup both Esposito and Dye. An unusual setup for a line built around Esposito, will probably score most of their goals on the rush and not the traditional way Phil got his points.



The leafs won 't have to play the bruins style Babcock will have them play a puck possession game in a less muck it up atd match.

Phil can score on rebounds and garbage goals and top ins within 10 feet of the goal keep. Kariya is a deft playmaker and all three players for a time were. Considered for a time as one of the best in the game during the era they played.


Advantage: Leafs

Second Lines

Lafontaine-Mogilny have proven chemistry, although it was one really spectacular year. Andreychuk's only real attractive attribute at the ATD level is his PP ability. His ES is weak among second liners, overall not a top-end second line that has zero defensive backbone.

Just take out am sports forcaster for the last 12 yrs of his career.

Mogilny and Andreychuk could play a 2 way game . Mogilny game evolved before he arrived InToronto.
Lafontaine point per game avg is one of the best in nhl history. With over 1400 career nhl goals between them.

Lindra is is a great player but can you depend on him because of his process to get injured
Hopefully you have an elite center man to fill in when he goes down.

Your other line mates are 2 nd tier offensive threats at best.

Advantage: Leafs/B]

Third Lines

Good unit for the Leafs, rough line with some offensive ability. This I imagine will be the Leafs' primary checking line, thankfully I believe both my first and second line have what it takes to neutralize the effectiveness of checking lines such as these.


Esposito is great leader who was immovable physical presence in front of the net who scored as many goals as selanne in less seasons. and the quickness and elusiveness of Kariya and Dye will give all opposing units fits.

We roll a third line of McKenney, an adept two-way forward who excelled at both ends of the ice. Kirk Muller, a physical forward who could play an offensive game as well and Shane Doan, a strong two-way, physical player. In terms of shutdown ability it is not on the same level as the Leafs' unit, however it is more potent offensively and is at least its equal defensively.

Ellis hunter Duff all played a great 2 way game and they were deadly opportunists. Offensively the. 2 lines pretty much match except in one stay Stanley Cup winning goals.

Advantage: Leafs

Fourth Lines

Decent fourth line, Gaye Stewart is a decent offensive fourth liner and I'd say Doug Jarvis is an elite fourth line centre. Goldsworthy is probably better suited as a spare in a 28-team league but he is a favorite of mine and a strong goal-scorer who was good in his own zone.

Belfast's fourth line is the sum of special teams players, and does not make up a solid defensive unit. Sheppard was a decent defensive player at ES, but was known as an elite penalty killer. Stamkos led the league in goals twice and is a PP fixture. Hedberg is a playmaker who can also score and play responsibly in his own zone. This line will not see too much time at ES but could be an offensive threat in limited minutes.

Advantage: Toronto

Stamkos is a great player but he has only played 4 full nhl seasons which makes him a great minor league player. While Goldsworthy played a great 2 way game for more then a dozen seasons.

Jarvis was a dynamic player who wss so great defensively that Montreal went out of their way to dupe the captain less leafs to go and get him. Now he wanted a greater offensive role but they sold him on being part of a team that would in many championships


Goaltending
Advantage leafs.
Tretiak is vastly superior to tiny Thompson who will see the assessment of Andreychuk and Esposito more then the pucks flying into his net.

 

[Velociraptor]

You'll need to post some resources for Mogilny and Andreychuk being two-way players. Dye is not a playmaker, he's a shoot-first player which is not ideal on Esposito's wing.

My first line is superior to yours, I'm not sure if yours will work the way you think it will, I cannot see very good line chemistry especially with nobody to do corner work to get the puck to Phil. Derian Hatcher and Art Coulter will see a lot of Paul Kariya in the corner and won't be afraid to take the body.

What are you referring to with Stanley Cup winning goals? Please elaborate this.

We're more than aware what Stamkos is given his sample size, he lead the league in goal-scoring twice which is a better accolade than the majority of the forwards on your side.

To defense:

First Units

Both solid for its own reasons, Coffey runs the Giants' offense and should increase the effectiveness of the Giants' offensive attack. Coulter is a #2 that can look after Coffey's lack of defensive game.

Leafs pairing is better, two solid first pairing guys led by Chelios who is a great piece.

Advantage: Leafs

Second Units

Hatcher/Neilson is a shut down pairing that features a physical presence in Hatcher. Neilson is a solid defensive zone defenseman who can move the puck. Solid unit that should limit mistakes and make it difficult against the Leafs' forwards.

Gonchar is extremely talented offensively but he is fairly one-dimensional, I don't know if I'd go as far as calling him a liability but he's been known to be lazy from time to time. Konstantinov is solid defensively but would be much more effective with a defenseman solid in his own zone, he will have his hands full with Giants' offense and a weak defensive partner.

Advantage: Belfast

Third Units

Bilyaletdinov/Markov is not spectacular but can be relied upon for solid defensive play when they are on the ice. Markov's shot and puck-moving ability is a bonus.

Phaneuf IMO is not suitable for third-pairing duty in the ATD, he should be a spare or even demoted to the MLD. His defensive play has deteriorated and he is inconsistent. Him and Phaneuf are another poorly assembled pairing as Stanowski seems to have a similar style to Dion, out of position while rushing and trying to go for the big hit. Problematic pairing.

Advantage: Belfast

Goaltending

Tretiak is better than Thompson but Vlad will see many more shots than Tiny will. The bottom-4 defense on Toronto could leave a lot of solid chances given their less than desirable defensive play. CuJo is a better backup than Dzurilla and Moog.

Advantage: Leafs

Special Teams

PP

Actually like Chelios/Espo on the power play, you'll likely be banking on your PP unit to score a lot of goals because I don't know if your first line can get it done at ES. 2nd unit is fine.

Both Giants' units have several weapons, Lindros is the net presence on the first line to an already stacked unit and Stamkos is on the half-boards on the second unit for one-timers.

Advantage: Belfast

PK

Stanowski scares me on that first unit, he does not appear to be a solid option on the first unit given his reputation. Forwards fine all around.

Giants' PK can get the job done, Clarke is an elite PKer along with Sheppard.

Advantage: Belfast

 

[Velociraptor]

Why Belfast should defeat Toronto in a 7-game series

- Smart, tactical coach who knows how to win a championship.
- Four strong offensive lines that can work well together and create very good chances aided by the second best offensive defenseman of all-time acting as a 'fourth forward".
- Defensively solid forward corps that also includes a lot of physicality throughout.
- Defensive units that will limit scoring chances, with shut down potential and some physical defenders.
- Strong special teams units.
- Lack of chemistry on Leafs' roster, may have hard time getting things going against good defensive team.
- Weak defensive depth that could exploit scoring chances in their own zone.

Best of luck, LL.

 

[Leaf Lander]

What resources show Stanowski as a poor deman he was a 4 time all star...no answer from you yet.


Coaches Babcock has won way more the. Shero


Dye is,a accurate shooter so he could shot at the net and when a rebound occurs Esposito is there to score

kariya being such and adapt passer could so the same

My bottom
2 squads are great 2 way squads.

And my top 2 scoring lines will eat up your less talented squad.


My team has the 4 of the 5 best players in this series
With Esposito, Chelios, Lapointe and tretiak

 

[Velociraptor]

My team has the 4 of the 5 best players in this series
With Esposito, Chelios, Lapointe and tretiak

Selanne and Coffey are just spare material, hey?

 

[monster_bertuzzi]

Selanne and Coffey are just spare material, hey?

Unless Im missing something Shero has more rings than Babcock as well.

 

[Leaf Lander]

Coffey was a great skater/ rover and a horrible defenceman

Selanne would be the 6th best player


Also Babcock has a cup
2 Olympic golds
CIS championship in 1994
IIHF World CHAMPIONSHIP 2010
And more career wins then. Shero

Key leaf win:
Better coaching
Superior top end offensive talent
Excellent bottom 2 lines 2 way forwards
Lapointe Chelios Gonchar Konstantinov Stanowskii Greschner
Superior goaltending.
Tretiak trumps tiny Thompson
Killer power play and great Pk squads
I expect my team to score a few short handed goals since your first PP unit has so many forwards on it.

 

[monster_bertuzzi]

Selanne is unquestionably a better player than Guy Lapointe. You are right about Tretiak trumping Thompson, but is Tretiak even a better player than Selanne?

 

[Velociraptor]

Also Babcock has a cup
2 Olympic golds
CIS championship in 1994
IIHF World CHAMPIONSHIP 2010
And more career wins then. Shero

Shero has 4 Stanley Cup Final Appearances to Babcock's 3, with a better success rate.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

LeafLander PMed me asking me to swap Greschner in for Phaneuf, so I did that

 

[Leaf Lander]

Shero has 4 Stanley Cup Final Appearances to Babcock's 3, with a better success rate.

Didnt Shero play in a league that had 18 or less teams and for a while just 14

 

[Leaf Lander]

Selanne is unquestionably a better player than Guy Lapointe. You are right about Tretiak trumping Thompson, but is Tretiak even a better player than Selanne?

By far Tretiak can dominate a whole series

 

[Velociraptor]

Selanne is unquestionably a better player than Guy Lapointe. You are right about Tretiak trumping Thompson, but is Tretiak even a better player than Selanne?

Yeah it's certainly an incredible bias to list Lapointe as a better player than Selanne, Teemu has actually led the league in the something twice, and has a FAST over Lapointe. It's a potentially unfair comparison because of position differences, but Selanne is the more valuable and better of the two. Lapointe also played on the 70's Canadiens and his production was certainly increased by his teammates.

I'll take a player who was one of the best players in the league over a 10-year span versus a top-pairing defenseman on a dynasty.

As far as Tretiak goes, I'd say that him and Selanne are equal, as having an elite goaltender is comparable to having a game-breaking offensive forward. However, it's more how your defense will perform in front of him than him being able to dominate an entire series. That left side on the bottom two pairings could be open space for a majority of the series.

 

[Leaf Lander]

I seen Tretiak play he did things a goalie never did before. Sellane is a nice goal scorer. Who isn't horrible defensively. He is a small upgrade from Mike Gartner type

 

[Velociraptor]

I seen Tretiak play he did things a goalie never did before.

Such as???

 

[monster_bertuzzi]

I seen Tretiak play he did things a goalie never did before. Sellane is a nice goal scorer. Who isn't horrible defensively. He is a small upgrade from Mike Gartner type

You get yourself in trouble with statement's like this man. We're all well aware of Tretiak, he was a sick goalie with great reflexes - you've got the advantage in net. You're not going to convince anyone that Guy Lapointe is a better player than Coffey and Selanne...or that Selanne is just a little better than Gartner.

 

[Leaf Lander]

Great another gm agrees with me advantage in nets leafs

Get myself in trouble..with who?
Sorry I'm new lol

Btw. Lapointe was better defensively then Coffey who was a joke as a defenceman. He won Norris trophy based on points scored not points stopped. The guy was porous on defence

 

[Johnny Engine]

Really not sure why a guy who'll can skate the puck out of his own end faster and more efficiently than any other player in the league besides Orr is a "joke".

Is it because he's a defenseman, and all defensemen are supposed to play exactly the same way? Is Doug Jarvis a "joke of a forward" because he can't score?

 

[Leaf Lander]

So up never heard that Coffey was weak defensively


Research!